During a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing last week, Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) questioned Public Citizen Climate Program Director David Arkush over his past writings.
00:00Thank you, Senator Whitehouse. One final bit of questioning for you, Mr. Arcush.
00:05Define for this committee what homicide means.
00:10Oh, sure. So homicide is a legal term that refers to, it's essentially a blanket term for any form of unlawful killing.
00:18And an unlawful killing is causing death with a culpable mental state.
00:25Causing a death means substantially contributing to it or accelerating it.
00:29And a culpable mental state could be negligence, knowledge, recklessness.
00:33So you wrote an article in 2023 entitled, quote,
00:37Climate Homicide, Prosecuting Big Oil for Climate Deaths.
00:42In that article, you argue that oil and gas executives could be prosecuted, not just sued,
00:48but criminally prosecuted for homicide for murder based on climate change.
00:53Is that right?
00:54That's right. I mean, I would be careful with the wording because murder, again,
00:58is a technical term. And definitely we're not arguing that they could be prosecuted for first degree murder.
01:03That's killing with, you know, intent.
01:05But you want to put them in prison for homicide, lock them up, treat them as criminals, put them in.
01:11Murderers get put, people who commit homicide get put in jails with violent criminals.
01:16And your position is this is a reasonable and rational thing that we should put the people leading the energy companies in America producing 8.5 million jobs.
01:27We should arrest them and throw them in jail. Is that correct?
01:30It could be the case that some executives should be prosecuted in that way.
01:34Of course, you can't put a corporation in jail. So there are other remedies in that situation.
01:37But you can put human beings in jail and presumably you'd put the corporate officers in jail.
01:41Yes, you can.
01:42You'd prosecute them for murder. So don't let there be any ambiguity.
01:46And by the way, Senator Whitehouse was really eager to make clear that you're the minority witness.
01:50You're the witness he wanted. He was eager to introduce you.
01:53I'm going to go on the record as saying that is a moonbeam wacky theory that you want to prosecute people creating jobs and producing energy for murder.
02:06Let me ask you, Mr. Arcush, how did you get to the Capitol today?
02:09So here's what I want to tell you.
02:12How did you get to the Capitol today?
02:14I took an Uber.
02:15You took an Uber. Now, was that in an automobile?
02:17Yes.
02:18Did that automobile have gasoline in it?
02:21Yes, this is very, very cute. I see where this is going.
02:24So I'm glad you think it's cute.
02:25Under your theory, you emitted carbon emissions.
02:29Yep.
02:30Should you be arrested in this room right now and prosecuted for murder?
02:33No.
02:34Why?
02:35That's not what the law holds.
02:36Well, tell me why.
02:37Because you're willing to say the guy who sold you the gasoline should be prosecuted for murder.
02:41You're the one that benefited from it.
02:43Couldn't you have ridden a bicycle or maybe like some fairy dust to get here?
02:48The guy who sold the gas and 50 years ago knew that it was going to cause globally catastrophic damage that would cause problems for humanity.
02:59Wait, wait, wait.
03:00But you have exquisite knowledge of this.
03:01Hold on.
03:02You were saying you were an expert.
03:03Don't lie about it.
03:04On mens rea, you have a level of culpability because you claim that the act of getting in that car was violence, it was murder, that you should be locked up.
03:15Why do you get to violate these principles in a way that you just want to lock up the person who sold you the gas but not the beneficiary of it?
03:25That's your claim, not mine, because to be liable, there are a bunch of reasons, but one of them is you have to substantially contribute to the harm, to the death.
03:34How many car rides substantially? Is it one? Is it two? Is it ten? How many?
03:40A single individual couldn't possibly contribute enough. The point is…
03:43Well, what about if, say, you're a Democrat politician who flies private jets?
03:48It would be helpful if you're asking the questions. Doesn't he get to answer them?
03:52He gets to answer them in my time, just like he gets to answer them in your time when you are asking them.
03:59Seems like I don't get to answer them.
04:00So, what about Democrat politicians who fly private planes all the time, people like John Kerry, who say, for someone like me, a private jet is the only reasonable way to travel.
04:14John Kerry has the climate footprint of a small town in Tennessee. Would you prosecute John Kerry for murder?
04:24So, depending on how you calculate it, U.S. fossil fuel company, or the oil majors, private oil majors are responsible for around half of global emissions.
04:33My question was, would you prosecute John Kerry for murder?
04:36No, obviously not. No.
04:37Okay, so Democrat politicians are exempted.
04:39There is no individual…
04:40Democrat activists are exempted.
04:41I'm not going after people for carbon footprints, the whole thing is actually…
04:44Well, why not though?
04:45Under your principle, carbon is killing us.
04:48You claim it is homicide.
04:50By the way, this is a whack job theory.
04:52You teach in law school, if one of your law students wrote this on an exam, any law professor…
