" Tamam Masail Ka Hal Dialogue Hi Hai Lekin Un Kay Sath Jo Ikhtiyarat Rakhtay Hain " Rauf Hassan

ARY NEWS

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00:00Sir, tell us, at a time like this, when the preparations for 24th November were in full swing,

00:05this statement by Aleema Khan Sahiba, in which she confirmed that

00:09Ghandapur and Gaurav Sahab, both are very high profile people,

00:12they kind of asked for permission from Khan Sahab to contact them,

00:16to talk to them. Khan Sahab said, yes, of course.

00:18So, what would you call this? Is this a policy shift?

00:22Or is it an attempt to say, if that situation doesn't come up,

00:27then it's better. How would you interpret this development today?

00:33Thank you, Basim, once again. Thank you very much.

00:36See, the problem is that, as far as the call for 24th is concerned,

00:39that call is still there. There is no change in that.

00:45Now, with this establishment, you know that in the matter of dialogue,

00:50Khan Sahab had said this a long time ago, in fact, he had also formed a team.

00:55You know, I have said this in some of your programs and in many other programs,

01:02that ultimately, the solution to all problems is dialogue.

01:05And who has to have dialogue?

01:07Dialogue has to be with those who have the power,

01:10because there is no point in having a dialogue with anyone else,

01:15because they cannot reciprocate,

01:18they are not capable of coming to any kind of agreement.

01:24Although, I am saying this, in the middle of you, I remember,

01:26there was a statement from Adiala that now I am stopping talking to the establishment.

01:30Then, in our program, you were running the secretary at that time,

01:32you said that ultimately, there has to be dialogue, ultimately.

01:34On which some of your party workers got angry on social media at that time.

01:38But the same thing is happening today, which you rightly pointed out,

01:41that are you ready to talk today?

01:44Look, I know Mr. Bajaj Khan's mind,

01:47he has always been a member of a political party,

01:49and he has said it many times, Mr. Basim.

01:52We are a political party, and as a political party,

01:55we can never refuse dialogue.

01:58We can never refute dialogue.

02:00So, on this basis, I was sticking to my policy of dialogue.

02:05Yes, you are absolutely right that I had to face criticism.

02:09And some people had also asked questions to Mr. Khan in this system.

02:14So, that has passed.

02:16So, dialogue, look, if you talk about fighting,

02:21you know that at the end of the day,

02:24it ends up on the negotiating table,

02:26where there is a truce, armistice,

02:28you know, agreement, whatever it is.

02:31So, I...

02:32But, sir, practically speaking, do you think that

02:35this will give a hint of weakness?

02:37Because, practically speaking, it seems almost impossible,

02:41or it doesn't seem,

02:42that today is 19th, 24th,

02:44that is, in the next four days, the establishment should agree on this,

02:47that let's take back the 26th,

02:49let's take back the stolen mandate,

02:51and let's celebrate the 24th.

02:53Practically speaking, I don't think it will be possible.

02:55So, won't it reveal the weakness of PTI,

02:57that they made an attempt and the establishment said,

02:59we don't want to talk about it.

03:01Look, where I have always been convinced of dialogue,

03:04I and my think tank also work for peace,

03:09there I am also convinced that

03:11dialogue should never be considered a weakness.

03:14Dialogue, in fact, is a strength,

03:16is a strength, reflects confidence.

03:18That, yes, we know that we are on the right path,

03:21our stance is right,

03:23the stand that we have taken is right,

03:25but along with that,

03:27being a political party,

03:29it has to carry the other stakeholders along with it,

03:32and it should.

03:34So, in this context, I feel that,

03:36no, Mr. Wasim, this is not a weakness,

03:39but I feel that this is a sign of maturity.

03:42Okay, but sir, how much chance do you have

03:44to initiate a dialogue and then be successful?

03:47Look, it should have been initiated a long time ago,

03:51I also said this in your program,

03:53that instead of happening tomorrow,

03:55do it today, instead of happening today,

03:57it should have happened yesterday.

03:59So, even now, without wasting any time,

04:01it should be initiated.

04:03When it is initiated, then the results will come out.

04:06If you want me to speculate here

04:08that it will take two days, two weeks or two months,

04:10then I will not do that.

04:12For 27 years, the crisis in Ireland was going on,

04:15you know, terrorism was also going on there,

04:17and back-channel diplomacy,

04:19back-channel dialogue was also going on.

04:2127 years.

04:22So, I am not saying that we will take 27 years.

04:24The issues of this country, the situation at the moment,

04:27they believe in immediate, immediate,

04:29immediate, immediately,

04:31they believe in a solution.

04:33Consequently, if a dialogue starts,

04:35then I think that very quickly,

04:37and there is no confusion in this,

04:39what is the point of having a dialogue?

04:41Dialogue is only to be in this thing

04:43that all the state institutions of Pakistan

04:45will have to operate within their own limits.

04:48When this happens,

04:50then I think that all the other issues

04:52will move towards a solution.

04:54Sir, on this basis,

04:55Pakistan's big daily,

04:57its main headline,

04:59in Jalli Haroof,

05:01Ansar Abbasi writes, and I quote,

05:03Hukumat PTI Aala Satha, Aala Satee Raapta,

05:06Mumkina Breakthrough Ki Koshish,

05:08Muzakirat Kamiyab Huye,

05:10Toh 24 November Kehchaj Multa Bhi Ho Sakta Hai.

05:12Muzakirat Mein Shamil Afraat Ke Naam Afsha Huye,

05:14Toh Establishment Aur PTI Mein Mufamat Ki Koshish Bekar Ho Sakti Hain.

05:18Aap Isko Confirm Ya Deny Karte Hain?

05:22When I read this in the morning,

05:24I wake up and read it in the newspaper,

05:26I read at least 5-6 newspapers in the morning,

05:28holding it in my hand,

05:29I am an old man,

05:30till I don't get the newspaper in my hand,

05:32I don't enjoy reading the newspaper.

05:34When I read it, I said, here it goes again,

05:36Ansar Abbasi Sahib has a special reputation,

05:39that at such times,

05:41he finds his tune strange.

05:44This, only and only,

05:46in the morning,

05:48when I was reading this,

05:50I, the dialogue,

05:52our 24th protest,

05:56to sabotage it,

05:58one effort had to be made,

06:00and it still is,

06:02because Ansar Abbasi Sahib's projections and predictions,

06:05and if you say, Badami Sahib,

06:07I will do a program with you on this issue,

06:09out of that, you tell me one,

06:11which is right,

06:13which has been proven right.

06:15These are all agenda items,

06:16which he projects.

06:18Not at all,

06:19there was no such thing,

06:21and now, if we move towards the dialogue,

06:23if we move,

06:25then my prayers will be with him,

06:27that this dialogue,

06:29to solve the problems of this country,

06:31is an important step.

06:33Now, obviously, Ansar Sahib,

06:35to answer this particular question,

06:37he is not here right now,

06:38so he deserves the right to respond,

06:39but you have given your opinion on this,

06:41but sir, explain to me,

06:43that if anyone,

06:44Wasim Badami or Ansar Abbasi,

06:46gives this news right now,

06:48that there has been a contact between the government and PTI,

06:51then how did this conspiracy to sabotage the contacts happen?

06:56I did not talk about sabotaging the 24 contacts,

06:59I said,

07:00how did this conspiracy to sabotage happen?

07:03How?

07:04By spreading disinformation,

07:06by doing a lot of things,

07:08Ansar Sahib,

07:09Mashallah,

07:10has a very special reputation in this regard,

07:12and see,

07:13the dialogue has not started yet.

07:15Okay.

07:17Okay,

07:18so you are saying,

07:19that the workers will have a misunderstanding,

07:21that the workers will think that the conversation is going on.

07:23Is this what you are saying?

07:24Yes.

07:25Okay.

07:26Confusion is created,

07:27those who want,

07:28that our workers,

07:29our activists,

07:30they are confused,

07:32uncertain,

07:33that there is going to be a dialogue,

07:35that there is going to be a protest.

07:37This is a very thought-provoking scheme,

07:39and it is always,

07:40on such occasions,

07:41this kind of,

07:42you know,

07:43what should be said,

07:45this kind of,

07:46you know,

07:47attacks are made.

07:48Okay,

07:49noted,

07:50sir,

07:51fine.

07:52Now sir,

07:53tell me,

07:54what will you say to those people,

07:55for example,

07:56Governor Sindh said today,

07:57that no one needs to make any preparations,

07:59that before the 23rd,

08:00in the last moments,

08:01there will be a call for cancellation,

08:02before the 24th.

08:03By the way,

08:04Mr. Lauder said,

08:05I will not be surprised at all,

08:06if this call goes ahead.

08:08One,

08:09we have talked about it,

08:10that if the negotiations are initiated,

08:11if it is successful,

08:12then the dialogue will go ahead,

08:13that is a different thing.

08:14But now,

08:15in these circumstances,

08:16which have happened in the past,

08:17on some occasions,

08:18that the date has gone ahead,

08:19these people who are speculating,

08:20are doing this,

08:21in fact,

08:22they are saying with great confidence,

08:23Mr. Governor,

08:24what will you say to them?

08:25Look,

08:26whatever I am seeing,

08:27whatever preparations I am seeing,

08:28in those circumstances,

08:29Mr. Waseem,

08:30this 24th protest,

08:31I am not able to see it going ahead.

08:32This will happen on the 24th.

08:33In this regard,

08:34almost all the arrangements

08:35have been completed.

08:36So,

08:37I do not know

08:38about their source of information.

08:39This has happened in the past.

08:40Once,

08:41on the instructions of the establishment,

08:42we went ahead.

08:43You will remember.

08:44And you regretted later on,

08:45right?

08:46Yes,

08:47that protest,

08:48which I am seeing,

08:49which I am seeing,

08:50which I am seeing,

08:51which I am seeing,

08:52which I am seeing,

08:53which I am seeing,

08:54which I am seeing,

08:55that was also regretted later.

08:56that was also regretted later.

08:57But,

08:58I do not think,

08:59that the call on the 24th,

09:00Sir,

09:01if something unnecessary happens,

09:02that is another thing.

09:03There is no one control over it.

09:04There is no one control over it.

09:05If there is some

09:06breakthrough in the dialogue,

09:07If there is some

09:08breakthrough in the dialogue,

09:09frankly,

09:10of which,

09:11chances are,

09:12I see very little right now.

09:13So,

09:14that is another thing.

09:15So,

09:16but otherwise,

09:17the call on the 24th,

09:18the call on the 24th,

09:19the call on the 24th,

09:20I do not feel

09:21that

09:22you know,

09:23when we talk about

09:24I don't see a single chance that this will be done again.

09:29Correct.

09:30Okay.

09:31And sir, on a lighter side, there was a time when despite the judicial orders, the senior

09:37leaders were not allowed to meet.

09:39It also happened that at the same time, the leaders of three houses flew out of jail.

09:44In such a situation, Mr. Gandapur and Mr. Gauhar were allowed to go.

09:47In fact, I read that it was not a long visit.

09:49They met for an hour and a half or two hours and were allowed to meet.

09:52Are you satisfied with this?

09:55I say that whatever steps are being taken towards dialogue, I will welcome it.

10:01Because this is the solution to the problems of the country.

10:05So, facilitating today's meeting, is it possible that there is a step towards dialogue?

10:09A small step, but it may be possible.

10:11Yes.

10:12The dialogue between the establishment and the PTI, I use the word impasse.

10:19The country cannot move forward without this.

10:21Because the solution to the problems of this country is with the prisoner number 864.

10:26And there is no change in that.

10:28No one can replace it.

10:30So, the establishment and the PTI will have to sit.

10:32If not today, then tomorrow.

10:33If not tomorrow, then the day after tomorrow.

10:34The sooner the better.

10:35If someone goes towards this dialogue, I will absolutely reciprocate your sentiment, Mr.

10:40Waseem.

10:41If a dialogue starts in this country between the PTI and the establishment, then it will

10:46be a happy ending.

10:47It will be a step towards the problems of the country.

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