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Dem Senators Take Turns Tearing Into 'Embarrassed' GOP's 'Magic Numbers' In Big Beautiful Bill
Forbes Breaking News
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6/30/2025
During Senate floor debate on Sunday, Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-OR), Sen. Chris Van Hollen (D-MD), Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse (D-RI), and Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA) ripped into the Senate GOP's version of the Big Beautiful Bill and procedural efforts.
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00:00
Would the senator from Maryland yield for a question?
00:04
I will.
00:05
I found it very interesting that you pointed out that these tax provisions for the middle class,
00:11
no tax on tips, is phased out.
00:14
And no tax on overtime is phased out.
00:17
And what you're saying, I believe, is that when they put into this bill that a tax break is ending,
00:25
they're saying that it doesn't cost any more in the following years.
00:31
So they are certainly saying that their current policy baseline that they want us to make believe about
00:39
would say that this wouldn't cost them.
00:43
In other words, if they extended this, it wouldn't cost anything.
00:47
It is interesting to note, not only does that expose the fraud behind the current policy baseline,
00:54
but they made a very deliberate choice.
00:58
Even though they now say that they can make these tax cuts permanent and still comply with the rules,
01:04
they decided to make the tax cuts for very rich people permanent.
01:09
But even though they say it's not going to cost anything anymore to provide tax cuts with no tax on tips,
01:17
they're phasing those out.
01:18
And there are other, all of these areas are where President Trump made promises
01:23
that he was going to take care of some working people.
01:26
Well, man, those go way fast.
01:29
Tax cuts for the rich, they go on for not just the full 10 years,
01:32
but they keep going, which is why this is a violation of the entire reconciliation process.
01:36
So I find two things very interesting.
01:38
They're saying if something was in the law that they passed in 2017 and it expires,
01:46
they're pretending it doesn't expire and therefore extending it doesn't cost anything.
01:51
But in their own bill, when they say a provision expires,
01:54
they say, no, it really does die and therefore we're saving money in the years after.
01:59
How is those two things possibly consistent?
02:03
Clearly they're not.
02:05
I mean, this is literally magical thinking.
02:07
This is why Republican Congressman Schweithart called this,
02:12
or Chip Roy called this fairy dust
02:14
and why the Congress from Arizona said this was pure intellectual and economic fraud.
02:22
That's what it is.
02:23
That's the bottom line.
02:25
Well, I really thank the senator from Maryland also pointing out
02:27
that President Trump, he did, when he was campaigning,
02:31
say he was fighting for ordinary families.
02:34
But at his inauguration,
02:35
who did he have standing behind him?
02:38
Not champions for health care or champions for housing,
02:42
certainly not champions for nutrition or education,
02:47
but in fact a series of like five or six billionaires.
02:51
And now you're telling me that in this bill,
02:53
and I want to make sure the American people understand this,
02:55
the provisions that were sweeteners to say we were helping working people
03:00
are being phased out,
03:02
but they're keeping all the tax breaks for billionaires.
03:05
Well, you're right.
03:06
You know, it was right down this hall, actually,
03:08
that President Trump was sworn in,
03:11
and he said it was going to be a new golden age for working people.
03:15
Well, as you're pointing out,
03:18
and this chart clearly shows,
03:20
and their own budget reveals,
03:22
it's clearly a golden age for billionaires and people who make a lot of money.
03:26
And in this bill,
03:28
they make sure that that golden age for very rich people goes on forever.
03:33
They had a few little crumbs that they were throwing for a little while,
03:37
we can see,
03:38
to others,
03:39
but just for a little while
03:40
in just small amounts compared to the golden age for the billionaires.
03:45
Well, I must say my impression is,
03:49
and I hope you'll correct me if I'm wrong,
03:52
is that the Republicans are embarrassed
03:56
by the fact that they're proposing a bill
04:00
that creates over $3 trillion in debt in 10 years,
04:03
and over $30 trillion over 30 years,
04:06
and that the vast bulk of it goes to billionaires,
04:08
and so they want to say,
04:09
we're so embarrassed,
04:11
because we mentioned fiscal responsibility
04:14
when we were running for office,
04:16
we're going to get the budget under control,
04:18
and they're doing the opposite,
04:19
and they're embarrassed that they're doing this,
04:22
these cuts in programs
04:23
to fund tax breaks for billionaires,
04:25
cutting regular health care,
04:28
16 million people losing health care
04:30
for tax breaks for billionaires,
04:32
that as you point out,
04:33
go on and on and on,
04:35
actually permanent.
04:36
For Paul, I would certainly love to yield
04:40
to my colleague from Rhode Island.
04:42
When I was budget chairman,
04:45
and we were trying to focus, for instance,
04:48
on the impending economic nightmare
04:52
coming our way through climate-caused
04:55
property insurance failures,
04:56
what I would get
04:58
is nonstop regular lectures
05:01
from Republicans on the Budget Committee
05:03
about how we had to take responsibility
05:05
for the deficit,
05:07
we had to reduce the debt,
05:09
nothing else mattered as much,
05:11
it was absolutely vital.
05:13
And now, of course,
05:13
we see that at their very first shot,
05:16
with the power to do anything
05:17
through their majority
05:18
and using reconciliation,
05:21
they're raising the debt,
05:22
they're raising the deficit,
05:24
and not by little,
05:25
but by trillions.
05:26
And I'm wondering if,
05:28
in your time as chairman,
05:29
or perhaps in Senator Murray's time
05:31
on the committee,
05:33
or perhaps in Senator Van Hollen's time
05:37
over on the House Committee,
05:38
you were favored with
05:39
such constant lecturing
05:43
by Republicans
05:44
about the debt and the deficit
05:46
and how credible that all seems right now.
05:49
I'll yield Senator Murray.
05:50
I thank the senator for his question
05:53
because it's just stunning to me
05:55
that the vast majority of debate,
05:58
in fact, all the debate
06:00
that came from Republicans
06:01
at the time I was chair
06:03
of the Budget Committee
06:04
trying to put forward
06:05
a smart budget
06:07
for the United States of America,
06:09
the only thing they talked about
06:10
was debt and deficit.
06:12
The only challenge they made to us
06:14
was debt and deficit.
06:15
The only time we tried to do anything
06:18
for child care,
06:19
for health care,
06:20
they threw the debt at us.
06:22
So it is pretty stunning to me
06:24
that now that they need to raise the debt
06:28
for giving tax breaks
06:30
to the very rich people
06:31
who stood behind the president
06:32
at his inauguration,
06:35
then they play with the numbers
06:37
and pretend it's not real
06:39
and a trillion all of a sudden becomes zero
06:41
and I'm using some rule
06:43
you've never heard of
06:44
to try and pretend that this isn't real.
06:46
It's fairy dust.
06:50
I just want to say
06:52
to answer the question
06:53
from the senator from Rhode Island
06:55
and pick up on what my colleagues have said
06:57
that when I was the senior Democrat,
06:59
the ranking member
07:00
on the House Budget Committee,
07:02
Paul Ryan was the chairman
07:04
of the committee.
07:05
And look,
07:06
we disagreed on many things.
07:08
We agreed on many things.
07:09
We both agreed
07:10
that we should get our deficits
07:12
and debt under control.
07:13
We had different ideas
07:14
on how to do it.
07:16
He wanted to privatize Medicare.
07:18
We wanted to close tax breaks
07:20
for the rich.
07:21
But we wanted to close tax breaks
07:23
for the rich.
07:24
But the reality is
07:25
that the holy grail,
07:27
I mean,
07:28
the only guiding North Star
07:31
for Republicans at that time
07:33
was we've got to bring down
07:34
deficits and debt.
07:36
This is not
07:37
that Republican Party.
07:39
Not in any way,
07:42
shape,
07:43
or form.
07:44
They clearly don't give a damn.
07:45
In fact,
07:46
they are worried,
07:47
as we can see,
07:48
that the American people
07:50
still care,
07:51
which is why they want to
07:52
engage in this
07:53
fraudulent scheme.
07:55
But I'll just close on this.
07:55
I remember one of those years.
07:59
I think it was the,
08:00
I believe it was the 2012
08:01
Republican Convention.
08:03
They even put up a debt clock.
08:05
They put up a debt clock
08:06
at the convention.
08:08
I can't find it.
08:09
Right?
08:09
I'm looking under my desk
08:11
for the debt clock here
08:13
because Republicans
08:14
seem to have hidden it away
08:16
forever.
08:17
They want to wish it away.
08:19
That's what they're telling us.
08:21
But the bill
08:22
actually is required
08:24
to raise the debt limit
08:26
by $5 trillion.
08:30
So in reality,
08:32
there's a huge hit
08:34
to our debt,
08:35
huge additions
08:36
to our deficit,
08:37
and it makes me
08:39
a little bit frustrated
08:40
to think back
08:42
to all those lectures
08:43
that I had to receive
08:45
as budget chairman,
08:47
which the Center
08:47
from Maryland witnessed
08:48
as a longtime member
08:49
of the Senate Budget Committee,
08:50
which the ranking member
08:53
witnessed in his time
08:54
on the Budget Committee,
08:55
and which Senator Murray
08:56
experienced when she
08:58
chaired the Budget Committee.
08:59
We have been lectured
09:00
to death
09:02
by our colleagues,
09:04
and at the very first instance
09:08
when they had the power
09:09
to do something about it,
09:10
they went 180 the other direction
09:12
and are cranking
09:14
the national debt
09:16
in order to give
09:17
big benefits
09:18
to the rich people
09:20
who fund their campaigns.
09:22
And the Center
09:22
would be here for a question,
09:23
and I know we need
09:24
to move on here.
09:25
I just want to add one thing.
09:26
It's not just
09:27
that it's going to be debt.
09:29
It's the cost to families
09:31
because this debt
09:32
they are putting in place.
09:33
I would ask the chair
09:35
of the Budget Committee now,
09:36
as he knows,
09:36
as I do,
09:37
people's houses
09:38
are going to cost more
09:39
because their mortgage interest rates
09:40
are going to go up.
09:41
Their car's interest rate
09:42
is going to go up.
09:43
This is not just magic numbers
09:45
sitting out there
09:45
pretending they're not being.
09:47
Real families are going to feel
09:48
the cost of this debt
09:50
and this deficit.
09:51
I really appreciate that point
09:52
with my colleague
09:54
from Washington State
09:55
because in this bill
09:57
it creates so much
09:59
necessitated borrowing
10:01
that CBO estimates
10:03
that that borrowing
10:04
will cause interest rates
10:06
to go up.
10:07
And when interest rates
10:08
grow up for the Treasury,
10:09
it goes up on your car loan,
10:11
on your adjustable rate,
10:12
a mortgage on your house,
10:13
and just in general,
10:15
these are costs
10:17
that are borne
10:18
by ordinary families.
10:21
And I find it very interesting
10:23
because the Republicans
10:24
were demanding
10:25
what they called
10:26
the dynamic score,
10:28
saying,
10:28
well, won't these cuts
10:29
produce such a great economy
10:32
that it will kind of lift all boats
10:34
and produce more revenue
10:36
and maybe the deficit
10:37
won't be as bad.
10:38
Here's what Congressional Budget Office
10:40
found.
10:41
Again, that's the nonpartisan,
10:43
honest broker numbers.
10:44
They found that because
10:46
of the interest rates rising
10:49
as a result of this massive
10:50
sea of red ink
10:51
that necessitates massive borrowing,
10:55
that in fact,
10:56
those rising interest rates
10:57
will hurt the economy.
10:59
So there's no dynamic score
11:01
that produces,
11:03
oh, well,
11:03
it isn't so bad after all.
11:05
No, it's the opposite.
11:06
And in fact,
11:07
that dynamic argument
11:08
has always been wrong.
11:10
And we are looking
11:11
at the folks
11:12
who lectured,
11:13
my colleague from Rhode Island,
11:14
and I sat through
11:14
many of those lectures as well,
11:16
and I went,
11:17
in my head,
11:18
I went,
11:18
wait a minute,
11:19
aren't these folks
11:20
who did the massive
11:21
ocean of red ink
11:22
in the 2001 Bush tax bill?
11:25
Aren't these the same folks
11:26
that produced
11:27
a massive ocean of ink
11:29
in another tax bill
11:30
two years later?
11:31
Aren't they the same ones
11:32
that in 2017
11:33
did a massive ocean
11:35
of red ink,
11:36
and now they're doing it again?
11:37
How could they possibly
11:39
be putting themselves forward
11:40
as deficit hawks
11:42
or debt hawks?
11:43
Not to mention
11:44
that they cheered on
11:45
two adventures
11:47
that were a huge tragedy
11:49
for the United States of America,
11:51
trying to occupy Afghanistan
11:53
and going to war
11:53
in Iraq,
11:54
which together
11:55
added $8 trillion
11:56
to our debt.
11:59
And,
12:00
if you take a look
12:01
at this chart,
12:02
every time
12:03
there is a Republican
12:04
administration,
12:05
the last deficit
12:07
while they're in office
12:08
compared to their
12:08
first deficit
12:10
goes up.
12:11
For Clinton,
12:12
it went down.
12:13
That's fiscal responsibility.
12:14
For George W. Bush,
12:16
first term,
12:17
it went up.
12:18
For Obama,
12:19
it went down.
12:19
In other words,
12:20
the Democratic presidents,
12:23
time after time
12:24
after time,
12:25
Clinton,
12:25
Obama,
12:26
Biden,
12:26
they reduced the deficits
12:28
while they were in office,
12:29
and the Republican presidents,
12:31
while they were in office,
12:32
every single time
12:33
increased the deficits.
12:35
So,
12:35
none of us
12:36
want to hear
12:37
any more talk
12:38
about fiscal responsibility
12:39
from across the aisle.
12:40
You want to be
12:40
fiscally responsible?
12:42
Vote no on this bill,
12:43
because this bill
12:44
takes and fires
12:46
16 million people
12:48
off of health care
12:49
to finance those tax breaks
12:50
for billionaires.
12:52
This bill
12:53
says 4 million children
12:54
will go hungry
12:55
to finance tax breaks
12:57
for billionaires.
12:58
This bill
12:59
is families lose
13:01
and billionaires win,
13:03
and the debt
13:04
goes up,
13:05
endangering our ability
13:06
to do basic programs
13:08
for the entire
13:08
next generation.
13:09
It is wrong
13:11
on every count.
13:12
And I think collectively,
13:14
we urge our colleagues
13:15
to honor the argument
13:17
they've made over time
13:18
that, in fact,
13:19
they were concerned
13:20
about the deficit.
13:21
They were concerned
13:22
about American families.
13:23
Because if you are
13:24
concerned about the deficit
13:25
and debt,
13:26
if you are concerned
13:27
about families,
13:28
you must vote no
13:29
on this bill.
13:30
Thank you,
13:30
Mr. President.
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