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Sean Penn on How He Filmed Zelensky the Day After the First Bombs Dropped on Ukraine
Variety
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9/15/2023
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00:00
We went back to the hotel to prepare for the next day,
00:03
our first day of shooting with President Zelensky.
00:06
I must have been asleep about 10 minutes
00:08
by the time the first rocket hit the city.
00:10
And so everything changed.
00:12
And then he kept the meeting with us the next day
00:14
and we started shooting this film.
00:17
The film we'd set out to make was not meant
00:19
to encounter an existential threat to democracy,
00:22
just a spirited story of a comedy superstar
00:25
turned president.
00:26
Be careful.
00:28
The average amount of people traveling,
00:31
part of our crew were between three and five.
00:36
A total of seven trips, gosh,
00:41
typically about a week at a time.
00:42
We're currently in this situation
00:44
where there's a major Russian buildup.
00:46
The situation was changing and feeling more urgent.
00:50
Go, go, go.
00:51
They had two impacts in town.
00:54
Billy Smith and I had, we met, I think it was at the CGI,
00:59
the Clinton Global Initiative meeting
01:02
in New York one year.
01:04
We started talking about documentaries.
01:06
We had a couple of different ones that we had pursued
01:09
and for various reasons decided not to do.
01:12
He had made contact with a good friend
01:14
of President Zelensky's.
01:16
And this is at a time where the United States,
01:18
whereby most of us were being introduced to Zelensky
01:22
through a bad phone call with the then President Trump.
01:25
The way that he was handling
01:28
what must have been an incredibly difficult period
01:32
with the relationship between the United States and Ukraine
01:35
seemed awfully mature for somebody
01:38
who had not been in politics for long.
01:40
You hear the stories of the history he had as an actor.
01:44
Start watching some of the shows of "Servant of the People."
01:47
He was a talented actor, very charismatic, very charming.
01:50
And we had the opportunity through this friend of Billy's
01:53
to perhaps be in touch with President Zelensky
01:56
and get his participation.
01:58
And so we decided we'd make this whimsical tale
02:01
of this comedic actor who played a president in a comedy,
02:04
then becoming the president of Ukraine.
02:06
And then COVID got in our way
02:09
and it was difficult to travel.
02:11
In some cases it was forbidden.
02:13
He said, "Let's wait and do this after."
02:16
'Cause we met him on Zoom during the COVID lockdowns.
02:20
What I said to him was that I didn't want him to say yes,
02:23
he'd participate until he met me face to face.
02:26
Then he'd have a chance to,
02:28
because I really wanted his trust.
02:31
I was gonna ask everything.
02:33
At that time, one thought they were gonna ask
02:35
the big question, what happened on that phone call?
02:38
Well, of course he did an incredible Axios interview
02:41
where he addressed it head on.
02:42
And so what had been important
02:44
or wherever we thought we would start
02:45
in the pursuit of the story of Ukraine
02:47
and this president changed.
02:50
And now we were hearing the drums of Russia.
02:54
By the time we were able to visit with him the first time,
02:58
it just ended up being visit face to face, but no cameras.
03:03
It would be on the 23rd of February, 2022,
03:07
the day before the invasion.
03:09
And he agreed that he'd go on camera the following day.
03:12
And it was a good meeting.
03:15
And I knew I liked him, whip smart, warm,
03:20
and didn't have the contrivances or the guards
03:25
that I'd seen in political leaders all over the world.
03:28
We went back to the hotel to prepare for the next day,
03:31
our first day of shooting with President Zelensky.
03:35
And we ultimately decided to get some rest
03:39
and we laid down in our rooms.
03:42
And I don't know, I must've been asleep
03:45
about 10 minutes by the time the first rocket hit the city.
03:48
And so everything changed.
03:50
And then he kept the meeting with us the next day
03:52
and we started shooting this film.
03:54
- This is about vengeance.
03:56
Putin's angry that this country wants to divorce itself
03:59
from Russia forever and he wants it back.
04:01
- What I felt was a profound heartbreak.
04:05
It was really clear that day that something evil
04:08
and beyond stupid, a complete collapse of imagination
04:13
had happened in the Kremlin, in Putin,
04:17
and to a large degree in Russian culture,
04:21
creating a kind of sepsis on humanity.
04:24
All of the ways in which this is going to continue
04:29
to impact all of our lives.
04:31
As long as there's a war being fought,
04:33
in part leveraging fossil fuels,
04:36
we're not moving forward on climate change issues, right?
04:40
So this is a thing that, all of the,
04:44
of course the deaths and the destruction,
04:47
meaningless, meaningless stuff.
04:50
But it was also heartbreaking because one knew,
04:55
you sensed it from our first trip in November
04:58
and the attention we had paid that country
05:01
since we started this.
05:03
It was so clear that something magic was going on
05:05
in terms of the unity of that country.
05:07
So there was no version of this
05:09
where Russia could win and it would be one more war
05:13
somebody else won over somebody else and off we go home.
05:17
There was no such thing as a win for the Russians here.
05:20
So I think the kindest thing one could say about Putin
05:23
is he has absolutely no imagination and he's an utter bore.
05:27
- We need Americans to understand the price
05:30
we have to pay to be free.
05:32
- Because of our proximity to active combat,
05:37
that's the priority.
05:38
- Guys, no grass, these fields are mine.
05:41
- There's a lot of ways you could end the sentence.
05:44
None of us thought that Ukraine could this.
05:48
None of us would ever have imagined
05:53
that this comedian turned president would become this.
05:58
This is not the old story.
06:02
In the old story, when the world media reports
06:06
a total encirclement of Kiev, that regime has collapsed
06:09
and a puppet regime is put in.
06:14
That's the story, always the story everywhere in the world.
06:18
What's different about this story is that
06:20
and where Ukraine, and I believe it will,
06:25
and it's moving to me to think about this,
06:29
that it's gonna rewrite the rhythm of history this way.
06:33
I think Ukraine can be the story of sustained unity
06:38
when in peacetime.
06:40
That doesn't mean lack of diversity of political thought,
06:43
but that they are going to remember that they are one.
06:47
I sense that's going to happen.
06:49
I sense it's gonna happen in part
06:51
because of Zelensky's leadership,
06:54
but I sense it from kind of the all walks of life people
06:57
that we've spent time with,
06:58
that there's something new in world history happening
07:01
and it's starting with Ukraine
07:03
and that it'll be a great teacher for the world.
07:08
(dramatic music)
07:10
- If Ukraine fails, it's not just a failure for democracy.
07:13
- Everything that happens here is gonna affect
07:15
every other place in the world today.
07:16
That's the reason that we're all so invested in this.
07:19
- I don't think that our country should underestimate
07:24
the insobriety of privilege.
07:28
And we are privileged that our children
07:31
are not being hit by rockets right now.
07:33
We are privileged that we are not in some kind
07:37
of a civil war right now.
07:40
With this film, as much as it's about Ukraine,
07:43
as much as it's about Zelensky,
07:45
that turns out to be only the most potent vehicle
07:50
to create the discussion about building community
07:55
'cause we're social creatures
07:56
and if we can't wake up in the morning
07:59
to a world that assumes it's in partnership with each other,
08:03
whether it's our neighborhood, our house,
08:06
then I do, as they say in the film,
08:08
it doesn't take rocket science to know
08:13
that what we're doing is designing for mental unhealth.
08:18
Unless we're humble enough to realize
08:22
we're social animals and what does that mean?
08:25
I don't have to wake up in the morning
08:27
and assume my neighbor hates me.
08:29
(gentle music)
08:32
(gentle music)
08:35
(gentle music)
08:37
(gentle music)
08:40
(gentle music)
08:42
(gentle music)
08:45
[BLANK_AUDIO]
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2:32
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