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00:00Today, all new, Oprah, on location in England.
00:05You've not spoken about Michael Jackson since his death.
00:08Lisa Marie Presley.
00:09Her one and only television interview.
00:12Are you struck between the parallel in your father's life and Michael Jackson's life?
00:17Was there a lot of pressure for you to have a baby?
00:20Why did the marriage end?
00:22Did you suspect a drug problem?
00:24Do you think you could have saved him?
00:25God.
00:26Did he have to die for you to recognize that he loved you?
00:31Next.
00:35For my exclusive interview with Lisa Marie Presley, we met in the English countryside, a world away from Los Angeles.
00:43Lisa is here working on her new album and spending some quality time with her husband, Michael Lockwood, and their twin girls.
00:49So the last time we talked, you did not have, um, baby girls.
00:59Mm-mm.
00:59Yeah, your children were, you know, teenagers.
01:02Now those teenage children are grown, practically.
01:05Mm-hmm.
01:06Um, Ben and Riley.
01:07Mm-hmm.
01:07What's that like, changing diapers 15 years later?
01:12I think now, when you're, uh, when you have children later, you, you are a lot more focused.
01:19Mm-hmm.
01:20And I, I know what's going to happen.
01:22Do you feel more confident?
01:23I feel more confident and I feel more focused and I want to spend as much time with them and I really, I don't want to lose any moments.
01:30I lost, when you're young and scattered, you tend to lose, you tend to lose moments that you don't, you know, you don't realize it's going to pass.
01:38Do you think that happened with Ben and Riley?
01:40I do a little.
01:41I, I, I was never not around.
01:43They were always with me.
01:44But I, my attention was scattered and dispersed for various reasons.
01:48Yeah, because you can be there and not be there.
01:50Right.
01:51Yeah, you can be present but still not be there.
01:54Exactly.
01:54Yeah.
01:54Is being away too from L.A. um, good for the children because we'd had a conversation earlier this summer, Lisa and I went hiking this summer, that's another story.
02:07Uh, but we'd had a conversation earlier this summer where we were talking about how the, kind of the culture of who's wearing what and how that, you know, transfers over to children is, you, you felt.
02:23Culture and lack thereof.
02:24You know, I think, um, what made me want to remove myself was just when I saw, um, in a magazine, a weekly magazine, it was a who wore it best between two, three-year-olds.
02:37What?
02:38And I thought, okay, okay, okay, wow, okay, we're, they're definitely out of here.
02:42Yeah.
02:42You know?
02:43It's gone too far, you think?
02:45I think that, I think that those, some children won't be able to have a life, uh, if it starts this young.
02:51Um, I think that I kept my, Ben and Riley, I kept, and nobody even knew I had a son, and a lot of people didn't even know I had a daughter until, uh, a lot of just, they were never out there.
03:03When they made the choice, um, to, to be out there is when they were known about and when they walked on their own, um.
03:10Can you be as famous as your father was famous, as famous as your former husband Michael Jackson was famous, as famous as you've grown up to be, and be normal?
03:28No, I can only answer for myself, I can tell you I'm not normal.
03:36And you have managed to be, you know, relatively very private, and that's why I'm, I'm thrilled that you're talking to me today.
03:46You've made a conscious decision to talk now, why?
03:49Every time I've ever had an interview in the past, I tend to get very defensive, because I was usually promoting something, and it would cross, it would always cross into my personal life, and I tended to want to never discuss the two, like, I don't want them to cross.
04:04I know that it's hard to have them not, but I wanted to sit and really have a conversation about, uh, things that are, you know, more on a personal level now, out of the way, before I do have an album coming out, which I will, uh, sometime next year, because once it's, I get that, you know, I get that.
04:23You, you didn't want to be in the position of promoting an album and having people ask you about Michael Jackson.
04:30Exactly.
04:31The star-crossed love affair between Lisa Marie Presley and Michael Jackson started in 1993.
04:38What began as friendship bloomed very quickly into something more, and in 1994, Lisa Marie shocked the world when she married Michael Jackson, and just a year and a half later, their marriage was over.
04:52They had not spoken for nearly a decade when Michael was found dead on June 25th, 2009, at a rented home in Los Angeles.
05:01You've not spoken about Michael Jackson since his death, other than the blog that you did.
05:06Right, and I really didn't speak well.
05:09When I see previous interviews, I'm barky, and I tend to want to skirt out of it, and I would find quick little exits defensively out of it.
05:19So, yeah, it's interesting, because the very first interview that we did together, when I asked you, was it a real relationship?
05:28You became a little barky and defensive because?
05:33Because I didn't understand my relationship with him.
05:36Well, you know, having gotten to know you since then, I understand your defensiveness coming from your point of view, but coming from my point of view, the viewer's point of view, the world didn't know what to make of that.
05:56Right.
05:57And really still doesn't know what to make of that.
05:59And therefore, your blog, after his death, where you said, I want to set the record straight, this relationship was not a sham, this was a real marriage, I think really struck a lot of people.
06:14And even when you said on my show, yes, this was a real marriage, there was a sexual relationship, and all of that, but the rest of the world, I think, thought it was a big, staged, publicity, something, I don't know.
06:30Do you understand that now?
06:31I completely understand, I do.
06:33I understand that because to some degree, he was a master at manipulating a little bit with the media.
06:39So I understand that there was, nobody really knew who I was, so they just assumed that I was going along with something that he would be doing.
06:48Absolutely.
06:49A lot of that is what I wanted to clear up in an interview, in this interview, was to explain.
06:55Mm-hmm.
06:55He was brought up that way, you know, before even answering questions about him or talking about him, it would need to be understood fully his life, which is completely different than anyone else's life that ever was,
07:08except for, you know, my father, he was conditioned to sort of get himself where he needed to go for his career and with his talent.
07:18And he became very good at making and creating and appearing and manipulating to some degree.
07:27It's true, but, but, see, and I always confused that manipulation, thinking that that manipulation was, that meant that he didn't love me, you know.
07:36But I understand it better now.
07:38The manipulation was because it was a survival tactic for him.
07:41Mm-hmm.
07:42So is, is it after his death that you have gained such clarity about the relationship?
07:47Yes, and I don't know why.
07:50I really don't understand that.
07:51Mm-hmm.
07:52But yes, this whole last year and a half has been spent trying to gain the clarity because at some point I pushed it away and I just had to move on with my life.
08:02And, and then that happened and it, and it, it was like a tidal wave.
08:06Where were you when you first heard?
08:08Where were you?
08:09I was in England, um, and I don't know why, but it was the strangest day of my life.
08:13I was crying all day.
08:15Mm-hmm.
08:16For what reason?
08:17I don't know and I don't normally do that.
08:19And I was, you know, trying to work and came home and I was literally cutting my food into my dinner crying.
08:24And, um, I wanted to go upstairs and go to bed and just watch something mindless on TV and stop crying.
08:32I looked at my husband.
08:33I was like, I don't know what is wrong with me.
08:34I just can't stop.
08:36And, um, and then an hour later the knock came and I, I heard.
08:40You heard?
08:41Who told you?
08:43Um, it was a friend of mine who just, and actually I got, started getting texts.
08:47Are you okay?
08:48Are you okay?
08:49So what's happening?
08:50Um, actually John Travolta was one of the first texts I got.
08:53Are you all right?
08:54Mm-hmm.
08:55And I said, what's happening?
08:56Is this actually happening?
08:57It was still unclear, you know?
08:59Mm-hmm.
09:00And, and your reaction, your first reaction?
09:03Real honest to goodness shock, not even tears, just, you know, I was floored, honestly floored.
09:13Coming up.
09:15During the time that you were married to him, did you suspect a drug problem?
09:24Mm-hmm.
09:29June 25, 2009.
09:31Apparently Michael Jackson suffered cardiac arrest this afternoon.
09:35He was rushed to UCLA Medical Center.
09:37People around the world were glued to their televisions
09:41as events unfolded in Los Angeles.
09:44By late afternoon, it was clear.
09:46Michael Jackson, the legendary pop star
09:49known by millions of fans around the world, has died.
09:53A little over one year later,
09:55I've come to England to talk to Lisa Marie Presley
09:57about their relationship and his death.
10:02The next day after Michael's death,
10:04you posted a very emotional thought on your blog.
10:07What made you do that?
10:10I think I was just rocking a baby to sleep
10:12and I was just in floods of tears.
10:15And I thought, I don't know, I had a moment of clarity.
10:18And I realized all this bitterness I thought I had
10:22and, you know, indifference.
10:27It was no longer. It all just came.
10:29I don't even, it's been so crazy, Oprah,
10:31that I don't even know how to explain how all of it's happened,
10:34which is why I waited over a year to talk about it
10:38because so many, there were so many phases of this.
10:40So let me help you through it here.
10:41Yes, please.
10:42Let me read an excerpt of what you wrote the day after Michael died.
10:45You said, the person I failed to help is being transferred right now
10:51to the L.A. County Coroner's Office for his autopsy.
10:54All my indifference and detachment that I worked so hard to achieve over the years
11:01has just gone into the bowels of hell.
11:05And right now, I am gutted.
11:10Gutted.
11:12I thought that was an interesting choice of words.
11:14That means gutted, empty, dug out, really.
11:19Mm-hmm.
11:20So did you feel that you had failed to help him?
11:26Yes.
11:27Okay.
11:27So in May of 1994, when you were married to him,
11:30or during the time that you were married to him,
11:32did you suspect a drug problem?
11:35Honestly, I didn't really suspect and catch on
11:39until just before I filed for divorce.
11:43You know, there was just an occasion, an incident,
11:46where he had collapsed and he was in the hospital.
11:49This is during the HBO?
11:50Mm-hmm.
11:51This was an appearance he was supposed to make.
11:54Yeah, an appearance for HBO, yeah.
11:55In December 1995, Michael Jackson collapsed on stage
11:59while rehearsing for an HBO concert special in New York.
12:03His doctor said Michael was suffering from a viral infection.
12:06Lisa Marie flew to his side in the hospital,
12:09where he stayed for six days.
12:12Everybody flew to the hospital,
12:15and it was very confusing what was wrong,
12:20because every day there was a different report,
12:23and I couldn't tell what was happening.
12:25Dehydration, low blood pressure, exhaustion, a virus.
12:29So I couldn't really get a straight answer
12:31as to what was happening with him,
12:33and I think we were all a little bit in the dark.
12:35And I, um, at that point, I think I really,
12:37I got from various, uh, indications,
12:41I believed that that was going on then.
12:43You thought that there was some drug use.
12:45Yes.
12:45Yeah.
12:46And, you know, there were times
12:48when I would pick him up from a certain doctor's office,
12:51and he would not be coherent.
12:54And there was some behavior now looking back at it.
12:57And I knew that that was, you know,
12:58because of injections, because they were painful,
13:00and he would need certain things because he needed to.
13:03So that...
13:03He would need things for what?
13:05Injections or whatever various dermatological, you know...
13:10Is this for his skin disease?
13:11Skin and various, uh, things he needed.
13:15Was it the kind of marriage
13:17where a lot of things went unsaid or unspoken,
13:21or did you feel a sense of intimacy and connection
13:24that you could ask him anything?
13:27I am...
13:28I honestly can tell you that it was in...
13:31It was every sense a normal marriage,
13:34and everything was spoken,
13:35and, you know, in the middle of the night,
13:37if he needed to wake up and tell me,
13:40and bounce something off me
13:42and wake me up and want to, you know, talk,
13:46or if there was trouble, or...
13:48I mean, it was great.
13:48Was he having trouble sleeping then?
13:50Yes.
13:51He was like a little gnome.
13:52I used to tell him he was like a gnome
13:54running around the room
13:54because it was hard for me to sleep.
13:56A lot of times I couldn't sleep either
13:58if he wasn't sleeping,
13:59so he would be...
14:00I'd just hear him piddling,
14:01and, you know, it was a bit endearing,
14:04but then...
14:05And I didn't mind it,
14:06but he did have a hard time sleeping, yes.
14:09Did you feel like you were,
14:11in many ways,
14:13a nurturer, caretaker for him?
14:15Very much.
14:16And I really loved that role,
14:19and I loved taking care of him.
14:21It was my...
14:22It was the highest point of my life,
14:25one of the very highest points of my life,
14:26was when things were going really well,
14:28and he and I were united together,
14:31and he and I had an understanding
14:33about some of the people
14:34and things that could go on around him,
14:36and he was with me on those things,
14:39and we were a unit,
14:41and I could take care of him,
14:43and in spite of what some people speculated
14:46while I was with him,
14:47that I wanted a career
14:48or that I was trying to do something,
14:49it was absolute BS.
14:51I've never been comfortable
14:52being front and center, honestly.
14:55Don't like attention on me.
14:57Loved being next to him
14:59and taking care of him.
15:00I was on such a high doing that
15:02that I don't, you know,
15:04that it was a very profound time in my life,
15:08so it wasn't anything...
15:10It was real as far as that goes.
15:13I heard you said to the producers
15:15that being with him
15:16was some of the highest highs for you,
15:18as you just described,
15:20and also the lowest lows.
15:21Yes.
15:21What was the lowest low?
15:22The lowest was...
15:26You know, again,
15:28when I talk about him,
15:29I don't...
15:29I now, in retrospect,
15:31want to make very clear
15:32that I understand him now
15:35more than I ever did,
15:36so when I speak about him,
15:38I can speak about him
15:39with understanding,
15:42and it's all good now.
15:44For some reason,
15:45I don't know what happens
15:46when someone passes away,
15:48and this is what's become of it,
15:49but I've come to have
15:52all this love again
15:53and understanding for him,
15:55and I don't know why
15:55it had to take all that
15:57to have this happen.
15:58That upsets me a bit, but...
16:00The love...
16:00Because were you angry with him before?
16:02I was angry.
16:03You were angry with him
16:04when you left the marriage.
16:05I was very angry.
16:06I was so angry
16:07because I felt that we had such...
16:10We were so united,
16:12and then at some point,
16:13he pushed me out.
16:15Why did the marriage end?
16:18There was a very profound point
16:21in the marriage
16:22when he had to make a decision.
16:24Was it the drugs
16:25and the sort of vampires
16:26or me?
16:28And he pushed me away.
16:29Vampires?
16:30Meaning people that are
16:31sort of spiders, vampires.
16:34Sick of it, sucking his blood.
16:36Yeah.
16:37So you saw that all around him.
16:39Oh, God, yes.
16:39Yes.
16:41And it was...
16:41Many people talk about that
16:43in stories written about him.
16:44He seemed to be drawn to people
16:46who would take advantage of him.
16:48What was that?
16:49The one thing that correlates
16:50with Michael and with my father
16:53on this subject
16:54is that they had the luxury
16:56of creating whatever reality
16:58around them they wanted to create.
16:59They could have the kinds of people
17:02who were going to go
17:02with their program
17:03or not go with their program.
17:04And if they weren't,
17:05then they could be disposed of.
17:06It's the reality of being
17:08a God in your own world.
17:10Right.
17:11And this is something
17:12that I've had
17:14way too much experience with
17:16on both sides
17:18where I've seen
17:19what can go on
17:21and that is...
17:22My way or the highway.
17:25Right.
17:26Michael wasn't a bad person
17:27because that's how he functioned.
17:28He didn't know any better.
17:29It wasn't that, you know...
17:30I took it very personally, though.
17:32I felt I was disposable.
17:33You know?
17:37And it was the same with my father.
17:38Sometimes I sit and I think
17:39there have been times
17:40when I've been angry
17:41at the people around him.
17:42Why didn't you stop him?
17:43Why didn't you say something?
17:44Well, because if you did,
17:45you were out.
17:46It's very simple.
17:48And he didn't mean anything either.
17:49So he wasn't the kind of person
17:50he wasn't,
17:51nor your father was,
17:53the kind of person
17:54who wanted people around him
17:55telling them the truth.
17:56He wanted to be told
17:57what he wanted to hear.
17:59When it's this unusual reality
18:01and an ivory tower
18:02and this God-like life
18:03mixed with an addiction,
18:06that's when you get into trouble.
18:07A lot of trouble.
18:09August 16, 1977,
18:12nine-year-old Lisa Marie
18:13was home at Graceland
18:14when her father, Elvis,
18:16suddenly collapsed
18:17in his bathroom and died.
18:18There was a lethal mix
18:20of 14 prescription drugs
18:22in his system.
18:24Are you struck between
18:25the parallel in your father's life
18:28and Michael Jackson's life?
18:29Your father and your former husband?
18:31Yes, it really blows me away,
18:35to be honest with you.
18:36I still try to figure out
18:37why, what is it
18:40that I had to go through twice
18:41where these two incredible people,
18:44and I speak, you know,
18:46with the utmost respect and love
18:47because I had that for both.
18:50Your father and Michael?
18:52Yes, who had the same fate.
18:54What is it about me?
18:55Why did I have to just,
18:56I went through it once,
18:57that was painful
18:58and I went through it again
19:00and I don't quite understand it,
19:02you know?
19:05Coming up,
19:06you think there was
19:07a big part of you
19:08that didn't want to see the truth?
19:10The truth in what way?
19:12The truth about the drugs.
19:13When we were hiking this summer,
19:25Lisa shared something with me
19:26that I think you all
19:27will find interesting.
19:30This is a home in Los Angeles
19:31where Michael Jackson died.
19:34Across the street,
19:36just a stone's throw away,
19:37was Elvis Presley's California home
19:40where Lisa Marie
19:41spent a lot of time growing up.
19:43What about the irony of that?
19:47Just across the street.
19:49It's, my mother,
19:51when I came home
19:51after being in England
19:52for so long,
19:53I wanted to drive by
19:55and see where it was
19:56and I lived there
19:56up until after he died,
19:57she sold it.
19:58So, and I had
19:58several birthdays there
20:00and I said,
20:03she said,
20:04it's right across the street.
20:04I said, oh please,
20:05it's not right across the street.
20:07You're being, you know,
20:08whatever,
20:09shoot her off.
20:10And I drove
20:11and it literally,
20:12I was completely,
20:13you know,
20:15I don't even know
20:15how to describe that,
20:17how that felt.
20:20Because I,
20:21and I don't even know
20:21if he knew,
20:22that was just another thing
20:23where,
20:24these things keep happening
20:26and I still,
20:27in the universe,
20:28and I'm okay,
20:29then what is it
20:29that I'm trying to learn here?
20:31What is it that I need to know?
20:33I thought it was interesting
20:34when you wrote the blog
20:35the day after
20:36Michael Jackson's death,
20:38you titled the blog
20:39He Knew.
20:42What did he know?
20:44When I was watching
20:45the footage
20:45of the ambulance
20:48backing out
20:49of the driveway
20:50and I went back
20:51to this conversation
20:52that I had with him
20:52at Neverland
20:53in the library,
20:53we were sitting
20:54by the fire
20:54and he was telling me
20:59that he was afraid
21:01that he was going
21:01to end up like my father.
21:03You know,
21:03he was always asking me
21:05about when he died
21:06and how it happened
21:06and when it happened
21:08and where.
21:10Michael was always asking you
21:11about your father.
21:12Yes.
21:13And he said,
21:14I feel like I'm going
21:15to end up the same way.
21:17And did you say why?
21:19Yeah.
21:19I was like,
21:20what are you talking about?
21:21And I don't understand
21:22down to the play
21:24by play by play
21:26incident was identical.
21:28First of all,
21:29you were much younger then.
21:32But as you look back
21:34at your marriage to him
21:37and who you were
21:38in that marriage,
21:39do you think
21:40there was a big part of you
21:42that didn't want
21:43to see the truth?
21:48The truth in what way?
21:50The truth about the drugs.
21:51I was so naive then,
21:53but I know it's not easy
21:55to believe that now,
21:56but.
21:57Well,
21:57it is easy to believe
21:58we can understand
21:59the state of mind
22:00you were in.
22:02So first of all,
22:04you growing up
22:05as Elvis Presley's daughter
22:07and being in your own right
22:11who you are,
22:13you wouldn't be excited
22:14about being married
22:15to Michael Jackson.
22:16It's not like some fan
22:18who ended up married
22:19to Michael Jackson.
22:20because you're used
22:21to the fame life.
22:23So you fell in love
22:24with him because of?
22:27For him.
22:28Because he was
22:29an incredibly dynamic person.
22:32If you were in his vicinity
22:33and he wanted to give,
22:37and he gave,
22:37and he showed you
22:38who he was
22:39if he was willing
22:40to do that
22:40in any way,
22:42man,
22:42I have never felt
22:43so high in my life.
22:44I have never felt
22:46so high in my life
22:47as that,
22:47and I am not lying
22:49when I say that.
22:50He had something
22:51so intoxicating
22:52about him,
22:54and when he was on
22:54and when he was ready
22:55to share with you
22:56or give it to you
22:57and be himself
22:59and allow you
23:00to come in,
23:01I don't know
23:02if I've ever been
23:02that intoxicated
23:04by anything.
23:05I can hear
23:07what you're saying
23:07because when I first
23:08interviewed,
23:09first met him
23:10before the interview
23:11in 1992,
23:13it's like he shines
23:14his light upon you.
23:16He, like,
23:16when he opens that,
23:18opens himself up
23:19and lets that light through,
23:21you just want to be
23:22in that.
23:22Yes.
23:23You want to be in that,
23:24you want to be around that,
23:25and, you know,
23:26we were all at Neverland
23:28and eating the candy
23:29and having a great time,
23:30and I left thinking,
23:32gosh,
23:32I wish I could be his friend.
23:34Yeah.
23:34It was like a drug.
23:35He was like a drug for me.
23:37I felt like I just
23:37always wanted to be around him.
23:39I always wanted to be part of him.
23:40I just,
23:40I felt so high.
23:41I've never felt like that
23:42around another human being
23:43except for one,
23:44you know,
23:45which was my father.
23:46It's so interesting
23:47because you just said it.
23:50You were nine years old
23:51when your father died.
23:52Never felt that feeling before,
23:54so in many ways,
23:55being with Michael
23:56brought back that feeling
23:58of that light falling on you,
24:00that being, you know,
24:02all of that energy coming your way.
24:05Yes.
24:05Did you feel loved by Michael
24:07in the beginning?
24:08Very much so.
24:09I don't think I realized it
24:10at the time
24:11how much what that meant
24:12because I know
24:13that that was very unusual for him.
24:15I know he'd had a few dates
24:16in his life,
24:16but there was nothing
24:17profound for him
24:20in that area,
24:21and he fell in love with me
24:24and I fell in love with him
24:25and it was very real.
24:27How did he ask you to marry him?
24:29We were in the library
24:30in front of the fire
24:31and he pulled this giant
24:3310-carat diamond
24:34out of his pocket
24:35and put it on my finger.
24:37I think he got on his knees
24:38as well and proposed.
24:40And at the time he proposed,
24:42did you think
24:42that it would be forever?
24:44I did.
24:45I don't, you know, I did.
24:46And when I was younger,
24:48I can honestly say
24:49that you can think like that
24:51and believe that.
24:55You know, from the outside,
24:56it just seems so
24:57that, you know,
24:59two extraordinarily famous people
25:02together,
25:03everywhere you went,
25:04seemed somewhat like a circus.
25:06It was.
25:07It's true.
25:08But, you know,
25:08that didn't happen that often.
25:10We were together a lot
25:12and there was no cameras.
25:14And I think a lot of that
25:15was because the promo for history
25:18started to come
25:18and then we had to appear here
25:19and do this and do that.
25:20And that was all very manipulated,
25:22which I understand
25:23comes across
25:24as very manipulated, period.
25:26Did you ever feel manipulated
25:28in the relationship?
25:29Sometimes.
25:30But he knew I didn't love that
25:31and he was okay.
25:32He got it.
25:32I mean, he would,
25:34he needed to do his thing.
25:35I would be there
25:36uncomfortably,
25:38like the MTV thing.
25:40And his hand was blue
25:41after we got off that stage.
25:43I know he showed me
25:44and it was, you know,
25:46completely blue.
25:46I squeezed it so hard.
25:48I did not want to do that.
25:50You know, it was just,
25:50it's not in my nature
25:51to do that sort of thing.
25:53So, but I understood it.
25:55As his wife, I had, you know,
25:57I needed to do
25:57some things like that.
26:00Coming up.
26:02You divorced
26:02and several months later,
26:06it was announced
26:07that Debbie Rowe was pregnant.
26:08How did you feel about that?
26:20Lisa Marie and Michael Jackson
26:22had been married for a year
26:24when he released
26:24the intimate music video
26:26for You Are Not Alone.
26:27So, was there a lot of pressure
26:31for you to have a baby?
26:32Yes.
26:33There was quite a bit.
26:34I mean, he was...
26:35From the time you got married?
26:36Mm-hmm.
26:37There was, and I did want to.
26:38I just kept,
26:39I just wanted to make sure,
26:40I was looking into the future
26:42and I was thinking,
26:43I don't ever want to get into
26:45a custody battle with him.
26:47I don't want to do this.
26:48I don't want to go head-to-head with him.
26:49So, I need to make sure
26:50that everything around is good.
26:51I know I've had children.
26:53I knew bringing children
26:54into certain circumstances,
26:55you have to make sure
26:56everything's safe
26:57and secured and okay.
26:58And I wanted to make sure
27:00that he and I
27:00were really, really united
27:02because we were going
27:03to be up against so much.
27:04I can't remember
27:05the exact month
27:06you all divorced,
27:07but you divorced
27:09and several months later,
27:13I know by October,
27:15it was announced
27:16that Debbie Rowe was pregnant.
27:18Mm-hmm.
27:18How did you feel about that?
27:22Well, I knew that it was
27:23a bit of a retaliatory act
27:25on his part
27:26because I didn't, you know,
27:31have a baby.
27:33And I know that she was there
27:36the whole time
27:36telling him she would do it.
27:39You knew that?
27:40He would tell me.
27:41He would come tell me.
27:42If you're not going to do it,
27:42Debbie said she'll do it.
27:43And I was like,
27:44what is that?
27:45Hi.
27:46Not going to entice me.
27:49Um,
27:50so we would get into it,
27:52you know,
27:52arguments
27:53because that really
27:54wasn't how to handle it.
27:55But that's how he knew
27:56how to handle it.
27:56I don't want to say,
27:57you know,
27:57he, he, like I said,
27:59he would be like,
27:59well, if you're not going to,
28:00this person will.
28:01Are you going to do it or not?
28:03That's what you mean
28:03by disposable.
28:04Yes.
28:05That's exactly what I mean.
28:07Oh, I get it.
28:08Well, there are not many men
28:09who would say,
28:10you either have a baby for me
28:11or I got somebody
28:12standing in the wings.
28:13Right.
28:13And it's,
28:14it sounds,
28:14you know,
28:15hindsight 2020.
28:16I understand him so well now.
28:17Um,
28:18but at that time,
28:20I didn't.
28:21I was hurt.
28:22I was hurt.
28:23And,
28:24you know,
28:25I did things
28:25that hurt him,
28:27you know,
28:27and I did stupid things too.
28:29Like?
28:30Like,
28:31I was very torn
28:32because I broke up my family.
28:34Uh,
28:35I left my husband
28:36for Michael.
28:38And I was having a hard time
28:39trying to process that.
28:42Lisa Marie was 20 years old
28:45when she married
28:45her first husband,
28:46musician Danny Keough.
28:48Together,
28:49they had two children,
28:50Riley and Ben.
28:51After more than five years together,
28:53Lisa Marie divorced Danny.
28:5520 days later,
28:57she was married again
28:58to Michael Jackson.
28:59While I was with Michael,
29:02I was still trying to process
29:03what I had done.
29:04I never could feel good about it.
29:06I felt like,
29:07how could I have done that to somebody?
29:08And I had these two little ones.
29:10And,
29:10uh,
29:11Danny was still very much
29:12part of my life.
29:13Michael didn't quite know
29:14what to do with that sometimes.
29:15And that made him uncomfortable.
29:17And I understood that.
29:18Michael would wonder,
29:19why are you in Hawaii with Danny?
29:21I'd take a vacation
29:22and Danny would go.
29:24And Michael would get upset.
29:26And where are you?
29:27And then he would disappear
29:28for a couple weeks
29:28and I couldn't find him.
29:29Or,
29:30you know,
29:30things would make him uncomfortable.
29:32And when I would do things
29:33that would make Michael uncomfortable,
29:35if he got uncomfortable
29:36or felt vulnerable,
29:39he would ice you out
29:40as a mechanism.
29:42He'd push you away
29:43and ice you.
29:44It was like a shark
29:45sometimes in that way.
29:46You could just,
29:47that's it.
29:48You know,
29:48you've done him wrong
29:49or whatever,
29:49so you were out.
29:50and I did some,
29:52we had moments like that.
29:54But I have to say
29:54in retrospect
29:55that he honestly
29:58tried so hard
30:00and went through
30:01so much with me.
30:02And I know now
30:02and I look back at it,
30:03he's never done that
30:04with any other female
30:05or anyone
30:06as much as we went through
30:08and when we hit rough waters.
30:09And we would argue
30:11for three-day arguments,
30:12sometimes taking a break
30:13to eat and sleep.
30:14Wow.
30:15You know,
30:15I'd have to say
30:16that I really admire
30:19that he really gave it
30:20a good shot.
30:22You know,
30:22I didn't appreciate it then
30:23and I wish I did.
30:26Coming up,
30:27Lisa tells me
30:28about the last time
30:29she spoke to Michael Jackson.
30:42Did he have to die
30:43for you to recognize
30:45that he loved you?
30:50Um,
30:51I think,
30:51I think so,
30:52sadly.
30:53Is that the first time
30:55you recognized
30:55or believed
30:56that he truly loved you
30:57after he died?
31:00Um,
31:00I think
31:01yes.
31:04Sweeping answer
31:05would be yes.
31:06When we were together,
31:07we were really in love
31:08and then
31:09we had the rough patches
31:11and then
31:11I had to make a decision
31:13to walk
31:13because I saw
31:14that the drugs
31:15and the doctors
31:16were coming in
31:16and they scared me
31:17and put me right back
31:19into what I went through
31:19with my father
31:20so I,
31:22that ended it
31:23and then
31:23we,
31:24again,
31:25were going to get back together
31:26for,
31:27we still spent
31:27four more years
31:28after we
31:29divorced,
31:31getting back
31:31together
31:32and breaking up
31:33and talking about
31:33getting back together
31:34and breaking up
31:35and,
31:35and at some point
31:37I had to push it away
31:38because it was just not,
31:40it just,
31:40I wasn't moving forward
31:42with myself.
31:43So you still loved him
31:44even when you left him?
31:46Very much.
31:46I left him
31:49to put in my,
31:50to sort of
31:51stomp my foot
31:52into the ground
31:52and go,
31:54I was trying
31:55to take a stand
31:55and say,
31:56come with me,
31:57don't do this
31:58and it was a stupid move
32:00because he didn't
32:00and he was just,
32:02you know,
32:02he's a stubborn,
32:03I'm stubborn,
32:04he's stubborn,
32:05the two of us,
32:06it was like,
32:07you know.
32:08Don't make a dare
32:08you're not willing
32:09to follow through on.
32:10Right.
32:11So I,
32:11I made a stupid move
32:12and,
32:12and I,
32:13actually afterwards,
32:15you know,
32:15he and I were still,
32:18you know,
32:18I,
32:18I was flying
32:20all over the world
32:20still with him
32:21for years to follow.
32:23When was the last time
32:24you spoke to him?
32:26A coherently
32:27good conversation
32:28was in 2005.
32:31It was a very long conversation
32:33and I was so removed
32:34from him
32:35and he could feel it
32:36and he could hear it
32:37and I think that's one
32:38of the things
32:39that killed me
32:39in the end too
32:40was that I was
32:40very distanced
32:42and he was checking
32:43to get a read.
32:44You know,
32:45he was trying
32:45to throw a line out
32:46to see if I would bite
32:47emotionally
32:48and I wouldn't.
32:49I was pretty shut off
32:50at that point
32:51and I don't even know
32:52how I managed
32:53to be like that
32:53but I was
32:54and he was asking me,
32:55he wanted to tell me
32:56that he,
32:58that I was right
32:59about a lot
33:00of the people around him
33:00and that it had panned out
33:02to be exactly
33:03what he and I
33:04had talked about
33:05years ago
33:05and he asked
33:07if I still loved him
33:08and we went
33:09into a whole thing
33:10about that
33:11and I told him
33:11I was indifferent
33:12and he didn't like
33:13that word
33:13and he cried
33:14and he was just
33:15trying to find out
33:16where I was at
33:17and how I could
33:18become so detached
33:19and then the final part
33:21of the conversation
33:22was him telling me
33:25that he felt
33:25that someone was going
33:27to try and kill him
33:28to get a hold
33:30of his catalog
33:30and his estate
33:32and I really didn't know
33:34what to do with that.
33:36So he actually gave you names?
33:38He did
33:39and I would like
33:40not to say them
33:41but he expressed
33:42to me
33:43his concern
33:44over his life.
33:48Coming up.
33:50As you stood
33:50over his casket
33:51were you able
33:52to make peace?
33:54You know
34:04I asked you this
34:05and I have to ask it again
34:07even though
34:08it's an uncomfortable subject
34:09but when you were
34:11on the show
34:11the first time
34:12I think I asked you this
34:13whether you had
34:15ever seen
34:15any inappropriate
34:17behavior
34:18between Michael Jackson
34:20and young children.
34:22Are you asking me again?
34:24I'm asking you again.
34:26The answer is
34:27absolutely
34:27not
34:29in any way.
34:29I did not see
34:31anything like that.
34:32So by 2005
34:33I think
34:34when he was on trial
34:35for the second charge
34:36your feelings
34:38at that time
34:39were what?
34:40Did he ever talk
34:40to you about it?
34:41He was calling me
34:43about it
34:43and I said
34:44please keep
34:45your head together
34:46please
34:47if this goes to trial
34:48please hold it together
34:49and he said
34:50what are you talking about?
34:51What do you mean?
34:51And I said
34:52you mean drugs?
34:53I said yes
34:53because all I saw
34:55you know
34:55there was a few year period
34:57there where
34:57random things were coming out
34:59whether it was
34:59a Martin Bashir interview
35:00or various interviews
35:01and in those interviews
35:03I saw him
35:04intoxicated.
35:05I didn't see
35:06Michael that I knew
35:07in that Martin Bashir interview.
35:09He was high as a kite
35:10from what I saw
35:11and from what I knew.
35:12Really?
35:12He was either
35:13too speedy
35:14or he was sedated.
35:16It wasn't the Michael
35:17that I knew.
35:18The shocking things
35:19he said some pretty
35:20shocking things
35:20in that Martin Bashir interview
35:22particularly
35:23about how he felt
35:25it was okay
35:26to sleep with young children.
35:28I think he said
35:29that stuff sometimes
35:30to be defiant
35:31because he got so angry
35:32at having been accused.
35:35I think that sometimes
35:35he was such a little
35:37stubborn rebel sometimes
35:38and he was like a child
35:39and he would just say
35:40what he felt
35:41everyone didn't want him to say.
35:43I don't feel like
35:44he had a straight head
35:46during those things
35:48and I think
35:48that they were edited
35:49in a very, very manipulative
35:51nasty way.
35:55So you never saw anything
35:56and to this day
35:58you don't believe
35:59that any of those charges
36:00were true?
36:01No.
36:02I mean, I honestly cannot say
36:05the only people
36:06that are ever going to be able
36:07to honestly say the truth
36:08are him and whoever
36:08was in the room
36:09at the time
36:09of whatever allegedly took place.
36:12I was never in that room.
36:13It would be unfair
36:14for me to...
36:15I can tell you
36:16I never saw
36:17anything like that.
36:19Have you now made peace
36:20with his death?
36:23I know you watched
36:25the funeral
36:26that we all saw
36:27on television
36:27and I know that you
36:29went to the private
36:30funeral ceremony.
36:33What was that like?
36:33Standing in the room
36:35with his casket.
36:37That was really
36:46another six months
36:48of more to recover from
36:50I think.
36:52But, you know,
36:53I was the last one
36:55standing with him
36:55and that was...
37:01What do you mean
37:01last one standing?
37:02Well, most people had left
37:03and I went back in
37:04and I was alone with him
37:05and I'm standing over him.
37:08You know, I didn't
37:09want to leave him.
37:10So.
37:12As you stood over
37:13his casket,
37:15I know it's, you know,
37:17there's probably
37:18nothing more, you know,
37:21personal or private
37:22than those moments.
37:26As you stood over
37:26that casket,
37:27were you able
37:29to make peace?
37:30No, I don't think
37:35I could make peace then.
37:36I think that I
37:37more wanted to apologize
37:39more was like
37:40I felt like
37:44I wanted to apologize
37:44for not being around.
37:49You know?
37:49Do you think
37:50you could have saved him?
37:51God, that's
37:52such a hard question.
37:56Naively, I want to say
37:57I know that it's
38:00naive to think
38:00that I could have,
38:01but I wanted to.
38:03Could I have?
38:04Had I made a call?
38:06Had I stopped
38:06being so
38:08shut off from him?
38:10Had I just said,
38:11how are you?
38:12Can I
38:12try to make a phone call?
38:14You know,
38:15I really did regret
38:16that I didn't.
38:16Do you think
38:19that family
38:21and friends
38:23let him down?
38:25Do you think
38:26that somebody
38:27could have done something?
38:28I think that they tried
38:29and sadly,
38:33like I said,
38:34if he didn't want
38:35you around,
38:35if you were going
38:36to make him
38:36confront something
38:36he didn't want
38:37to confront,
38:37he could make it
38:38go away,
38:38including his own family.
38:40They got on
38:41the opposite side
38:41of that.
38:42I think that was
38:43a train headed
38:44in a certain direction
38:44that I don't know
38:46if anyone could have
38:47stopped.
38:47And I've had to
38:48really get my head
38:49around that
38:50in order to stop
38:50the pain.
38:52For yourself?
38:53Mm-hmm.
38:54Mm-hmm.
39:03And how is this
39:04for your current
39:08husband,
39:09who seems like
39:10a really loving,
39:12generous,
39:13supportive man,
39:16how is it for him
39:18with all this
39:18Michael stuff
39:19coming up?
39:20He's so happy
39:20I'll be done
39:21with this interview.
39:22He's just like,
39:23I want you to just
39:23exercise this
39:24and get it out
39:25because I've been,
39:27you know,
39:27he's had to hear it
39:28for so long.
39:30Never good for
39:30the current husband
39:31to have to hear
39:32about the ex-husband
39:33a lot.
39:33No, it's not.
39:34It's not, no.
39:35And I understand that.
39:36But he also understands.
39:37He's the most
39:38understanding person
39:38I've ever met
39:39in my life.
39:40and I've never,
39:41you know,
39:42I thank God
39:43because he's really
39:44allowed me to go through
39:44whatever I need
39:45to go through
39:45with this,
39:46which I know
39:46would be highly,
39:47highly unusual.
39:48And it's a lot
39:48to ask for of him.
39:50And I don't feel
39:51good about it,
39:52but it's something
39:52that came down on me
39:54that I've had to deal with.
39:56And I've been doing it.
39:58Because all these
39:58Michael feelings
39:59were repressed
40:00and buried
40:00when you started
40:02dating Michael Lockwood.
40:04Exactly.
40:04You said earlier
40:06that the universe,
40:09God,
40:10you don't understand,
40:11is trying to teach
40:12you something,
40:13obviously,
40:14because of the parallels
40:15between your father,
40:17Elvis Presley's life,
40:18and Michael Jackson's life.
40:20Now,
40:21with over
40:22a year
40:24after Michael's
40:25death
40:26and
40:2733 years
40:29since your father
40:30passed,
40:31what do you think
40:32the lesson is
40:33for you?
40:35I feel really alone
40:37in that I've gone
40:38through this
40:38with these incredible
40:39people like this.
40:41And I feel really
40:42honored at the same time.
40:44And with Michael's death,
40:45is it for you,
40:47like a lot of people still,
40:49his birthday,
40:51the anniversary
40:51of his death,
40:53all of those
40:54are still hard days?
40:57They are,
40:58but it's been happening
40:58all my life.
41:00August 16th,
41:00I've dreaded my whole life,
41:02which has been,
41:03you know...
41:03The death of your father.
41:04Right,
41:05and now,
41:05you know,
41:06it's Dune 25th.
41:08You said that you,
41:09when we talked about
41:10doing this interview,
41:11you said,
41:11I'm going to do it
41:12one time.
41:13Yes.
41:14So this is it?
41:15You're not going to
41:15talk about it anymore?
41:16No, I'm not.
41:17I'm not going to talk
41:18about it.
41:18If anyone wants to know
41:19in the future,
41:20they can refer
41:21to The Oprah Winfrey Show.
41:23Thank you.
41:24Thanks for letting me
41:25have the time, really.
41:26Well, thank you.
41:26And for opening up about it.
41:28Not an easy thing to do.
41:29Thank you.
41:34Thank you.
41:35Thank you.
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