- 2 days ago
Lindsey Kidd, managing director of HM3 Legal spoke to Insider about the Chester-based firm's expansion with its new office in Altrincham.
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00:00Hello, I'm Simon Keegan. I'm the editor of the Northwest Business Insider and I'm joined today
00:14by Lindsay Kidd, Managing Director of HM3 Legal. Good morning. Well, Lindsay, I say I'm joined by
00:22you, but I've actually joined you because we're here in your new Altrincham office. That's right.
00:27That's very exciting, isn't it? It's been very exciting. I'm really pleased to have arrived
00:32with a bang in Altrincham, part of our growth strategy to help us cover the Northwest a bit
00:38more fully than we have done previously. We're obviously really well established in Chester,
00:43having been there decades, and we're just actually marking 10 years in our Liverpool office.
00:49Right, okay. And the time was definitely right for us to branch out further to meet people where
00:56they're at. So that's clients and also the talent that want to come and work for us.
01:00And Altrincham makes you well-placed to do that?
01:02I think absolutely. It's connected in all senses of the word. It's vibrant, it's agile. There's lots
01:10of entrepreneurial businesses here that really speaks to us as a business. We've been made to
01:15feel really welcome. Lots of momentum. We've just recently taken in a team of litigators that's got
01:22us off to a really good start and hopefully more good things to follow.
01:26Right, brilliant. Well, this company was, as you say, well-established before you even joined,
01:33but now you're the MD. So since you've come in, what kind of changes have you made? Is it one of them
01:41evolution rather than revolution, or has it been a full-on revolution?
01:46Yeah, how long have you got? So I joined in 2007, and I was brought across from, I was previously at
01:54Bradner's, joined what was then Hilli and McEwan with a remit to help build out the commercial services.
02:01So at that point, the firm was very much a high street practice looking after just private client
02:06needs. My remit was to build out commercial services, which we did over a period of,
02:12did it organically really, over a period of 15 or so years, to a point whereby sort of 65% of our
02:21turnover now comes from B2B work, and 35% comes from private client.
02:27So a dramatic change, really?
02:30Massive in terms of the purpose of the business, who it's serving, and also now where it's serving
02:39those people from. And I think, you know, that's been a really good growth journey for us. But that
02:48wasn't enough. So in the pandemic, what we realised was that we needed to reinvent ourselves again.
02:54It wasn't enough to just be a full service firm, because it's a really, really saturated market.
02:59And so in terms of turnover, I don't know if you know this stat, but the top of the top 200
03:06by turnover turns over something over 3 billion. The bottom of the top 200 by turnover turns over
03:13something like 12 million pounds. So that leaves 98% of the legal service market turning over 12
03:20million or less. And that's a really, really saturated space to be in. So we decided that we would
03:26have a good look at ourselves, do some really deep listening from SMEs, which is our target market,
03:35and see to make sure that we were giving them what they needed in the way they needed it delivered.
03:41And that brought about HM3. We're in the third evolution of our business. In this era of client
03:48wow and delight, making sure that clients enjoy the experience with us, want to come back for more
03:55and refer and recommending their networks. So we've been on quite a transformation journey,
03:59and there's still more to come.
04:01Yeah, and a lot of law firms, I mean, some of the oldest companies in the world are law firms,
04:06aren't they?
04:06Sure.
04:06So some of them are very traditional, kind of three-piece suit, kind of, you know,
04:10traditional law firms that have been very slow to evolve. When I look at your website,
04:17it's the exact opposite. You've got things saying, we've got bloody brilliant lawyers and things
04:21like that. So is that part of that sort of rebranding, the way that you, I suppose,
04:27the way that you're perceived by potential clients as well?
04:31A hundred percent. So it's an actual thing, bloody lawyers, that exclamation of frustration
04:38is a thing. I think second only probably to bloody politicians and bloody estate agents,
04:44that's also definitely a thing.
04:45I thought you were going to say bloody journalists.
04:47No, I wasn't going to say bloody journalists. Yeah, that frustration that users of legal
04:54services quite often feel, and those are tangible frustrations, and we decided to really lean
05:00into those, which is quite brave, because if we're saying we're doing it and then we don't
05:03deliver it, that's even worse, isn't it?
05:05Yeah, yeah.
05:06But trying to turn those frustrations of bloody lawyers into an exclamation of delight and
05:13turn it into bloody brilliant lawyers, you know, that was the whole genesis behind the
05:17rebrand and the six brand standards that we've committed to. So some tangible behaviours that
05:23can be measured and that we hold ourselves accountable to, and those are the ones that
05:29you're looking at on the website.
05:31Yeah.
05:31And then, of course, with that, a really bold colour palette and a bold tone of voice, and
05:35that is purposeful as well. That is so that we elevate ourselves out of what we call internally
05:41the swamp, which is a very saturated legal sector market, certainly in the mid-tier space,
05:49which is the one that we're operating in.
05:51Okay. So one of the other things is you're a B Corp, aren't you?
05:54Yes.
05:54So, I mean, when I first became aware of B Corp, it was all like, was it like Ben and
06:00Jerry's and things like that, wasn't it? You didn't really get many, many law firms that
06:05were doing it. So was it difficult to get?
06:09Okay. Yes, it's not a tick box. You don't just get the badge. You've got to put some work
06:16into it, and it was quite a journey. But it's been hugely rewarding in that I think when we
06:24took the decision to go for B Corp certification, we felt we were already doing, if you like,
06:3090% of the things already as a purpose-led business because of how we evolve and how we're
06:39set up. So we thought we might as well get accredited for it. It did take three years.
06:44Right. Yeah.
06:45But we managed to involve people from every level of the business. So it was something that the
06:52team really got behind. So it's not top-down led. It's definitely something that every
06:58level of the business can get involved in. And when you tell them what we're doing and
07:02why we're doing it and how they can help, they really engaged with that. So as an employee
07:06engagement piece, as a hidden benefit, that's been brilliant. And you're saying, you know,
07:12Ben and Jerry's has given an example of an early B Corp adopter. Not many law firms at
07:17that point, but there still aren't. I think there's only 20 odd or so in the whole of the
07:22UK. So that's, we're in this really unique space, less than half a percent of law firms
07:27are B Corps and we're one of them and we're really proud of that. So yeah, quite the journey,
07:32but really rewarding.
07:33How would you describe your culture for somebody, for, you know, a lawyer working here?
07:39Yeah. So we are purpose-led and we're really big on work-life harmony. And I think that that's
07:45really important. You know, we want to attract people that can do their best work and be their
07:50best self and not have to dial down their health and happiness to meet targets. So we're, you know,
07:58we recognise that people have lives outside of work and we employ a lot of people with young
08:04families, people with elder care responsibilities, people that want to spend time with their fur
08:10babies. You know, people have lives outside of work and we want to champion that and enable
08:16it. So we want to employ people, you know, treat them as adults because that's what they
08:23are. Trust and empower them to do their best work. Make sure that they have everything that
08:29they need to do that so that they feel supported. Bring their whole self to work and give them
08:35challenging work but that stretches them if, you know, if they want to be stretched but not
08:40overwhelmed. So something that keeps them engaged and give them really clear progression pathways so
08:46that they know what we need to work on with them to get them to the next step if they have ambition to
08:51grow within the business. And so you talked about, you know, listening to the SMEs when it came to your
08:58kind of rebrand. So is that where you sort of primarily see yourself then is in that SME market?
09:05Totally, yeah. So our target market we would say is SME leaders in the Northwest and there's a little
09:12bit of thinking behind that. So although I said earlier the genesis of the business was private
09:17client services, I think the waterfall comes this way. If you do a really good job for a business owner
09:25with their business requirements on their M&A work or that kind of thing, they're much more
09:30inclined to trust you then to look after themselves and their families and their network with the
09:35private client stuff. It doesn't necessarily follow the same way if you do a really good divorce for
09:41someone or a really good conveyance that, you know, if they're a business owner or are influential in
09:46a business, they don't immediately then feel comfortable trusting you with their business needs.
09:52So I think in terms of trying not to be a scattergun and targeting everything all at once all over
09:58the place and getting nowhere, we have made a conscious decision to focus on SME leaders in
10:03the Northwest. And of course, the Alchingham growth is part of meeting that need.
10:09And I suppose you've got quite a bit in common with these sort of entrepreneurial businesses as
10:14well. So you've connected them in that way?
10:16I've never thought about that, but it's clever. But absolutely. Yeah, because I've been on a
10:22leadership growth journey myself, you know, and I think that's been my remit to grow the
10:29business and we're doing it, but it's hard. So I know all those pain points. I know the things that
10:33keep people awake at night. And I can speak to that because I've lived it and I'm doing it.
10:38And, you know, we can help our clients with that because we don't want to be transactional
10:46with our clients. We want it to be a deep relationship because I know that I value that
10:51from the external support that I have and that I listen to. I don't want people to just dip in
10:56and dip out. I want that continuity. Somebody that actually knows the journey that the business is
11:03going on, where it's growing to, what its aspirations are, what its pain points might be
11:09and to proactively reach out and address those ahead of time. So reflecting that back into our
11:15target market and the, you know, SME business owners that we're acting for, I think you're exactly
11:20right. What a mirror.
11:21There you go. There you go. There you go. So you're talking about that growth journey and I know that
11:28you're on this, you're on your kind of net zero journey, which comes back to the B Corp, but
11:35you're also on quite a, I guess, like an evolution through tech as well, aren't you? You've employed
11:40quite a bit of new technology, I think.
11:43Yeah, I think we would class ourselves as early adopters of most things as a business. And that's
11:48the good thing about, you talked earlier about traditional legal practices. Quite often it's
11:53hard for them to make decisions quickly or at all. You know, whereas there are three of us that own
12:00the business, we're all aligned, all on the same page and we can be very agile with our decision
12:06making. So we've been early adopters of a lot of things over the years from, we were very early to
12:12be in ABS, we were very early to outsource dictation and, you know, telephony and that kind of thing.
12:19So it would be no surprise to folk that know us to hear that we've been early adopters of tech and
12:28not just in terms of helping deliver the client work. And there's so much more that we can and
12:33will do in relation to that, but tech in other areas of the business. So one thing that's worked
12:38really well for us since, actually, since the pandemic, when we were all working from home at
12:43that point, we introduced an employee engagement app. And it's a platform in which we can actually
12:49listen to what our colleagues are thinking and feeling in the moment. So instead of having a
12:56once or twice a year backward looking appraisal, we can tune into what they're feeling, what they've
13:02encountered each week. So it's no more than a 10 minute check in. We learn what's gone well,
13:08we do more of that. What's gone not so well, we can then eradicate that or get rid of those
13:13barriers. And the tech is so clever. There's AI and algorithms behind that that give us sentiment
13:20scores across a number of things like how engaged people are, whether they're advocates for the
13:25business, what their job satisfaction is like, all those kinds of things. So we can measure
13:32that. Because as a business, we only have three actual metrics. And you might be interested
13:38to know that none of them are financial, they're around client experience, I was going to say
13:43hours build.
13:44No, we don't have that. That's not a metric for us, not a metric for us. But it is in most
13:48law firms, we've moved away from that, because that's Yeah, no, and we track them, but only
13:53to make sure nobody's overwhelmed with work. So we have client satisfaction, colleague happiness,
13:58and B Corp. That's that's it. But to complete the tech story. So lots of lots of tech helping
14:04us listen to our colleagues. We did actually create a role where a new head of innovation
14:12role and recruited someone into that one of our partners to actually drive the tech and
14:18innovation forward now in relation to the client work. So not necessarily about doing the client
14:23work more efficiently, but about delivering the service in a way that each client wants
14:29it. So really hyper personalized client experience.
14:33Well, I suppose we're all different as people these days, aren't we? You know, some people
14:38have an app for an Uber, some people are still like going to the taxi rank or whatever, you
14:42know, and so I guess some people will just say no, I want to speak to my lawyer on the phone.
14:49Whereas others expect, I guess they'd expect an app and things like that, wouldn't they?
14:52Yeah. And certainly, I think we find with the demographic of our client base changing, so
14:58we, you know, have a lot of startup and adolescent businesses that we service, and quite a lot of
15:06those are tech enabled and want to have their experience on an app or more tech based. And
15:13then there are people, as you say, where, you know, we need to pick up the phone. And absolutely.
15:17And that's a skill in itself, but we do all the training around that. And so yeah, tech
15:21definitely, definitely should be harnessed as a, as an enabler. I don't think it's here
15:27to replace us. There's definitely a role for that relational aspect that we need to continue
15:33to deliver and will still be wanted, you know, and desired by our client base. So meeting different
15:40people where they're at and giving them what they want at the time they want it in the way
15:43that they want it hyper personalized. Sounds brilliant. Yeah. What's next for you,
15:48Lindsay? Yeah. More of the same, I guess. I think we're really happy with the, the business
15:53plan we've got. We're happy with the growth journey that we're on. What we're finding is
15:58the, the messaging that we're putting out there is really resonating, not just with clients,
16:05and not just in the communities we operate in and the connections and intermediaries that
16:10we help along the way, but definitely colleagues. We're attracting talent, seem to be, you know,
16:18by the points of difference that we've touched on a little bit in the chat that we've had.
16:23So we've definitely had people that have chosen us because of our brand. We've definitely had
16:28people that have chosen us over other bigger, I'm not going to say better, but bigger firms because
16:35of our B Corp credentials. And I just love that. It's, you know, it becomes a bit, you know, I don't
16:42know. It's really enriching and rewarding to, to find that the talent wants to come to you. So it's my
16:50job to make sure all of our people have what they need to be their best self and that I can give
16:56them what they want to the extent that I'm able to do that. Because if you look after your people
17:01and invest in them, that's what's helping the business grow. Yeah. And we invest all of that
17:06back in the people and the business. And so it continues to grow. And the momentum that we've
17:11got at the moment has been really good to see. I just want more of it. I'm not a megalomaniac.
17:15No. No. So sustainable purpose-led growth, I think, is what's to be expected. That's what
17:24I would like. And what a journey to be on. Fantastic. Well, let's end on that now, Lindsay.
17:30So, Lindsay, thanks. Thanks for all your time. And you'll see some of this as part of our legal
17:37review in the October issue of Insider. I'll see you soon.
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