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00:00Listen, before we get into anything, I think a lot of the fans would be expecting me to ask about the fact that you are expecting all this, because you posted about this on social media yesterday.
00:14Massive congratulations. But yeah, talk to me more about this big news from the Bordens.
00:19Thank you so much. Yeah, it's just something we talked about during the race, that the race was like the one big thing we wanted to do before we started this journey.
00:27And we're so just like lucky and grateful that we got back. We enjoyed our summer. And then in October, we found out we were pregnant.
00:34And it was one of those things we kind of wanted to keep to ourselves for a little bit and just enjoy, watch the season play out, watch us talk about how we wanted to do this after.
00:42And then at the end, be like, we did it. And this is our next journey. So we're really excited.
00:47That makes me so, so happy. Well, let's talk about what got you on this journey in the first place.
00:52I would love to hear from you two. What was your history with the amazing race?
00:57And what made one or both of you decide to make that leap quite literally off the couch from viewer to team?
01:05Yeah. First of all, Mike, I gotta say, it was so cool meeting you yesterday.
01:09I know!
01:10It's just like, wow, I don't watch the YouTube videos, so I don't have a face to the voice.
01:14I listen to podcasts. I love podcasts. So seeing you and hearing your voice and Jess was like, I was like, oh my gosh, it's so loud.
01:20I do have a face for podcasting. Yeah, now you're kidding.
01:23I was like, oh my gosh, the physical presence is good. So it's so, so cool.
01:27So our past with amazing race, we both grew up watching it.
01:30So like when we were kids, I mean, I grew up watching Survivor and the Amazing Race and she grew up watching Survivor and the Amazing Race.
01:36And that was it. And like, I never thought I'd go on the Amazing Race ever because I am the world's worst person at directions.
01:43So I never even applied. I never thought there was any chance I would lose day one. I'm horrible directions.
01:48Because I meet Alyssa, we fall in love. We watch the Amazing Race together.
01:52And then we're just like talking about like what we would do on the season. Oh, this and this.
01:57And I'm like, yeah, but I'm horrible directions. And she's like, I would navigate.
01:59And like, you know, that's what you do with reality TV. You watch and put yourself in people's shoes.
02:03You're like, how would I do this differently? Would I do this better or worse? It's so fun that way.
02:07And then as we're doing that, I'm starting to realize like we should we should go for this.
02:11Like we should apply. And and she was like, no, like we shouldn't apply.
02:15Like that's insane. And I was like, oh, let's be insane. Let's go for it. Let's do it.
02:18And it worked out. And it's a dream come true for both of us.
02:21Yeah. And once we decided we wanted to do it, it was like we had to do it.
02:26Like it was our obsession. And I mean, I feel like the luckiest two people in the world to get to have done it because it was everything we wanted it to be and so much more.
02:35And to do it together, to have these memories forever, to get to share this with our kids someday.
02:39Like it's so special. If we just had a million dollars now, but I'm waiting for a Venmo.
02:43There you go. Exactly. Jack and Carson, you put that request out.
02:46I did. Well, let's fast forward to the end here, because I don't want to say this last leg was uncharacteristic for the two of you,
02:54because, again, an edit sort of is never a massive representation of who you are.
02:59But it's so intriguing that I think throughout the race, we saw a lot of, you know, incredibly consistent behavior from the two of you, both in performance, in temperament, et cetera.
03:09But like, I don't know, a moment that's a slice of that is that Josiah, like your usual chipper persona, you were incredibly just on pins and needles the entire leg.
03:18Where did this mood come from? Was it a shift in mood?
03:21And was it prompted along by just the stakes of it, the way the leg was going?
03:25Yeah, Mike, it was a massive shift in mood.
03:28And it was, and Alyssa noticed it.
03:30And I tell her on the train track, and they actually show it.
03:33I say, I'm just so tense.
03:35And I felt that the entire leg.
03:37And we had an hour and a half lead.
03:39And I just felt tense the entire time.
03:41And I'll tell you what, I know Alyssa so well.
03:43She is a competitor at heart.
03:44And she's like, extremely confident, and rightfully so.
03:48But I know the shift of momentum that can happen in sports, and like in anything, when you have like an hour and a half lead, and if someone shows up, and I said that over and over again, even though we were like an hour and a half lead, I just wanted to keep us worried.
04:03I wanted to stay nervous.
04:04And so, and then I got tense because of it.
04:08And then sure enough, it happened.
04:10And like that, actually, when that happened, when Jonathan and Anna showed up, I returned back to my normal self.
04:16Because it was like, I was afraid of this happening the entire day.
04:19Anyone, not Jonathan and Anna, I was afraid whoever was behind us for an hour and a half was going to catch up.
04:26I knew at that point it was Jonathan and Anna.
04:27When it happened, I returned to my normal self.
04:29Because the worst case scenario happened, and that's when I felt back to my normal self.
04:33And I was like, let's do this.
04:34We got this.
04:35But you're right.
04:36I did feel different the whole day.
04:38I felt tense.
04:39And it was high stakes.
04:40It was a beast competition.
04:43That top five was just a group of people that I don't ever want to run again, ever again, compete in anything.
04:48And so that's what it was.
04:49You're absolutely right.
04:50You nailed it.
04:51It was different.
04:52Well, I think, Alessa, you also pointed something out in last week's episode, which is this idea that I think in terms of your dynamic in general, you kept a lot of tension and perhaps disagreements, sort of like, for the car.
05:04You didn't necessarily have that translate to the task in general, which I think helps you both a lot.
05:08And that, like, you were able to kind of maybe this is the medical mindset of you, right?
05:12Like, put your head down, get the job done, worry about the personal stuff later.
05:16Again, maybe a little different in that last leg with everything that was going on with the kayak.
05:20But talk to me a bit more about that.
05:22Was that part of your secret to success, the ability to kind of compartmentalize those feelings?
05:27I think when we were working on a challenge, like, we felt like we were so good.
05:31We were good at the challenges.
05:32We felt pretty confident there.
05:33And also we were together.
05:34I felt like when we were in the car, the pressure was all on me because I was the navigator.
05:39And as much as I do feel pretty good about navigating and we showed our strengths in navigating and, like, the first self-driving line was Bulgaria.
05:47And that was our first place.
05:49Like, we crushed it.
05:50So we were good at it.
05:52But I feel like that's when I was feeling the most amount of pressure.
05:55And before the race, I was the first person to tell everyone, like, in our interviews, I'm so good under stress.
06:00I do anesthesia.
06:01I was a Division I athlete.
06:03Like, I know how to handle stress.
06:04That stress, when you're sitting in the back of the car in Portugal and you're lost and you're in the final four, like, it's something I never felt before.
06:12And honestly, I just didn't want to let Josiah down.
06:15And not that navigation was the nail in the coffin for us, but it was definitely part of it.
06:20So it was just, like, very stressful in those moments trying to just focus on what we had to do, but also, like, get over my anxiety about it and, like, the pressure of it all.
06:30And I think that's why, like, the car was very tense for us.
06:34Yeah, I'm intrigued because, again, especially compared to other romantic couples in this season, we did not see a lot of, like, tension between the two of you.
06:43There was stuff with the express pass and, like I mentioned, the kayaking, but very much the exception to the rule.
06:48But, Josiah, you talk about the fact that ordinarily you two work completely separately.
06:52And so I imagine it was a bit of a grand experiment to see how you would work together.
06:56Was it sort of like as much of a silky smooth dynamic in the race proper as we were sort of given in the edit most of the time?
07:04So, like, I have to be honest, and yes, it really was.
07:07And to be honest, it is a reflection of us in our normal life.
07:10But I want to highlight that also the raft is a reflection of us in our normal life.
07:14And I want to scream to the rooftops, and I told people in production, because, like, when we were doing the interviews to get on the show, they were like, do you all fight?
07:20And I said, we're so proud.
07:22I'm so proud of the fact that we fight.
07:23We're passionate people, and we're allowed to have different opinions.
07:26And we voice them, like, unabashedly and unafraid to do that.
07:30And you see it in the raft.
07:32It didn't show, but Alyssa called me a dick.
07:34You know, she was like, don't be a dick to prove a point.
07:36And you know what I was being, Mike?
07:37I was being a dick to prove a point.
07:39So, like, I love that we had that dynamic and that relationship.
07:43And I think that, really, it was a good representation overall.
07:46Most days, almost every day, we really get – we just run along smoothly.
07:50And it's the hardest part is, like, when we're on two different paths, when we think something different, we want to align.
07:56And sometimes you have to cave to the other person.
07:59But to do that, you've got to fight it out and show your opinion and show your voice.
08:03And we both do that, and we're not afraid to say that we do fight.
08:06And I'm very proud of that.
08:07So, yeah, I think it was a great representation overall.
08:10And I have to give Josiah a lot of credit because there were moments where I was spiraling and he – I mean, you see it.
08:16He pulls me back in.
08:17Like, there's moments where I'm about to snap, and he'll just look at me and be like, we got this.
08:22And I love you.
08:23And you're the best partner.
08:24And it's like, how in those moments do you let that just spiral into, like, negativity and chaos?
08:30Like, of course that brought us back.
08:32Of course that, like, helped me refocus.
08:33And, like, that's just having a great partner, and I was really lucky to have that because I need someone like that a lot.
08:40And I'm usually someone who calls me a dick sometimes, you know?
08:43Exactly.
08:43Bring you back down to earth.
08:45Right, right.
08:45Well, I've mentioned before your consistency.
08:49This shows in your track record.
08:50Before your elimination, you were the only team this season to never place in the bottom two teams.
08:56And listen, Alyssa, it sounds like in those interviews that was something that you were totally calling from the beginning.
09:01I mean, you're shaking your head about this.
09:02But, yeah, give me your thoughts about, like, how did the results measure up to your expectations?
09:06And what would you say was sort of the secret to your consistent success on the race?
09:10It's, like, crazy to hear something like that because I think we realized we were good, but I don't think we gave ourselves much credit during the race.
09:19And, like, I didn't have, like, Josiah was like, I believe in us.
09:22Like, we can do this.
09:23We can win this whole thing.
09:24And I would be out there, and I really thought of, like, some of the teams as just, like, unbeatable at times.
09:30And, like, when I saw Jonna and Anna and Jonathan show up in the train.
09:36You found their poor man's toe.
09:38Yeah.
09:39It was almost like the air went out of my sails because I just felt like they were going to beat us.
09:45And it did wound up being a puzzle, which sucks, because that is one of the challenges that, like, they probably beat us in nine times out of ten.
09:53But I don't know what the secret was.
09:55I think it was, like, just our communication and our well-roundedness.
09:59Like, we did a lot of preparation for the show and tried to do just as many different things as we could to get ourselves ready.
10:06And I don't know.
10:07What else do you think?
10:08Yeah, I think that we did go away in thinking that we could do this.
10:11You know, I know it's, like, very popular.
10:13It would be like, no, you know, I had no idea.
10:15But sincerely, we went in thinking we can absolutely win this show.
10:17And then we showed up.
10:19And honestly, the competition on this season, and I'm a fan of the show, big fan of the show.
10:23This competition was wild.
10:24And it was so fun.
10:26I love it.
10:27I wanted to compete against some of the best people.
10:29And I'll stand on my grave saying that they're some of the best people we competed against.
10:33Alyssa's a beast, you know.
10:35And that, like she said, that was my tension the whole day.
10:39And I wish I didn't have it, but it was that fear of, like, someone showing up to the train station.
10:44Jonathan and Anna showing up to that train station.
10:45And I saw it in her eyes.
10:47And I was like, no.
10:48Because Alyssa, when confident, no one can stop her.
10:51We played tennis.
10:52And, like, it's so frustrating for me.
10:53Because I could be up by everything.
10:56She's got to be at love still.
10:57And she'll come back and beat me.
10:59And so that was the thing.
11:00But we do work well together.
11:02And it was just so stressful, Mike.
11:04So, yeah.
11:05What is one thing you wish we got the opportunity to see that didn't make the edit?
11:10Either, you know, something comedically that happened, personally, strategically, maybe, that we didn't get to see over your time on the race?
11:18Do you want me to say?
11:20Well, I feel like strategically, it was you trying to take down this.
11:24That's exactly what it was.
11:25We heard, like, early in the season, we quickly realized the social game of The Amazing Race this season was going to be more important than any other season.
11:34Because Dylan was throwing out things like, you're going to be able to affect other people's race.
11:38You're going to, like, there's going to be twists every leg.
11:41So we instantly were like, okay, our social game is going to be more important than we thought.
11:45And this one turned into, like, quite the little schemer.
11:49And when he heard a word about there being any type of alliance between Jack and Carson, Scott and Laurie, and Anna and Jonathan, it was, like, his mission to bring it.
11:59Oh, I was not having it.
12:02No chance.
12:03No chance.
12:04As soon as I heard, I thought that, and you see it in the show when they say, we have, like, this loose alliance.
12:09I thought that loose alliance was in blood.
12:11I thought they are tied up.
12:13So I said, I'm going to come after all of them.
12:16And so the double U-turn, we got Scott and Laurie, and Jonathan and Anna, like, that part of the alliance.
12:21And then I kept coming for Jack and Carson.
12:24And I wanted to get them so bad.
12:27And even, like, I would bring it up with people, but they are so lovable.
12:31And that's what made me afraid of them, too.
12:34I met them, and I'm like, I like you so much.
12:36That makes me afraid of you on this show.
12:38Because on any show, if I like you automatically, you're terrifying to me.
12:41And so it was so hard to, like, get them.
12:44You know, people didn't want to do it.
12:46So I was after that alliance the entire time, the entire time.
12:49Well, you speak about lovability, and I want to turn that mirror back onto yourselves, because I'm sure you've experienced over this season.
12:56You know, I think a lot of people found a lot of positivity, and necessarily so, I think, in the wholesomeness and the passion and love that the two of you have for each other.
13:08I'm sure you never necessarily wanted to go on to the race to be, like, highlighting your own relationship in comparison to other people.
13:15But what has that experience been like for you, to have people be able to talk about the way that the two of you regard and support each other, and perhaps try to sort of assign it to their own relationships and their own lives?
13:28We didn't know how people were going to perceive us.
13:32We didn't know how we were going to come off.
13:34And we prepared ourselves.
13:35I mean, I think anyone going on reality TV has to prepare themselves for what could happen online and the comments we could receive.
13:42And the love that we've received is overwhelming.
13:45It's amazing.
13:46I'm so glad that people look, like, I get DMs being like, I want my daughter to watch this and tell her that she needs to find a husband like yours.
13:56And, like, to tell her not to settle until she has someone like him.
14:00And, like, I make her watch this and, like, look.
14:02And, like, that touches me, like, more than anything.
14:06Of course, I believe that, and I know that in my life.
14:09I see it every day.
14:10But, like, for other people to get to see that and for, like, Josiah to be that inspiration and us, like, our love story to be an inspiration, like, it means more than I ever could have seen coming out of the show.
14:21I have to say I get so much of that, and, like, that's so heartwarming and touching.
14:26But, like, I've always said that, like, if I had a daughter and never met Alyssa, I'd want my daughter to look up to Alyssa.
14:32Like, she's a strong, intelligent, like, beautiful woman and, like, kind.
14:37And she's just a great, great person.
14:40So, I know that it's, like, oh, look, this guy's being nice to his wife.
14:43That's, you know, that's wild.
14:44But, like, my wife is, like, this incredible human being.
14:47And I think that everybody who knows her would say, of course he is.
14:50Like, everyone knows she's out of my league.
14:51And it's, like, an ongoing joke that her grandma's, like, she's way too good for you.
14:56And I love her grandma.
14:57But, like, you know, that's just the truth of it, Mike.
14:59Her old mom's like, Josiah.
15:00And she didn't even get to see when she called you a dick on the raft.
15:03No, she wouldn't be surprised.
15:04She was like, that's right, Josiah.
15:06But, yeah, and it's, like, I said to you last night, Mike.
15:09Like, what I love about reality TV is that you get to see a reflection of people in their real life
15:13under stressful, challenging, competitive scenarios.
15:16And I love that.
15:17I love that.
15:18And just to be a small part of that, like, Chip and Kim, to me, will always be heroes to me.
15:22You know, that relationship to me was so freaking awesome.
15:25And we talked about it when we were watching it.
15:27So, either way, just to be a small part of that for people is, like, so humbling more than anything.
15:31Yeah, I mean, this has been such an immense pleasure to not only watch the two of you, but talk to you as well.
15:38And, again, I think that even just talking with you really goes to show that the way you two were
15:43and the way you regarded each other especially was wholly represented on the show
15:48and is something that I think a lot of people can aspire to.
15:51And, look, you know, apologies if I'm speaking out of turn here.
15:54But I think if you have even an ounce of the passion and energy and love for what's to come as you have for each other,
16:04I think this kid's going to turn out to be amazing.
16:07So, thank you.
16:08That's awesome.
16:08Thank you both so much.
16:11No, my God.
16:12I mean, the pleasure was all mine.
16:13It was an absolute blast to get the chance to talk with you last night and talk with you this morning as well.
16:18And thank you both sincerely for everything you brought to our screens, everything you brought today.
16:23I wish you, Alyssa, nothing but the best.
16:26I hope everything, you know, goes well with what's to come with the future for the two of you.
16:30And sincerely, from the bottom of my heart, thank you for everything.
16:33Mike, every week we've looked forward to your podcast and we love listening to you.
16:39Thank you for your support, your coverage of everything.
16:42It's so much fun.
16:43And, like, it's...
16:44Authenticity.
16:45Like, meeting you last night, I was like, this is who I imagined on the podcast and I'm talking to this person.
16:48Oh, my God.
16:49Likewise.
16:50Likewise to the two of you.
16:52Again, I wish you both nothing but the best and everything you could ever want in the world.
16:56Thank you both.
16:57Thank you, Mike.
16:58It's an absolute pleasure.
16:58You have a great one.
17:00Thank you so much.
17:00Bye.
17:01Bye.
17:01Bye.
17:01Bye.