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South Asia Monitor
  • 6/9/2025
Aparna Rawal, researcher-analyst on the AfPak region, speaks with Col Anil Bhat (Retd.) on Pakistan's recent alliances with terror networks and their implications for regional and global security | SAM Conversation
Transcript
00:00Welcome to SAM Conversation, a program of South Asia Monitor.
00:15We are today going to look at what all connections,
00:22new connections that Pakistan has made with more terrorist groups.
00:30To discuss this, we have Ms. Aparna Rawal, Editor, The Strategic Perspective.
00:44Thank you for having me, sir.
00:48Before we get into the recent connections that Pakistan has made with the different terrorist groups or outfits,
00:58it's important to also remember most of these links that Pakistan is remaking with the terrorist groups
01:08are already existing from a long time ago.
01:11Pakistan, since the conception of India and Pakistan,
01:16has always resorted to a form of warfare, which has been to exhaust India.
01:25If you let me put it this way, that right from the time Pakistan was born in 1947,
01:33their very first war which they launched, was launched with this outsourcing,
01:41outsourcing to 25,000 tribals.
01:45But, of course, with the Pakistan army being there very much.
01:51And that has continued.
01:53You know, that in 1965 also they made use of tribals.
01:57So did they in 1971.
02:00And then, of course, once Ziaul Haq,
02:05the third dictator president,
02:07once he decided that, you know,
02:09we should go for the option of bleeding India by a thousand cuts.
02:15Then this outsourcing became institutionalized
02:18with, you know,
02:20jihadi groups which are supported
02:24and sponsored, supported
02:26and trained by Pakistan army
02:30and the inter-services intelligence.
02:32So what we understand
02:36from the way Pakistan approaches
02:39towards India,
02:41it's more in the form of like an attrition warfare.
02:44What they are doing is
02:46they're trying to exhaust India
02:47by deploying terrorist outfits
02:50which are homegrown
02:51or even foreign fighters.
02:53When we say foreign fighters,
02:55we are looking at Al-Qaeda.
02:57We know that ISI has a very strong connection
02:59with Al-Qaeda
03:00because most of its foreign fighters,
03:04the operatives,
03:05still thrive on the Pakistani soil.
03:07And this is also being backed
03:09by major networks
03:10like the Jaish-e-Mohammed,
03:12Lakshari Taiba.
03:14Yes.
03:15And most of these
03:16come together to support one another.
03:19Now, because of this attrition warfare
03:22that we are seeing,
03:23this is also one of the reasons
03:24why Pakistan is not succeeding.
03:26Because if it was a restricted area
03:29that it was trying to target
03:30or if it was trying to target
03:32a country with limited resources,
03:34maybe it would have been advantages
03:36to Pakistan.
03:38Unfortunately, that has not worked.
03:40However, Pakistan continues
03:42to pump out
03:43most of its terror outfits
03:45while trying to maintain
03:48some kind of a deniability.
03:50The deniability is that
03:52the state doesn't do this.
03:54We are doing counterterrorism.
03:55However, this is turning out
03:57to be very contradictory
03:58given that Pakistan
04:01has not even complied
04:02with anti-terrorism law,
04:05which was one of the main conditions
04:07that FATF had given Pakistan
04:10to be removed from the gray list
04:11in 2022.
04:14Hence, India is going to push a dossier
04:16which will ask FATF
04:19to re-enlist Pakistan
04:21back on the gray list.
04:23So, when we are looking...
04:25Yes.
04:28You know,
04:29after this recent launch
04:31of Operation Sindhuur,
04:33which is now...
04:34It's been a month now,
04:36you know,
04:36since it was launched.
04:39And it's had some
04:41very, very, you know,
04:43major effect of
04:44the targeting
04:45that has been achieved
04:47by Indian Army, Navy,
04:49and particularly Air Force.
04:50Indian Army and Air Force
04:51have been very, very debilitating
04:54on Pakistan's armed forces.
04:57However,
04:58I do not see the...
05:01And though India may have destroyed
05:03nine terrorist camps,
05:07there are still
05:08a number of thousands
05:09of terrorists
05:10up and about.
05:12And I don't expect
05:13Pakistan Army
05:14or the ISI
05:16or, for that matter,
05:17the state,
05:18the Pakistani state
05:20to sever their
05:21connections
05:22with these
05:23jihadi groups.
05:24Yes.
05:25That is
05:26the likelihood
05:27of how things
05:29will be
05:29because as long
05:30as Pakistan exists,
05:31its modus operandi
05:32has...
05:33now you...
05:34I am
05:35looking forward
05:37for you
05:37to bring out
05:39whether there
05:40are going to be
05:41or whether there
05:42already are
05:42some new connections.
05:44There are
05:45some new connections,
05:46but
05:47Pakistan
05:48is trying
05:49to rekindle
05:50old reconnections
05:51too
05:52because initially
05:53the problem
05:54with Pakistan
05:55has been
05:55it thrives
05:57on pushing
05:58out proxy wars
06:00through
06:00these outfits.
06:01it works
06:02with a certain
06:03element
06:03for some time.
06:05As long as
06:06the ideologies
06:07coincide,
06:09it will
06:09utilize it.
06:10But at some
06:10point,
06:11these terror
06:11outfits
06:12also move
06:13away
06:13from the
06:14ISI connection,
06:15which we could
06:15see also
06:16in the case
06:16of Taliban.
06:18Taliban
06:18was a creation
06:19of Pakistan.
06:20U.S.
06:21Actually,
06:22it's important
06:22to mention
06:24this.
06:26Until
06:271993,
06:28Pakistan
06:29was always
06:29on the
06:30designated
06:30terror list.
06:31by the
06:32U.S.
06:33But the
06:33moment
06:33Pakistan
06:34joined
06:35the war
06:35on terror,
06:36now the
06:36duplicit
06:37nature
06:37of Pakistan
06:38is this,
06:39that it
06:39takes the
06:40funds from
06:41a certain
06:41country,
06:42pretending
06:43that it's
06:43doing
06:44counter-terrorism,
06:45while it's
06:45siphoning the
06:46rest of it
06:46towards producing
06:48these outfits,
06:48who are also
06:49doing two
06:50things at
06:51one time.
06:52So we
06:52saw the
06:53creation of
06:54Taliban
06:54during this
06:55time,
06:56during the
06:57Soviet-Afghan
06:58war.
06:59Taliban
06:59moved forward
07:00into
07:01Afghanistan,
07:02they went
07:03ahead,
07:03fought.
07:05Then
07:05afterwards,
07:06when the
07:07Russians
07:07withdrew,
07:08these people
07:09returned back
07:10to Pakistan.
07:12Since,
07:13and during
07:13this time,
07:14now this is
07:15important that
07:16I'm mentioning
07:16some of these
07:17old ties,
07:18because these
07:18old ties are
07:19again getting
07:19renewed.
07:20food, so
07:21it's important
07:21to mention
07:22these also.
07:23There was
07:23a group
07:24called
07:24Sipaha
07:25Sabah,
07:27that is
07:28SSP.
07:29Sipahi
07:29Sabah,
07:30yes.
07:32The SSP
07:33is notable
07:34for having
07:35madrasas,
07:36which had
07:36also trained
07:37the Mujahideens
07:38who went
07:39to fight
07:40the Afghan
07:40war.
07:41And
07:41interesting
07:42enough,
07:43when the
07:43war was
07:44done,
07:45when these
07:45outfits,
07:46Taliban
07:48Mujahideens,
07:49when they
07:50returned back
07:50to Pakistan,
07:51they were
07:51rerouted and
07:53made to
07:53focus on
07:54India's
07:55Kashmir.
07:56And this
07:57is how it
07:58has continued
07:58ever since.
08:00Now,
08:00what we are
08:01seeing recently
08:02is that
08:03there is a
08:04re-emergence
08:05of ISKP,
08:06Islamic
08:06Khurasan
08:07in,
08:09ISIS
08:10Khurasan
08:10in Pakistan.
08:12And there
08:13have been
08:13reports of
08:14the ISI
08:15having some
08:17kind of
08:18an agreement
08:18with ISKP.
08:21They have
08:22been given
08:22some kind
08:24of a safe
08:24haven in
08:25Balochistan
08:25area,
08:26mostly in
08:28Mastung,
08:28as we
08:29have been
08:29told.
08:31ISKP
08:32is a rival
08:33group of
08:33Taliban.
08:34Taliban
08:34and Pakistan
08:36are no
08:36longer getting
08:37on good
08:38terms because
08:39of Afghan
08:40refoulement,
08:41the whole
08:42border
08:42smudges.
08:43They are
08:43on very
08:44deadly
08:44terms now.
08:44Yes.
08:46And not
08:47only that,
08:48China also
08:48had asked
08:49Taliban to
08:50ban its
08:51relations with
08:52TTP.
08:53There were
08:53reports of
08:54even Turkey
08:54not being
08:55happy,
08:56I mean,
08:56Tariqi,
08:57Taliban,
08:57Pakistan,
08:58which has a
08:59close affiliation
08:59with Taliban,
09:00Afghanistan.
09:02So because
09:03TTP has
09:04decided to
09:05wage war in
09:06Pakistan,
09:06Chinese assets
09:07are coming
09:08under threat.
09:09China had
09:10requested
09:10Taliban to
09:12separate itself
09:13from TTP,
09:13so had
09:14Pakistan,
09:14but Pakistan
09:16hasn't got
09:16any strategic
09:17depth into
09:18Afghanistan,
09:19and hence
09:19what has
09:19happened is
09:20it has
09:21started giving
09:22safe havens
09:23to the
09:24ISIS
09:24Khurasan,
09:25who is a
09:26rival group
09:27of Taliban.
09:29ISIS always
09:30wanted to
09:30have Afghanistan
09:31as a launching
09:32pad for
09:33Jihad and
09:34control the
09:34monopoly in
09:35that region.
09:36So ever
09:37since Taliban
09:38exited the
09:39war theater,
09:40we see
09:41ISKP
09:41trying to
09:43start things
09:44to discredit
09:45Taliban,
09:46because it
09:47wants the
09:47monopoly on
09:48Jihad now.
09:50Especially
09:50around the
09:51Durand line,
09:51we see like
09:52in areas of
09:53Khyber Pakhtunkhwa
09:54and all,
09:54you will see
09:55like safe havens
09:56which are being
09:56provided to
09:57also the
09:58TTP fighters,
09:59to a lot of
10:00other groups,
10:01which Pakistan
10:02has created,
10:03might not have
10:04best relations
10:05with anymore,
10:06such as the
10:07Hafiz Gul Bahadur
10:08group,
10:08so on.
10:10So we see
10:10that Pakistan
10:11in order to
10:12maintain its
10:14space in front
10:15of the rest
10:16of the
10:16Jihadist groups
10:17has made
10:18some kind
10:19of agreement
10:19with the
10:20ISIS group,
10:22the ISIS
10:22in Khurasan,
10:23not the
10:24parent ISIS,
10:25we are talking
10:25about the
10:26offshoot,
10:27ISIS Khurasan.
10:29And now
10:31we are seeing
10:31this in
10:32Balochistan
10:32area.
10:34With these
10:34people being
10:35in Balochistan,
10:36the Baloch
10:37insurgents
10:38are having
10:39difficulty
10:40because ISIS
10:40has done
10:41some kind
10:42of an
10:42agreement
10:42that it
10:44gives Pakistan
10:45what it
10:46wants while
10:46it forgets
10:47the safe
10:47haven because
10:48Taliban is
10:49already out
10:50witch hunting
10:51or killing
10:52off the
10:52ISIS groups.
10:54So last
10:55month,
10:56some of the
10:57Baloch fighters,
10:58the BLA,
10:59have also
11:00claimed
11:00attacks,
11:01responsibility
11:02of the
11:03attacks on
11:04the ISK
11:04basis,
11:06especially in
11:06Mastung.
11:07They have
11:07claimed openly
11:08that these
11:09safe havens
11:10do exist.
11:11Now,
11:12while this
11:12is going
11:12on during
11:14Operation
11:14Sindhu,
11:15the Baloch
11:15also went
11:16ahead and
11:17claimed
11:18freedom from
11:20Pakistan.
11:21And with
11:22this happening,
11:23we can
11:24safely assume
11:24that ISKP
11:26will do the
11:27bidding for
11:28Pakistan and
11:29attack the
11:30Baloch in
11:31names of
11:31like turf
11:32core that
11:33you attract
11:34us, hence
11:35we attack
11:35you.
11:37Any idea
11:37of the
11:40strength of
11:42this ISKP
11:44Khorasan?
11:47Because
11:48that's a
11:48problem.
11:50At the
11:51moment, it's
11:52very hard to
11:52predict or
11:53get the exact
11:54strength in
11:55the area
11:55because for
11:56one, people
11:57have been
11:58making claims
11:58that ISKP
11:59has been
12:00wiped out.
12:00Some people
12:01are saying
12:01the strength
12:02has been
12:02reduced, hence
12:03they have
12:03moved to
12:04the Mastung
12:05area.
12:06Plus, what
12:07has happened
12:07is most
12:09of the
12:09terror outfits
12:10normally do
12:11not have
12:12the same
12:12cadre or
12:13the individuals
12:14from that
12:15outfits.
12:15There are
12:16a lot of
12:17foreign
12:18fighters that
12:19come join
12:20the outfit
12:20temporarily
12:21under the
12:22banner.
12:23They will
12:23carry out
12:24the operations
12:24under the
12:25banner, but
12:26that doesn't
12:26mean that
12:27they are ISKP.
12:28So it's
12:28very hard to
12:29determine exactly
12:30how many
12:31are a
12:32part of
12:33that at
12:33this point.
12:34But we
12:35do know
12:35that in
12:37order to
12:37counter
12:39Taliban or
12:40to counter
12:41TTP,
12:42Baloch
12:42militants or
12:44the SRA,
12:46we know
12:46that Baloch
12:47have come
12:47up with
12:48the BRAS,
12:49which is
12:50the umbrella
12:50network of
12:51all the
12:51militants
12:53and insurgents.
12:54it has
12:55now transformed
12:55into Baloch
12:56National
12:57Army, which
12:58is going
12:58to be a
12:59bigger threat
12:59for Pakistan.
13:01And
13:01sometimes
13:02over the
13:03time period
13:03what has
13:04happened is
13:05the human
13:06intelligence
13:08and even
13:09the networks
13:10of the
13:10Baloch
13:10have increased
13:12drastically.
13:12Even the
13:13tactical warfare
13:14has improved
13:15quite a bit.
13:16And other
13:18groups such
13:18as the
13:19Sindhu
13:19Revolutionary
13:20Army,
13:20even TTPs,
13:22sometimes they
13:23join forces
13:24to fight
13:24the same
13:25common enemy
13:26which is
13:26the Pakistani
13:27administration
13:28and the
13:28military.
13:29So with
13:30this going
13:30down,
13:31we are
13:32going to
13:32now see
13:33ISKP
13:34probably
13:34coming into
13:34the forefront
13:35because they
13:37have already
13:37issued a
13:39warning to
13:40the Baloch
13:40saying that
13:41it will
13:42spare no
13:43one.
13:43This could
13:44also affect
13:45the Baloch
13:45freedom
13:46movement.
13:47And we
13:48can expect
13:48that because
13:49ISIS,
13:50Khorasan,
13:50is known
13:51to attack
13:52even the
13:53civilians.
13:54While the
13:54Baloch
13:55insurgents,
13:56they try
13:57to not
13:57attack the
13:58civilians.
13:59They target
13:59very specific
14:00groups like
14:01the military
14:02establishments,
14:03the government
14:03establishments,
14:04so on.
14:05This is not
14:06the case with
14:07ISKP.
14:08And we
14:08know that
14:09Pakistan will
14:10employ them
14:11to carry
14:12up further
14:13attacks.
14:14Also because
14:15the Chinese
14:15threats are,
14:17I mean,
14:17the Chinese
14:18are threatened
14:18by the attacks
14:19from the
14:19Baloch
14:20and so
14:20on.
14:22So with
14:23this happening,
14:24now we
14:24can safely
14:25assume that
14:26ISKP will
14:27also have
14:28some kind
14:28of attack
14:30mode on
14:30India as
14:31well.
14:32Not too
14:32long ago,
14:33some of the
14:34commanders from
14:35ISKP have
14:36released a
14:36statement that
14:37India will
14:38fight a
14:38two-front
14:38war.
14:39One is
14:40going to be
14:40from the
14:41Jammu-Kashmir
14:41side, the
14:42other one
14:42will be
14:43from the
14:43northeast.
14:43They had
14:44released
14:45pamphlets
14:46asking the
14:47Muslims of
14:48India to
14:49wage jihad in
14:50these areas
14:51of northeast
14:52and we're
14:53seeing Jammu
14:54and Kashmir.
14:55So we
14:55know that
14:56ISIS is
14:58definitely going
14:59to be backed
14:59by ISI.
15:01And the
15:01agreement under
15:02which they
15:03had done
15:03this transaction
15:05was called
15:05the Dabori
15:06Agreement.
15:07The leaders
15:08of ISKP
15:09were provided
15:10safe havens
15:11by the
15:11Pakistani
15:12government.
15:12And the
15:14word Dabori
15:15comes from
15:15the village
15:16where the
15:17leadership of
15:17the ISKP
15:18hails from.
15:20So hence
15:21the Dabori
15:21Agreement that
15:22came into
15:23the picture.
15:24Not only
15:25that, the
15:27former
15:28core commander
15:29of
15:29Pakistan,
15:31also known
15:33as
15:33he has
15:35already made
15:37a claim
15:37a year ago
15:38that since
15:39the Dabori
15:40Agreement that
15:41has come
15:41into the
15:41picture,
15:42Pakistan
15:43will now
15:44also use
15:45the ISKP
15:45cadre against
15:46Afghanistan
15:47and carry
15:48out Kashmir
15:49style
15:50infiltration
15:51in Afghanistan.
15:52This is
15:52him claiming
15:53that this
15:55is exactly
15:55what happened
15:56in Kashmir
15:57and Pakistan
15:58as usual
15:59under the
16:00military fire
16:01tries to
16:02push its
16:03terror outfits
16:04into the
16:05other side.
16:07So this
16:07is something
16:07that has
16:08been confirmed
16:09also by the
16:10core commander
16:11from TTP.
16:12now while
16:14this is
16:15happening,
16:15we are
16:15also looking
16:16at earlier
16:18this year
16:18on Jan
16:191st, the
16:20ISI chief
16:21Asim Malik,
16:23he had
16:24visited
16:26Tajikistan
16:28to convince
16:29the president
16:30of Tajikistan
16:31to fight
16:32the Taliban
16:33because a
16:34certain outfit
16:35that exists
16:35and operates
16:37from the
16:37Afghan soil
16:38wants to
16:39overthrow the
16:40Tajikistan
16:41government.
16:43So in
16:44such a case,
16:45we can see
16:46a lot of
16:47new alliances
16:48building up
16:49with even
16:50like the
16:51Tajikistan
16:52to counter
16:52Taliban.
16:54But at the
16:55moment,
16:55we can also
16:56state that
16:56a lot of
16:57if we have
16:59to predict
16:59something,
17:01we can say
17:01that a lot
17:02of these
17:03groups,
17:04even the
17:05Chinese fighters
17:05that come
17:06from China,
17:07the ones
17:07from the
17:08Gansui group,
17:09the ones
17:09from the
17:09Hui group,
17:11even the
17:11Uyghur fighters,
17:13these individuals
17:15were given
17:15safe haven
17:16by the
17:17ISKP
17:18in the past
17:19also.
17:20Now we have
17:21safe havens
17:22given to the
17:22ISKP in the
17:23Mastung-Balochistan
17:25area.
17:25So we might
17:26see even the
17:26Chinese fighters
17:27coming here.
17:28These Chinese
17:29fighters,
17:30according to
17:31reports,
17:32they were used
17:33to get trained
17:34in Afghanistan
17:34by ISKP
17:35individuals,
17:37and then
17:38they were
17:39migrated to
17:40Turkey for
17:41further training,
17:43then exported
17:44back to
17:46whichever area
17:47of target.
17:47you know,
17:49there is
17:49something which
17:51I feel we
17:53should be
17:53prepared for,
17:56that after
17:56the kind of
17:57warlocking that
17:57Pakistan army
17:58and force
18:00have taken,
18:02they are bound
18:03to retaliate,
18:05and for
18:06retaliation,
18:07they are
18:08probably looking
18:09for any
18:10and every
18:10kind of
18:11reinforcement
18:14that is
18:15possible for
18:16them.
18:16that is
18:20for certain
18:20because while
18:21Operation
18:22Sindhur was
18:23also going
18:23on,
18:24Pakistan has
18:26been trying
18:26to work on
18:27its alliances
18:27with Azerbaijan,
18:29with Turkey,
18:30the whole
18:30trifecta that
18:32has been
18:32working together
18:33because you
18:34see that
18:34all the
18:36three countries
18:37have an
18:38similar way
18:41of talking,
18:41especially when
18:42it comes to
18:42UN.
18:43The narratives
18:44are similar.
18:45Not only
18:45that,
18:46even a
18:47couple of
18:48years ago,
18:49a Greek
18:50publication
18:50also mentioned
18:51how Erdogan's
18:54private army,
18:56the Sadat,
18:57we call it
18:58the private
18:58army because
18:59it does the
18:59bidding for
19:00the Turkish
19:01president.
19:05So with this,
19:06we know
19:06Sadat had a
19:07meeting of
19:08all the
19:09jihadists at
19:10one point,
19:10and it
19:11talked about
19:12sending
19:13fighters from
19:14Syria,
19:14its own
19:15personal
19:15fighters,
19:16which were
19:16trained during
19:17the Syrian
19:17war also,
19:19to move
19:20them from
19:20those areas
19:22to Pakistan
19:22area.
19:23Turkish
19:24intelligence has
19:25been deployed
19:25across the
19:26border to
19:27keep tabs on
19:28what's happening
19:28in the Kashmir
19:29area.
19:30There's
19:30indoctrination
19:31going on
19:31constantly.
19:33And we
19:34know Turkey
19:35has been
19:35helping out
19:36Pakistan with
19:37heavy funding
19:37as well.
19:38Azair Raejan
19:39has also
19:40been an
19:41equal partner
19:42when it
19:43comes to
19:43supporting
19:43Pakistan.
19:45So a lot
19:45of foreign
19:46fighters
19:46expected to
19:48be recycled
19:49and sent
19:50back to
19:51Pakistan so
19:52they can
19:53achieve their
19:53certain
19:53targeted
19:54areas.
19:56And Pakistan
19:56does have a
19:57history of
19:59blurring the
20:00difference between
20:00what it
20:01considers
20:01us to
20:02be a
20:03fighter,
20:03a terrorist
20:04and a
20:05military
20:05personnel.
20:06Even in
20:07the 1971
20:08war, we
20:09had the
20:10SSP.
20:11They had
20:11trained these
20:12fighters called
20:13the Rajakar
20:14fighters, which
20:16were utilized
20:16in Bangladesh,
20:17which were
20:18responsible for
20:20the genocide
20:20of the
20:21Bangladeshis.
20:22And these
20:24personnel were
20:25considered to
20:26be a part of
20:26the Pakistani
20:27army.
20:28So now the
20:29differentiation
20:29between who
20:30is a terrorist
20:30and who is
20:31a military
20:31personnel, that
20:33line has
20:34long been
20:35forgotten.
20:38And with
20:39this also
20:40going down,
20:41now why is
20:42it important
20:42that India
20:43took out
20:44these bases,
20:45the terror
20:45camps, the
20:46bases in
20:47Operation
20:47Sindhu?
20:48People think
20:49it's just
20:49hosting
20:49terrorists, but
20:50nobody is
20:50actually considering
20:51the fact, the
20:52amount of
20:53training and
20:54the vast,
20:55vast compounds
20:57that these
20:58camps have.
20:58these are not
20:59just madrasas
21:00which are
21:01indoctrinating
21:02people.
21:02These are
21:03areas which
21:04are training
21:05fighters.
21:07According to
21:07Amir Rana, a
21:08Pakistani
21:09analyst, he
21:10also mentioned
21:11that it takes
21:12about 18
21:12months for
21:14these
21:14mujahideen to
21:15be created.
21:16The first
21:17month is spent
21:17indoctrinating
21:19these mujahideen.
21:19the next
21:20three months
21:20is again
21:21further
21:21brainwashing
21:22indoctrination
21:24followed by
21:25some amount
21:26of military
21:28training, which
21:30will be for
21:30six months.
21:31This happens
21:33in six
21:33stages to
21:34the point
21:35where they
21:36even train
21:36their fighters
21:37how to use
21:38a tank.
21:39This is a
21:41rare situation
21:42because they
21:43don't have the
21:44resources to
21:45do it, but
21:46we know that
21:47most of the
21:48fighters are
21:48trained in
21:49different
21:50weaponry.
21:52Handheld,
21:53shoulder,
21:54firing weapons,
21:55things like
21:55that.
21:57Yes, so it
21:58takes about
21:5818 months to
21:59do this and
22:00for them to
22:00do this in
22:02such a vast
22:02amount.
22:04Imran Khan in
22:042020 stated
22:06that when he
22:07went to the
22:08US, he
22:09openly stated
22:10that there
22:10were 30,000
22:11to 40,000
22:12terrorists
22:14still flying
22:14inside Pakistan
22:16and it is
22:17impossible for
22:18any intelligence
22:19of any
22:19nation to
22:20not have
22:21an idea
22:21of so
22:22much
22:22development
22:23within their
22:24own country.
22:26Osama bin
22:27Laden was
22:27also captured
22:28from an
22:29area which
22:30was very
22:30close to
22:31the Pakistani
22:32military
22:33academy.
22:35He thrived
22:35over there.
22:36He's been
22:37funding LED,
22:38JEM, so on.
22:40It's impossible
22:41for all these
22:42developments to
22:42happen without
22:43the knowledge
22:44of ISI.
22:45And we
22:46know that
22:46JEM,
22:47Lashkar,
22:48they're all
22:49the products
22:49of ISI at
22:50the end of
22:51the day.
22:52In fact,
22:52a lot of
22:53ISI
22:53commanders have
22:56been training
22:56these groups.
22:57I don't
23:00see any
23:00possibility of
23:01any activity
23:04without the
23:06knowledge or
23:07the active
23:08involvement of
23:09the ISI.
23:11Yes.
23:12The entire
23:13doctrine has
23:14been based
23:14on, you
23:15know,
23:16deniability
23:17by using
23:18proxy wars.
23:18We all
23:19know it's a
23:19failing state
23:20without the
23:20money required.
23:22So,
23:23employing some
23:23fedains to
23:24carry out
23:25a tax is a
23:25lot more
23:26cheaper than
23:26carrying out
23:27a full
23:27frontal war
23:28and being
23:28held responsible
23:29when your
23:30economy is
23:30falling.
23:31And not
23:33to mention,
23:34Pakistan is
23:35known to
23:36allocate 18%
23:37of its
23:38general budget
23:39to its
23:40defense
23:41development,
23:42which is a
23:42lot more
23:43than any
23:44affected
23:45countries due
23:47to conflict.
23:48The normal
23:49average range
23:50would be
23:50like 12%
23:51to 14%
23:53of allocation
23:54to the
23:54defense budget.
23:56But what
23:56Pakistan does
23:57is it
23:58siphons the
23:59money that
23:59comes in for
24:00the development
24:01program of
24:01the country
24:02to the
24:02defense budget,
24:03which is
24:04being indirectly
24:05used to
24:06sponsor fund
24:07terrorists and
24:08to provide an
24:09attack on
24:10India.
24:10It's not
24:11anything to
24:12do with the
24:13development of
24:14the nation.
24:14And it is a
24:15sinking ship.
24:16It's not going
24:17to stop.
24:18It will align,
24:19realign, and
24:20reposition itself
24:21with the terror
24:22outfits to
24:22carry out a
24:23war, thinking
24:24that it will
24:25exhaust India
24:26because this is
24:28one way of
24:29attrition.
24:32India better
24:33not get
24:34exhausted.
24:35Simple.
24:36India better
24:36not get
24:37exhausted because
24:38we have to
24:39ensure that
24:41we have our
24:43powders.
24:44There is
24:44enough dry
24:45powder with
24:46us to deal
24:47with Pakistan
24:49on the
24:50terrorist level
24:53and on the
24:54borders.
24:56You can't
24:57rule out the
24:58possibility.
25:00And in any
25:01case, as far
25:02as China is
25:03concerned, China
25:04is enemy number
25:04one.
25:05But it
25:06conveniently
25:07uses Pakistan
25:10as and when
25:12possible, you
25:14know, it
25:15has been doing
25:16so constantly,
25:18right, you
25:18know, continuously.
25:21Even now, now
25:23it will probably
25:23look for more
25:24opportunities to
25:25do so.
25:26Yes, and it's
25:27interesting also
25:28because China is
25:29also one of the
25:30countries that
25:31blocked the
25:32banning of the
25:33resistance front
25:34at the UN.
25:36Yes.
25:37When the fact
25:38is the resistance
25:39front had
25:39openly made a
25:40clean, literally
25:41after the
25:43attack, that
25:44it was
25:45orchestrated by
25:46them.
25:46However, the
25:47handlers in
25:47Pakistan might
25:48not have been
25:48too happy and
25:49hence, they
25:51retracted their
25:51statement.
25:52But the
25:53statement was
25:54out for
25:54everyone to
25:55see and we
25:56know it
25:56was an
25:57offshoot of
25:58L.E.T.
26:00Plus, which
26:01country gives
26:02military honors
26:03to terrorists
26:05and especially
26:07during their
26:08funerals are
26:09seen, you
26:09know, with
26:10the terrorists
26:10because at
26:11the end of
26:11the day,
26:12these same
26:12terrorists are
26:13nothing but
26:13assets of
26:14Pakistan, which
26:16have been
26:16prescribed by
26:17us.
26:18They are
26:18force
26:19multipliers for
26:21Pakistan,
26:23the Pakistan
26:23army.
26:24They are
26:25doing the
26:27Pakistan army's
26:28job, they
26:28are force
26:29multipliers,
26:29they are
26:30outsourced,
26:31you know,
26:31elements,
26:32whatever, and
26:33their coffins
26:35will be covered
26:36with the
26:37Pakistani
26:37flag.
26:38And their
26:40funerals will
26:41be attended
26:44by all the
26:47senior brass of
26:48Pakistan army.
26:50Yeah, very
26:50true.
26:51That's true.
26:52only thing that
26:53remains is they
26:54have not been
26:55given ranks.
26:56You might as
26:56well give them
26:57ranks also now.
26:59Who knows, they
26:59may probably have
27:00ranks that we
27:01are not aware
27:01of.
27:02They may even
27:04be having
27:04ranks.
27:04Anyway, thank
27:10you, Aparna, for
27:12a lot of
27:13inputs that
27:14have come from
27:16you.
27:17And we
27:18will need to
27:19keep a watch on
27:20this particular
27:21aspect very
27:24sharply, because
27:26it's also time
27:28for Pakistan
27:29to be a
27:31little more
27:31Pakistan army
27:33and the
27:34armed forces.
27:34to be a
27:35little more
27:35desperate.
27:38So, they
27:40are looking for
27:41more force
27:44multipliers, more
27:46outsourced
27:46elements.
27:48That you
27:49cannot at all
27:50rule out the
27:51possibility.
27:52That's a
27:52certainty, in
27:52fact.
27:56Enjoy.
27:56Thank you very
27:57much.
27:57Enjoy.

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