Protecting our oceans: 'Int'l community and private sector need to be challenged'

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00:00World Bank's Senior Managing Director Axel van Trotzenberg leads the institution's global work on development, policy, climate and partnerships

00:08and will be participating in that UN Oceans Conference in Nice. In fact, we can go there live now to speak with him.

00:14Thanks so much for your time. Can I start by asking you, I mean, a general idea, how much would it cost to protect our oceans properly?

00:22As you mentioned, the oceans are overexploited. We see marine pollution of gigantic scales and we need to do something.

00:35So there are estimates that we would need to invest every year around $170 billion to deal with this problem.

00:44Yet only $120 billion out of the $170 billion is financed. So there is a huge gap of $150 billion.

00:54This is incidentally one of the sustainable development goals that is severely underfunded.

01:01Many are, but this is one of the most underfunded objectives of the sustainable development goals and we need to do more.

01:10OK, so a big call on people gathered there, Anis, to put up the money, which is often the sticking point in these conferences.

01:18But, you know, tell us a bit more about the World Bank has started to prioritise working on the oceans.

01:24Give me a concrete idea of the projects that the World Bank is interested in and why.

01:29Well, we are working worldwide. First, the dimensions.

01:33We have been scaling up our activities for the oceans and we increased our exposure to these projects from about $5-6 billion five years ago.

01:50And we are now, as a World Bank group, at close to the $13 billion level.

01:55So it's very clear that we need to do all more.

01:59And certainly the bank does it with the private sector as well as the public sector.

02:03We are financing mangroves in Africa as well as Indonesia.

02:11We help fisheries that are threatened in their livelihoods.

02:15We are supporting particularly plastic waste management because plastic waste is a massive problem.

02:22Just to give you an idea, every year about 15 million metric tons are getting into the oceans.

02:30And we need to see how we can reduce it, ideally eliminate this.

02:34So these are the type of activities we are doing.

02:36We cannot do that alone.

02:38So we're working with other multilateral development banks and governments to see how we can do better.

02:44And this is, I think, the importance of this conference, that there are solutions out there and we can do it.

02:51So we, as an international community, should have better partnerships, not only the public, but also the private, to actually make a difference.

03:01And I hope that this will come out of this conference.

03:04OK, there are solutions, you're saying, but those solutions, as you've rightly pointed out, cost a lot of money.

03:08So who's going to pay? Who's willing to pay?

03:10Where will that money come from?

03:11Well, I think that is a combination.

03:14That is, there are governments.

03:16I think the private sector is need to be challenged.

03:20There is only a few percentage points of this financing is done by the private sector.

03:27We need to engage them much, much more because, as you know, there are fiscal stress around the world.

03:33So not the resources are easily.

03:35And also the development banks should do more.

03:37And that is exactly what the World Bank has been doing.

03:40I think that is what we like to show, that to do that effectively, we need to do more.

03:47But also we need to do that in partnership so that we can get the synergy effects that are needed.

03:53OK, everybody, as you say, needs to do more for this.

03:56But, you know, you're telling us what the World Bank does in the right direction, but it does still finance billions in terms of fossil fuels.

04:03Is it not time to walk away from that, to make a sharp stance?

04:07Well, that is one of the illusions that are going around that is not correct.

04:12We have never been anymore being engaged on coal financing.

04:16Sometimes people are coming with this.

04:18Our main financing is on renewable energies, and those portfolios have increased significantly.

04:26And so I think one needs to show actually what the record of the World Bank is in this area.

04:32And we are working hard on this.

04:34And this is, incidentally, not the topic of the oceans.

04:38But clearly, these are the things we are dealing to have a sustainable portfolio.

04:44And I think we are in pretty good shape.

04:47Cost of not addressing the problem with the oceans?

04:51The cost of the is that it will worsen.

04:54And let's keep that in mind.

04:56You mentioned also that in the introduction.

04:58There are three billion people dependent on healthy oceans.

05:04So this is the livelihoods that's at stake, jobs that's at stake.

05:09So therefore, we need to act on this.

05:11And I think as much as it is difficult, it is doable.

05:15We have shown that also with overfishing, we can well manage, control this, and have sustainable fishing management.

05:27We have shown that in parts of the world.

05:30And so we need to extend that this requires international cooperation with governments.

05:36But it is doable.

05:38Axel von Trutzenbürger, Senior Managing Director at the World Bank.

05:42Let's hope you can push delegates there in the right direction.

05:46Thanks for your time here on Friends Radio.

05:47Absolutely.

05:48Thank you very much.

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