'Israel here to stay': Palestinian leaders seek 'complete liberation' of what they deem 'their land'

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00:00 Let's get a view from Washington.

00:01 He was U.S. Undersecretary of Defense for Policy under George W. Bush.

00:05 Douglas Faith is senior fellow at the Hudson Institute think tank.

00:08 Thank you for joining us here on France 24.

00:10 Good to be with you.

00:13 Yeah.

00:14 We just heard a view, one view from Israel saying that the Israelis are determined, that

00:22 what we're about to witness is going to be months, weeks at the least more of war.

00:30 Before I ask you about that, first off, there's still chatter about diplomats trying to revive

00:39 the truce.

00:40 Any chance of that?

00:41 Well, I guess there's some chance of that.

00:49 The Hamas promised to release hostages if they were to go back to it and say that they

00:58 were going to release more, it's possible that there would be an extension of the truce.

01:02 But I think the Israeli government has made it clear that even if the truce gets extended

01:08 by another day or two, they are intent on finishing their military mission of destroying

01:15 Hamas.

01:16 Of course, you can't destroy an ideology.

01:20 You can perhaps destroy a leadership command.

01:24 What's the best Israel can hope for?

01:26 Well, I don't think you're right when you say you can't destroy an ideology.

01:29 There have been a number of ideologies that have been effectively destroyed through military

01:34 defeat.

01:35 I mean, Nazism in Germany was effectively destroyed.

01:40 The Japanese militarism of the World War II government was effectively destroyed.

01:48 If you think about it from perspective closer to the United States, the pro-slavery ideology

01:55 of the South was effectively destroyed in the Civil War.

01:59 I mean, this idea that you can't destroy an idea by destroying the movement that is promoting

02:05 it, I think is-

02:07 But you have to have an alternative.

02:08 You have to have an alternative to be able to destroy it.

02:12 In what we just heard with our previous panelists, it was first you fight, then you seek the

02:16 alternative effectively.

02:18 Well, I think it would be very helpful if the various aid contributors to the Palestinians

02:28 did focus on cultivating an alternative.

02:32 And I think that the main alternative is the idea that the Palestinians should be focusing

02:38 on creating better lives for themselves, improving their own situation, getting the best deal

02:45 possible, rather than focus on an uncompromising demand on the liberation of all of what they

02:55 consider to be their land and the destruction of Israel.

03:00 You're saying that's for all Palestinians or just Hamas?

03:04 I'm saying that the Palestinians would have an opportunity to improve their lives if they

03:12 abandon the war against Israel and focus on getting improvement to their own life based

03:20 on the best deal possible.

03:24 That's the Palestinians in general, you're saying?

03:26 Yes, I think the Palestinians in general would be much better off.

03:30 Because you're saying the Palestinians in general right now are intent on destroying

03:34 Israel.

03:38 Certainly the political leaders of the Palestinians, both in Gaza and unfortunately also in the

03:44 Palestinian Authority, have never really given up the idea of the return of the Palestinians,

03:51 which means what they consider to be the complete liberation of what they think is their land.

03:56 And I think they'd be a lot better off if they accepted the idea that Israel is here

04:06 to stay.

04:07 But wasn't that what the Oslo Accords were all about, that there would be compensation

04:12 for the right of return over the lands that were taken in 1948?

04:17 This is something the Palestinian Authority had been in negotiations for a settlement.

04:23 No, I think that's a complete misunderstanding of what the Oslo Accords were about.

04:27 It was supposed to be a first step.

04:32 The Oslo Accords amounted to a unilateral Israeli withdrawal from the territory.

04:41 And the very weak peace promises that were made by Yasser Arafat were first of all weak

04:54 and secondly violated.

04:57 And Arafat understood from the beginning that even if he did violate those ambiguous and

05:03 weak peace promises that he made, the Israelis would continue to withdraw and transfer authority

05:09 to him.

05:11 And it didn't work.

05:13 It wasn't a real peace deal.

05:15 But it was Yitzhak Rabin who was assassinated, assassinated by hardliners from his own side,

05:22 hardliners who are now in government.

05:24 And they're the ones talking about an Israel that extends with ownership, full ownership

05:33 of the West Bank, therefore expanding those settlements.

05:37 My question to you is, what you were saying earlier about the Palestinians' designs on

05:42 Israel cannot be the same for some of Benton Yemen Yedinyahu's coalition partners on Palestinian

05:47 land.

05:48 I think you've completely misrepresented the picture in Israel.

05:53 And what you just said about-

05:55 They're talking about a reoccupation of the Gaza Strip.

05:57 You said the people who assassinated Rabin are now in the government.

06:00 That's crazy.

06:01 I mean, you're being very loose with your language.

06:07 And what you're saying is not accurate.

06:10 Those who assassinated Yitzhak Rabin, you're saying that they're not close to those hardline

06:16 West Bank settlers, people like Itamar Ben-Gavir, people like Mr. Smotrych?

06:25 The suggestion that the people in the Israeli government now were involved in the assassination

06:33 with Rabin is not accurate.

06:35 You don't have any- I mean, there's no basis for that.

06:38 Douglas Faith, wish we could talk longer.

06:41 Unfortunately, we have to move on.

06:43 But I want to thank you so much for joining us from Washington.

06:45 Okay.

06:46 Good to talk to you.

06:48 Stay with us.

06:49 There's much more to come.

06:50 More news plus the day's business and sports.

06:52 Stay with us.

06:53 Thanks for watching.

06:53 (upbeat music)

06:55 (upbeat music)

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