- 2 days ago
Sheffield Wednesday's struggles continue, and in the latest episode of All Wednesday we're joined by Alex Miller to address the current state of play and the latest hammer blow - the loss of Josh Windass and Michael Smith.
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00:00squad that needs a lot of attention. I think many people would say heading into next season to lose
00:05two players of that experience and that quality. There's a whole new perspective on what you say.
00:23Hello and welcome to the latest edition of All Wednesday. It's me back in charge after Chris
00:28stepped in and I became the guest last week. We've got Alex Miller with us. Alex, another
00:33eventful week and another eventful, miserable week at Sheffield Wednesday. I think we've
00:39obviously got to start with the latest news and that is the fact that Josh Windass and
00:44Michael Smith are no longer Sheffield Wednesday players, effective immediately. Lots of goals,
00:49lots of memories, gone in the blink of an eye for absolutely nothing. It's pretty grim,
00:54isn't it? Yes, certainly so. And it's two big players, clearly. As you said, the two main
01:04contributor of goals last season and two players that have contributed an awful lot to Sheffield
01:12Wednesday. And I think over the course of the last few months, there's been a lot of low
01:19points and a lot of things that are, you know, truly unacceptable. People not being paid, non-footballing
01:27stuff not being paid. The restriction embargoes that Wednesday have found themselves under and
01:35put themselves in. But this one just, I don't know, felt like a new low. You know, when we
01:44got confirmation of this one, you know, it's a real tangible football issue, you know, in what
01:53was already an incredibly lean squad that needs a lot of attention. I think many people would
01:59say heading into next season to lose two players of that experience and that quality. There's
02:07a whole new perspective on what you say has been turbulent over the last few weeks.
02:14Yeah, I think the thing with the squad in general, there's been, I think obviously people trying
02:21to find, right sides is the wrong term, but trying to find glimpses of light in it all.
02:26And I think there was an element of, well, even if Wednesday have the squad that they have
02:31now, it's enough, you know, it's enough to potentially get away with, you know, staying
02:36up if a point seduction isn't so bad and all that kind of thing. But I think when you lose
02:40two players like this, all of a sudden, I think it's 15 players that could really be
02:45classed as senior players now. Like you mentioned, it's two big contributors for Wednesday and also
02:52big personalities as well, you know, really like big personalities in the dressing room.
02:57players that have experienced a lot, we were a big part of the great escape a couple of years ago.
03:03And I think that the, because of the nature of this and because of the lack of real information
03:11as to how they've gone, much to my rancor, I've been trying my best to try and figure out what on
03:19earth is going on with all of this stuff. But because we don't know, I think the concern is that,
03:25you know, we are going to be clueless and that I suppose anybody could go now, because it feels
03:36like it's a little bit of a free-for-all now, doesn't it? Potentially.
03:41Yeah, potentially. I think, you know, we're aware of, there's a number of players that have
03:49sort of attended this notice period. I mean, we've reported a couple of times that it wasn't
03:55necessarily the intention of every individual to leave the club, you know, that it was a
04:01case of perhaps putting Chancery, the club, whatever it might be, under pressure to pay
04:09what was owed not just to the individuals, but to the other people around the club.
04:15That's commendable. Clearly, Josh and Michael had, it feels weird calling him Michael, Josh
04:23and Smudge have options elsewhere and, you know, had clearly expressed a desire to leave
04:32the football club. And I think the reaction, the broad reaction on social media has been
04:39heartening, I think, because certainly from my point of view, they're well within the rights to do
04:47that and no one should be chained to any business. You know, the emotions that come with football
04:52make it unlike anything else. But yeah, to expect anything different of anyone, everyone's got their
04:58own circumstances, everyone's got their own view on things. Could we see further people, you know,
05:04leave the club, you know, if those decisions are pushed through and acted on? I think it's possible.
05:13And that, you know, two of us always try to sort of avoid anything that might sound like
05:18scaremongering or anything like that. But the precedent is now there. Should have a peace out in
05:26the next couple of days, at the very least, or maybe going into a little bit more detail on what is our
05:33growing understanding of how things played out with those two players. But yeah, deeply concerning.
05:41The season is, you'll be here in a blink of an eye and Wednesday just do not appear ready in any way,
05:47shape or form. The players that are remaining will clearly give everything. And, you know,
05:55we've seen Sheffield Wednesday sides in recent history sort of be perhaps at their best or squeeze
06:03a little bit more out when it's been them against the world. And we've, you know, written and spoken
06:08an awful lot about that. And they're going to have to pull on that again, I think.
06:12Yeah, I think another one of the concerns with Josh and Smudge is that the players add to the list,
06:19aren't they, of players that Wednesday have received concrete offers for, actual money offers,
06:28and they've said no. And to then lose them on a free, amidst all this financial turmoil,
06:35it just feels, it feels so back to front.
06:38It does. And look, this isn't the case where Wednesday have allowed, you know,
06:46willingly allowed players to run out of their contract, which we have seen in the past before.
06:52Yeah. But we're going to get one more season out of them. You know, both players had contracts
06:58extended, didn't they? Yeah.
07:00So that was the fact, you know, there would be no extension trigger beyond that.
07:05So heading into the final year of the contract, to lose them for free, as you say, is scandalous.
07:12And having had a little bit of insight into Wrexham's pursuit of Smudge,
07:19certainly in January, you know, it felt like there was an opportunity there to bring some money in.
07:26You know, no one would have been more glowing in their views on Smudge's contribution last year
07:33than me. I thought he was absolutely magnificent and changed the game so many times for Wednesday
07:40and obviously got important goal contributions along the way.
07:45But it was clear that Danny Real didn't see him as an indispensable player.
07:51You know, he was a little bit on the fringes, obviously, the second half of the season.
07:53He played him much more of a part. But if you think back to that January, you know,
08:00Smudge missed out on a couple of matchday squads, which felt like a statement to the top.
08:09Again, it's not one that I agree with, but it just felt like at that moment,
08:12perhaps that was an opportunity to get some money in for a striker, a very good striker,
08:18a huge contribution. But the other side of 30, for whatever reason,
08:23the manager didn't quite seem to fancy as much as some of the other players.
08:29Yeah, another example of Sheffield Wednesday not acting how perhaps they should
08:37or could be a bit wiser in the transfer market.
08:40Yeah, it feels very short-sighted, doesn't it?
08:42Like, considering that, you know, I don't look, I don't think anyone expected
08:47Sheffield Wednesday's financial situation to go like this.
08:51I don't think many people expected it to get this bad.
08:54But it's not like they were flush, you know, like the need for money
08:59or the need for cash has been well spoken about for a long time.
09:04So you would think that when the opportunity arises to get something that would help,
09:08you would like to see that, those opportunities taken a little bit more smartly, I think.
09:17On to the players that are still at Sheffield Wednesday.
09:22They're also in a bit of a predicament, aren't they?
09:24Because they, to some extent, kind of have two managers now.
09:31Yeah, it'd be interesting to be a fly on the wall, perhaps,
09:37and see exactly what that dynamic is.
09:40You know, I think we're not breaking any state secrets to suggest that
09:45it was our understanding and the understanding of just about everyone around it
09:49that Henrik Pedersen was extending his contract with a view
09:53to becoming Sheffield Wednesday manager once the negotiations with Danny had played out.
10:00And now Danny's back, which no one really expected.
10:06It will be a very interesting dynamic, I imagine,
10:10between the two of them and how things are run.
10:14Look, Danny's the manager.
10:16He's the name above the door.
10:17We gather that he's been giving team meetings and stuff.
10:20So, you know, it's not necessarily the situation where, you know,
10:25they're both pulling in different directions or anything like that.
10:28But I think there is still something to be played out here.
10:33And this is the madness of it.
10:35You've got two men contracted there.
10:38We are a little over three weeks to the start of the season.
10:45And you could flip a coin, perhaps,
10:47as to who's going to be the manager in the dugout at Leicester.
10:52You know, my guess, my feeling at the moment is that until things are sorted,
11:05you know, with Danny, who appears to have expressed, you know,
11:09a desire to continue with his role at Sheffield Wednesday,
11:13that's been communicated to people at the club,
11:16that he will be manager and where Henrik sits in that.
11:22You know, do you go back to just purely being assistant manager?
11:26What's the relationship between those two?
11:31Just, yeah, another chapter in what has been a carnage.
11:37Yeah.
11:37A carnage in not-in-all-fun few months.
11:40I think, because, I mean, I've been talking to various people
11:44from various organisations and clubs and stuff over the whole period of this.
11:49And I think one of the things that sticks out for me is that
11:51I don't think Wednesday are alone in anything that they're dealing with this summer.
11:57I think someone has dealt with these things, all of them.
12:01I'm not sure anyone's dealt with them all at once before.
12:03But, and I think that that is what is so draining and so miserable about this period
12:10is that it just feels like it's a constant stream of just sadness, really, now.
12:19It's getting to the point where it's like, I think that's where a lot of fans feel like they are.
12:23They're just sad.
12:24They feel like their club's been taken away from them.
12:28You know, there was a kit launch this week, by all accounts, you know.
12:32I mean, we're obviously not in the Megastore, but it looks like there's been a massive downturn
12:38in the amount of people buying the kits.
12:40Not surprising at 72 quid, a pop-a-mad.
12:43But it feels like, from a club perspective, the people that are working hard,
12:50the people that are trying to do their bit behind the scenes,
12:54that they can't win because this calamity that's going off all around it
13:01is just constantly going to overshadow it, isn't it?
13:05Yeah, I think so.
13:06And every time you have a quiet couple of days and it feels like something might be moving in another direction,
13:16you know, you get a couple of days like this.
13:18And, you know, the word that I've been seeing more and more on social media is numb.
13:26You know, you get numb and you get desensitized to this stuff
13:30when it's a constant drip, drip of negativity, really.
13:36And by the way, we take absolutely no pleasure whatsoever in, you know,
13:41breaking some of these stories and, you know, living in this constant sphere.
13:46But with the season around the corner, I think that numbness might turn to something else.
13:54And, you know, anger, deflation, whatever it might be,
13:57because the bottom line is there's going to be some foolhardy, very loyal people
14:02that are following that team up and down the country.
14:06And it could well be a long season.
14:09If it's not, you know, it'll be a tremendous achievement from everyone involved.
14:13Yeah, I mean, look, obviously, we don't know what's going to happen between now
14:16and the end of the transfer window in terms of embargoes, all that kind of stuff.
14:20But we don't know what kind of points deduction.
14:24I mean, I think it's safe to say there will be a points deduction at this point.
14:28We don't know how many that will be.
14:29But I agree.
14:31I think as things stand now, if Wednesday were to stay in the championship,
14:36it would be an incredible achievement.
14:39I think it'd be up there with anything they've achieved in recent years.
14:44And we just, we, I suppose this is the constant battle for us, isn't it?
14:48And I say us as in everybody involved in the club,
14:52is you just don't know what's around the next corner.
14:54You know, there's a SAG meeting going on today
14:58about whether the North stand is going to be ready to use.
15:01If that stands closed down, which, you know, is not impossible,
15:05even though, you know, not that long back,
15:08I did a story saying that Wednesday had committed to doing the work.
15:11We don't know if it's been done.
15:14That could just be another element to bring in.
15:18And look, that first game, that first home game could be,
15:22could be really, probably as toxic as I think Hillsborough's ever been,
15:31considering the current mood of the Sheffield Wednesday fan base
15:34and possibly as quiet as it's ever been as well.
15:37Well, that's it.
15:38And this feeling of numbness and it's been such a long and exhausting summer,
15:44I wonder, I wonder whether it will be, you know, an expression of anger
15:50or whether they'll just be however many thousand people
15:56sat in the seats that they have because they've paid for them
16:00and they're loyal and they can't think of a winter without Sheffield Wednesday
16:04and more power to them, just simply sat there watching a game of football.
16:09And, you know, we've seen it before, albeit not in, you know,
16:15the level of farce that we've seen over the last few months,
16:19that Hillsborough can be quite a, almost melancholy, you know,
16:28like a sad place to be.
16:31Yeah.
16:32And look, we'll see, you know, we gather that the supporters trust
16:36and some other bodies are involved in...
16:39...protest movements of some kind
16:43and we'll see what the appetite is for all that stuff.
16:48But, you know, clearly the feeling online is unanimous now, I'd say,
16:53and that certainly hasn't been the case around match days previously.
16:58Yeah, I mean, it would be hard for it to not be now, wouldn't it, really?
17:01Considering the scale of what we've seen in recent weeks,
17:06I think, you know, different people have their different times
17:09when they start to draw lines.
17:11And I think for some people, it will be the fact that two key players
17:17can, you know, terminate their contracts.
17:20For some, it will be when the non-playing staff are not getting paid at all.
17:25For others, it will be when the training ground can't be used
17:27because it's not ready.
17:28Like, various people have these different lines in the sand
17:31that they have as their tipping point.
17:34And it feels like probably 95, maybe more, percent of these fans now
17:39have simply had enough.
17:42And you just can't blame them, can you?
17:43Because Wednesday, at this point in time, you said fast before.
17:47I think I've used the word shambles more in the last six weeks
17:49than I have in the entirety of my life up until this point.
17:53And that's what it feels like.
17:54It just feels like a constant barrage of nonsense at Wednesday now.
17:58And I just don't know.
18:03And I think this is the saddest thing and the most worrying thing
18:06is that I don't know where it stops.
18:08Like, at this point, you know, the Mick McCarthy thing of it,
18:11you know, it can get worse.
18:12It really feels like that now, doesn't it?
18:14Like, it always feels like there's another thing
18:18that could be around the corner.
18:21Yes, I think it does.
18:22And ultimately, it stops for me with the successful sale
18:26of the football club.
18:27And to allow someone else to come in and get their hands on it.
18:31And, you know, pretty much everything that we've reported
18:35in the last months, you know, between us and Rob,
18:38obviously, at BBC Sheffield, barring little flickers here and there,
18:46it's all not heading in the direction that you'd want it to.
18:51Yeah.
18:51Or certainly not at the speed and style of process that you'd expect
18:58from the sale of an institution such as Sheffield Wednesday.
19:06Yeah, I mean, where it goes from here, as we keep saying
19:10and have been saying for several weeks, you know,
19:12Sheffield Wednesday was put on sale at a reasonable price,
19:16a market price, even a touch over that, and the process was sensible
19:22and above board, then I've no doubt that many people would come forward
19:31and want to engage in that process.
19:33As things stand, things have stalled.
19:35And we're not there yet, and I think that should be a concern
19:40because, as you say, you know, lurching from story to story
19:44and just Wednesday dropping further into the abyss,
19:49it's no way to exist.
19:54You know, the difficulties of the summer,
19:57without having an eye on the current accounts,
20:00you look at the wage bill, has that been halved, you know,
20:05or somewhere close to that?
20:07No.
20:10Some of the expenditure around the coaching staff as well,
20:13all but gone.
20:16And you just wonder now with, you know,
20:19there's a big chunk of TV money expected sometime soon
20:21if it's not already being paid in.
20:23There's match day revenue, you know,
20:26there'll be payments on all sorts of things coming up.
20:31Potentially a couple more transfers as well on top of that.
20:34Yeah, quite, quite.
20:36And you just wonder, don't you,
20:39if that would allow Chancery to sort of stumble on
20:43and continue and pay from the fat of the land, as it were.
20:47So, yeah, there's obviously the planned boycott of shirt sales,
20:53which you've already mentioned,
20:55but also within the stadium as well.
20:56So, yeah, it's all very unsettling to think where this might go.
21:03Yeah, because it does feel just like one lurch now, doesn't it?
21:06Like one lurch to the next one, you know.
21:09And I think Wednesday are in the position now where, look,
21:14they had at one point, not long back,
21:15three embargoes owed money to clubs, players, HMRC.
21:20Now it's just to clubs.
21:21But for how long?
21:22I mean, paydays in a couple of weeks.
21:24This one might be fine.
21:25We're going to be writing the same stories a month from now
21:28and a month after that and a month after that.
21:31And that is where we're at, isn't it?
21:32As a football club,
21:34when you live hand to mouth like this,
21:38that uncertainty and that numbness and that,
21:45I suppose, I think you used the word melancholy earlier.
21:47I think that general sense is where Wednesday are at now
21:51in everything that they do.
21:53But, yeah.
21:57And look, like we said, you know, sport is an amazing thing
22:02and, you know, it could well galvanise.
22:05But I don't think anyone's pretending anything otherwise.
22:08It's going to be a very, very difficult season.
22:12You know, Leicester away on the first day.
22:13You look at that and you, oh, that could be a long trip.
22:18But, you know, it's the nervousness.
22:22You touched on it before.
22:23There are some really, really outstanding people
22:26that work at that football club
22:27and work at that football club
22:29because they love that football club.
22:33And, you know, any sense of anxiety or nervousness
22:38heading into a payday,
22:42that takes things beyond football almost.
22:46You know, we've seen it before with,
22:48with teams that have struggled,
22:50that, you know, it can get to a point
22:52where that numbness sort of does drop in
22:53and it becomes, you know, looking towards next season
22:56or whatever it might be.
23:00But there's human beings at the heart of this.
23:02And as we've said a number of times,
23:05that's something that certainly, you know,
23:08reporting on this and being close to it,
23:10not impacted by it, you know, directly and tangibly.
23:13But that's something that I've really struggled
23:15to come to terms with.
23:16Yeah, it's been a very miserable few weeks.
23:20That's us done for this time around.
23:22I'm sure we'll have something to report this time next week.
23:26We will be back with the next episode of All Wednesday.
23:28Alex will be with me and we'll see you there.
23:29Cheers.
23:30Cheers.
23:59Cheers.
24:00Cheers.
24:00Cheers.
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