- 22/06/2025
Kevin Owen (Mark Hadfield) is accused of robbery and assault, causing Actual Bodily Harm to Mrs Jean Stone (Hilary Mason) whilst trying to steal her handbag. He's also accused of possessing an offensive weapon.Annette Crosbie and Norman Jones also star.
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TVTranscript
00:00:00The case you're about to see is fictional.
00:00:24The procedure, however, is authentic.
00:00:27The characters are played by actors,
00:00:28but the jury is selected from members of the public.
00:00:31His Honour, George Morrison,
00:00:33presides in the case of the Queen against Owen,
00:00:35in which Kevin Owen has pleaded not guilty
00:00:37to the charges of robbery and assault,
00:00:39occasioning actual bodily harm,
00:00:41and of being in possession of an offensive weapon.
00:00:45You are Hugo Michael Maitland,
00:00:48and you live at 27A High Acre Flats,
00:00:50High Acre Estate, Fulchester.
00:00:52Right.
00:00:53Mr Maitland, would you please tell the court
00:00:55what occurred on the evening of Saturday, November the 27th?
00:00:59I was out in my car, doing a mobile.
00:01:01Which is what, exactly?
00:01:03It's a CB term, citizen-ban radio.
00:01:06It means using the radio in your car,
00:01:08as against your Home 20.
00:01:10Home 20?
00:01:12Your base, sir.
00:01:13Where you live, it's called your 20.
00:01:15It's a derivation of the American Ten Code.
00:01:17Ten-one, poor signal.
00:01:19Ten-two, strong signal.
00:01:20Ten-three, cease transmission.
00:01:21Ten-four, is it...
00:01:22Thank you, Mr Maitland.
00:01:24If you could bear in mind
00:01:25that it's unlikely that the jury
00:01:27will be familiar with the American Ten Code,
00:01:31or any other code come to that,
00:01:32it would be helpful.
00:01:33About what time of night was this?
00:01:37Just after midnight.
00:01:39I know it was midnight,
00:01:40because I just had someone in the call channel
00:01:42asking for a 10.36.
00:01:44The time.
00:01:46Go on.
00:01:47Well, I was parked at these traffic lights.
00:01:50And where was this?
00:01:51Where Brooker Street joins the main drag of the high road.
00:01:54I saw this old girl run out into the road
00:01:56just ahead of me.
00:01:57Uh, yes, ma'am.
00:02:02Right.
00:02:04Carry on.
00:02:06Well, she...
00:02:07She seemed panicked.
00:02:09Frightened, you know.
00:02:10She stopped as if to take a breath.
00:02:12She kept casting about,
00:02:14looking over her shoulder.
00:02:15All of a sudden, she was off again.
00:02:18Then I saw this lad.
00:02:19He darted out into the road just behind her
00:02:21and followed her.
00:02:22He kept shouting at her.
00:02:23I couldn't hear exactly what.
00:02:26But he had this stick thing.
00:02:27Like a club in his hand.
00:02:29All the time, she was running away from him.
00:02:31Then he was on to her.
00:02:33On to her?
00:02:34Well, grabbing at her.
00:02:35You know, her handbag.
00:02:36He grabbed her handbag.
00:02:38And then he pushed her.
00:02:39You know, like this.
00:02:40Look, she fell to the ground.
00:02:42Then he was off.
00:02:43And where was the handbag at this point?
00:02:45Well, he had it, didn't he?
00:02:47Clutched his chest like a trophy.
00:02:49And you saw all this quite clearly?
00:02:51I saw everything.
00:02:52Everything.
00:02:53You see, they were standing in front of a shop window.
00:02:55The big furniture shop on the high road.
00:02:57It was all lit up.
00:02:58And what did you do then?
00:03:00Well, I drove to where the old girl was.
00:03:03She was just lying there on the pavement
00:03:04where he had left her.
00:03:06Lying there moaning.
00:03:07So I put out a 10.33.
00:03:09In plain language, Mr. Maitland.
00:03:12Oh, it's a 999 on the emergency channel.
00:03:15Police.
00:03:16Ambulance and that.
00:03:17Thank you, Mr. Maitland.
00:03:21Mr. Maitland.
00:03:23It was raining on the night in question, was it not?
00:03:26Dribble, ain't I?
00:03:27Sufficiently for you to have your windscreen wipers on?
00:03:30Probably.
00:03:31Well, was it or wasn't it?
00:03:34Aye.
00:03:34And when the old lady darted out into the street
00:03:38some distance ahead of you,
00:03:39how, in fact, did you see her?
00:03:41How?
00:03:42Through which window of your car?
00:03:44But the windscreen.
00:03:45And yet, you feel quite confident in your opinion
00:03:48of what you saw,
00:03:49that she appeared frightened?
00:03:52In spite of the distance,
00:03:53the fact that it was dark,
00:03:54and that presumably your vision was impeded
00:03:56by both the rain and your windscreen.
00:03:58I know what I saw.
00:03:59Now, you say the lad followed her
00:04:04and grabbed at her handbag?
00:04:06I did, yes.
00:04:07Now, what about this stick or club that he was carrying?
00:04:09Well, what about it?
00:04:10Well, did he use it?
00:04:11No, he used his other hand, the free hand.
00:04:14And how close were they by then?
00:04:18Twenty yards.
00:04:19Are you asking me, Mr. Maitland?
00:04:23Twenty yards.
00:04:25And were you still observing them through your windscreen?
00:04:27I was, yes.
00:04:27And was it still raining?
00:04:30Yes.
00:04:31Your car, Mr. Maitland,
00:04:32does it have an adequate de-misting system?
00:04:35Sorry?
00:04:37Well, my car, for instance,
00:04:38if I've spent some time in it,
00:04:40particularly if it's been raining,
00:04:41I have to use a chamois leather to wipe the windscreen.
00:04:44Well, I don't have that problem.
00:04:47Tell me, it's usual, is it not,
00:04:50for CB operators to give themselves a name,
00:04:53a handle, I believe it's called,
00:04:55for use on the air?
00:04:57Yes.
00:04:58Your Honour,
00:04:59The witness has stated quite clearly what he saw.
00:05:01I fail to see how his interest in citizen band radio
00:05:04or anything else is in any way relevant.
00:05:07The witness has indeed stated what he thought he saw, Your Honour.
00:05:10I'm simply trying to establish the possible difference
00:05:13between that and what actually happened that night.
00:05:16And to do this,
00:05:17I have to provide the court with a little background information on this witness.
00:05:22Yes, I'll allow the questions.
00:05:23Carry on, Mr. Corrin.
00:05:24Thank you, Your Honour.
00:05:26Now, Mr. Maitland,
00:05:27the business of these handles.
00:05:29Am I right in thinking
00:05:30that the choice of such nicknames is usually associated with someone's job, occupation, or the like?
00:05:37Sometimes.
00:05:39Sometimes.
00:05:40What is the name you use on CB radio?
00:05:45Vigilante.
00:05:45I beg your pardon?
00:05:48Vigilante.
00:05:48Vigilante.
00:05:49Vigilante.
00:05:49Is it not a fact, Mr. Maitland,
00:05:53that you once belonged to a vigilante organisation on the estate where you live?
00:05:58There was a lot of hooligans in the estate.
00:06:00Vandals, muggers.
00:06:01And since the police were doing sod all about it...
00:06:03Mr. Maitland.
00:06:06Well, we just decided to look after ourselves, that's all.
00:06:09And were the police in accord with these views?
00:06:11Not as such.
00:06:12No.
00:06:14Mr. Maitland,
00:06:14I suggest that, in fact,
00:06:15the activities of your committee
00:06:17came into direct confrontation with the police
00:06:20due to complaints of harassment by tenants.
00:06:23In some cases, violent harassment.
00:06:24Well, we're just giving them a dose of their own medicine.
00:06:26Now, that's all.
00:06:30All right.
00:06:31You say that after the lad ran off,
00:06:33you immediately drove over to the old woman who was lying on the pavement.
00:06:36I did, yes.
00:06:36Where you promptly put out a call
00:06:38for the police and an ambulance on your CB radio.
00:06:42Right.
00:06:43Then you put out another call, did you not?
00:06:47You must answer the question, Mr. Maitland.
00:06:52Yes.
00:06:53Saying what?
00:06:54I asked for assistance.
00:06:56In what connection?
00:06:58Well, to get him, the lad.
00:07:00I put out his description
00:07:01and asked all mobiles in the area to help me find him.
00:07:04You didn't feel you could safely leave that in the hands of the police?
00:07:07I was in hand, wasn't I?
00:07:09All right.
00:07:10What did you do there?
00:07:11Well, I went after him.
00:07:12What, leaving the old lady, as you say, moaning in the street?
00:07:17Help was on the way.
00:07:19Nevertheless, you felt your priority was to go after the youth and not stay with her.
00:07:25Well, that's the way I saw it, aye.
00:07:26I suggest the way you saw the whole incident, Mr. Maitland,
00:07:29was impeded, not simply by the rain and by the distance,
00:07:33but by your involvement with your vigilante activities.
00:07:37And our somewhat doubtful ideas on individual militant action in the prevention of crime.
00:07:43Now, would you call that a fair comment?
00:07:45You want to come down our way sometime, sir?
00:07:51How would you like to live with broken windows and pissing the stairs
00:07:54and your women too frightened to get at night
00:07:56and your own children turning to savages?
00:07:58Did you call that fair?
00:08:00How long would you worry sitting your back saying he's doing nothing?
00:08:02Mr. Maitland, this court does not wish to hear your opinions.
00:08:06Thank you, Mr. Maitland.
00:08:15No hurry, constable.
00:08:23At 1209, we received a report...
00:08:26At 1209, we received a report of an assault and robbery
00:08:33on the corner of Brooker Street and the High Road.
00:08:36We had a description of the assailant
00:08:38and the supervising officer asked me to check out all adjoining streets.
00:08:42Accordingly, I then drove down Halford Road
00:08:44into Branston Gardens.
00:08:46I turned right into Westbury Park...
00:08:48It is the events immediately prior to the arrest
00:08:51that you are interested in, constable.
00:08:53Yes, Your Honour.
00:08:55Sorry, Your Honour.
00:08:55All right.
00:08:59In Abraham Road, I saw the youth Kevin Owen sitting in a bus shelter.
00:09:04His description matched that of the assailant.
00:09:06I radioed this to the station, parked the car, and approached him.
00:09:10As I approached him, he stood up.
00:09:12I asked him his name, but he backed away from me.
00:09:16Uh, towards the back of the bus shelter, that is.
00:09:19I then asked him to tell me his name again, and he attempted to push by me.
00:09:24Well, I grappled with him in order to stop him, and a struggle took place.
00:09:27Eventually, I restrained him, placed him under arrest, and cautioned him,
00:09:32after which he accompanied me to the police station without further incident.
00:09:35So, when you first approached him in order to speak to him,
00:09:38his first reaction was to run off?
00:09:40Yes, ma'am.
00:09:41As a result of this struggle, what injuries did you sustain?
00:09:45Bruising, for the most part.
00:09:46On my arms.
00:09:48He also tore my uniform, tore the sleeve.
00:09:50Did he have a weapon?
00:09:52He did.
00:09:52He had a length of lead piping.
00:09:54It was on the bench beside him.
00:09:56Did he have any comment to make about this?
00:09:58Uh, he did.
00:10:00He said it was to protect himself, that he felt safer with it.
00:10:03Did he say anything else?
00:10:06Um, yes, ma'am.
00:10:07Well, when I calmed him, I said we were making inquiries into an assault and robbery,
00:10:11and he said, I know, I guess that's what it was about.
00:10:16Those were his words?
00:10:17Yes, ma'am.
00:10:19Did he say anything else?
00:10:21He did.
00:10:22He said, will it be on the local news?
00:10:25Local news?
00:10:26Yes, Your Honor, the television news.
00:10:28He said it several times, sir, in the car and at the station.
00:10:31He asked if I ever watched it.
00:10:33He made several references to television programs.
00:10:35In what context?
00:10:37Well, there was no context.
00:10:38He just kept coming out with them.
00:10:39He said, it isn't like this on Juliet Bravo, things like that.
00:10:43But when you first brought up the subject of the robbery itself, his words were, I know.
00:10:49I guess that's what it was about.
00:10:52Yes, ma'am.
00:10:52Thank you, constable.
00:11:00Prior to your arrest of Kevin Owen, how many other arrests had you made, constable?
00:11:05None.
00:11:07None.
00:11:08Oh, sir, this was your first.
00:11:10You could say, your debut.
00:11:13If you like.
00:11:14And yet, when you saw the accused from your car, and had his description confirmed over
00:11:19your car radio, you didn't feel the need to ask for assistance?
00:11:23No, I didn't.
00:11:24Well, it wasn't my intention to arrest him on the spot, but just to ask him a few preliminary
00:11:28questions.
00:11:29You didn't think the manner in which you approached him might have alarmed him in any
00:11:32way?
00:11:33Only if he'd done something to be alarmed about.
00:11:35Oh, come now.
00:11:37A policeman striding purposefully towards someone sitting alone in a bus shelter on a dark night?
00:11:42It's enough to alarm anybody, surely.
00:11:44Particularly if they'd had no interaction with the police before.
00:11:48I approached him to ask him a few questions, that's all.
00:11:50Well, would you concede, then, that a more experienced police officer might have handled it differently?
00:11:55Might have made his approach a little, shall we say, less intimidating, and therefore less
00:12:03threatening?
00:12:05I didn't threaten him.
00:12:07My client will maintain that you did, Constable, that the manner in which you approached him
00:12:11frightened him, and that when he stood up, you manhandled him to the back of the bus shelter,
00:12:16where you told him what happens to bleeding muggers like you.
00:12:20I didn't say anything with a kind, and I didn't touch him.
00:12:22Yet a struggle did take place.
00:12:24Because he tried to make off.
00:12:25Yes, I don't dispute that, Constable.
00:12:27You see, what I'm trying to establish is why.
00:12:31Well, he knew why I was there, what I wanted, didn't he?
00:12:34Just answer the questions, Constable.
00:12:36Don't ask them.
00:12:38Didn't it strike you as odd that he should be there?
00:12:42Hmm?
00:12:43That someone who was allegedly assaulted and robbed an old lady should then sit quietly
00:12:48in a bus shelter in an adjacent street and await arrest?
00:12:52Right.
00:12:53I assumed he was waiting for a bus.
00:12:55What to make his getaway, you mean?
00:12:59Presumably, it also didn't strike you as odd that he was wearing only a sweater and jeans.
00:13:04Hardly suitable clothing for somebody with robbery on his mind on a rainy night.
00:13:08I didn't attach any importance to them.
00:13:10But you did attach importance to this weapon, this length of lead piping.
00:13:16Yes.
00:13:16Tell me, did he at any point try to use it during the struggle of yours?
00:13:21It was on the bench beside him.
00:13:22I imagine he'd forgotten about it.
00:13:25And that didn't strike you as odd either, that he should have a weapon and make no attempt to use it?
00:13:29Not particularly.
00:13:30Not particularly.
00:13:33Now, this handbag.
00:13:35I understand you later found it under a hedge in the same street as the bus shelter.
00:13:41Yes.
00:13:42And the contents?
00:13:42Intact.
00:13:46Nothing had been removed?
00:13:48No.
00:13:50Well, not the purse, the pension book, checkbook?
00:13:53No.
00:13:54Well, may I ask what conclusion you drew from this fact?
00:13:58Well, that he panicked and threw it away.
00:14:00According to your statement, he was sitting calmly in a bus shelter.
00:14:06Now, does that sound like somebody in a state of panic?
00:14:10You see, I suggest to you, constable, the only thing he was in a panic about was the old lady.
00:14:14Now, he made a remark about her later on at the station, did he not?
00:14:18Yes.
00:14:19I wonder if you'd be kind enough to tell us what it was.
00:14:25He asked me how she was, and then said,
00:14:28I never meant to hurt her.
00:14:30Tell mother I never meant to hurt her.
00:14:32Thank you, constable.
00:14:33You are Mrs. Jean Avril Stone, a widow and a retired schoolteacher, and you live at number 20, Bounty Road, Forchester.
00:15:02Yes.
00:15:03Mrs. Stone, would you please tell the court what happened to you on the night of November the 27th?
00:15:09I went out to visit a cousin.
00:15:11She's ill, confined to bed, arthritis.
00:15:14I was walking home.
00:15:15I only live a short distance away.
00:15:17When I saw this youth following me.
00:15:20How did you know he was following you?
00:15:22Well, I didn't.
00:15:23Not at first.
00:15:24I just hurt him.
00:15:25Hurt his feet.
00:15:26And at first I thought I was imagining it.
00:15:30Then I crossed over the road, and so did he.
00:15:34I started to walk more quickly, and so did he.
00:15:36Then I decided I'd be better walking in the middle of the road.
00:15:41It was lighter there because of the street lamps, and I thought if a car came, I could get help.
00:15:46And what road was this?
00:15:48Brooker Street.
00:15:48And then what happened?
00:15:51He crossed over into the middle of the road behind me, right behind me.
00:15:54And he was still following you?
00:15:56Oh, yes.
00:15:57Yes, I could hear the slap of his feet on the ground, and his breathing.
00:16:02And I thought if I could just get to the high road, I'd be all right.
00:16:06There'd be traffic there and people.
00:16:09And then suddenly he started shouting, calling out to me.
00:16:12Saying what?
00:16:13Well, I couldn't hear everything he said.
00:16:15I was panting.
00:16:17I had this pounding in my ears, the way you do when you run and you're not used to it.
00:16:22He might have said something else.
00:16:24I was just looking at the lights in the high road and thinking that once I got there, I'd be all right.
00:16:30There'd be people there, and I'd be all right.
00:16:32And when you reached the high road?
00:16:34It was deserted.
00:16:36So I started to run again.
00:16:39And then he was there, right there, behind me, tugging at my sleeve.
00:16:43And I remember I said to him, here, take it, have it if that's what you want.
00:16:50Only don't hurt me.
00:16:51You meant the handbag?
00:16:52Yes.
00:16:53And what did he say?
00:16:54Well, he had hold of my arm with his fingers, gripping it.
00:16:58And my handbag was in my other hand, and he snatched it.
00:17:02And then he gave this little cry, and he pushed me over.
00:17:06And as a result of this push, you fell to the ground?
00:17:10Yes.
00:17:11And what injuries did you sustain?
00:17:13I hit my head, and I broke two ribs when they caught the edge of the pavement.
00:17:18It's disturbed my balance, the doctors say.
00:17:21This knock to my head has something to do with the inner ear.
00:17:24I have to take pills.
00:17:26I understand that there's no dispute over the injuries sustained by Mrs. Stone, Your Honor.
00:17:31Very well.
00:17:32Now, were you still conscious when you were on the ground, Mrs. Stone?
00:17:36Oh, yes, quite conscious.
00:17:37And can you remember what happened?
00:17:39Yes.
00:17:41I could see his shoes just inches from my face.
00:17:45And I remember thinking they weren't shoes.
00:17:48They were slippers, carpet slippers.
00:17:50How odd it was to wear carpet slippers on a night like that.
00:17:54And then he ran off.
00:17:56Thank you, Mrs. Stone.
00:18:01Obviously a very disturbing experience for you, Mrs. Stone.
00:18:04Yes.
00:18:05And not the first of its kind that you've suffered, as I understand,
00:18:08in the sense that you've been the victim of a mugging before.
00:18:12Your Honor, I cannot see that any previous assaults on Mrs. Stone
00:18:15can have any possible bearing in this case.
00:18:19With your permission, Your Honor,
00:18:20I'd like to show that, in fact, it has a definite bearing on the case.
00:18:23In fact, the two are inextricably linked.
00:18:28Yes, very well.
00:18:30But keep it brief, Mr. Corrie.
00:18:32Thank you, Your Honor.
00:18:33Now, this previous mugging, Mrs. Stone, when did it happen?
00:18:38Two years ago.
00:18:39I understand.
00:18:39On that occasion, you were followed also,
00:18:42and attacked before your handbag was stolen.
00:18:45Yes.
00:18:46And is it true to say, Mrs. Stone,
00:18:47that since that time, you've been too frightened
00:18:49to venture out of the house very much alone?
00:18:52Yes.
00:18:52So, presumably, when you heard these footsteps behind you,
00:18:56naturally, you assumed that your worst fears were about to be realized.
00:19:00Yes.
00:19:01Now, in your own words, you say you were running.
00:19:04Surely, if the defendant had been out to harm you,
00:19:07would have simply caught up with you.
00:19:08It would have been easy enough.
00:19:10Without drawing attention to himself by shouting.
00:19:14Last time, it was I who shouted.
00:19:17The first time, I mean.
00:19:18It was I who shouted for help.
00:19:20No one came.
00:19:22No one.
00:19:22They don't.
00:19:23Not in a town.
00:19:25No one wants to help.
00:19:26They only hear what they want to hear.
00:19:30A point I was about to make myself, Mrs. Stone.
00:19:33Now, you say your single thought was to get to the high road.
00:19:39Yes.
00:19:39Presumably, because you thought it unlikely he would attack you in such a public place.
00:19:44Yes.
00:19:45And yet, in fact, that is precisely what you are asking us to believe he did.
00:19:50It is what he did, isn't it?
00:19:52But we've established that he had ample opportunity to make this alleged attack in Brooker Street,
00:19:58which is a quiet, poorly lit side street.
00:20:01Is that a statement or a question?
00:20:03It's an observation, Mrs. Stone, on which I would like you to comment.
00:20:09I have no comment to make.
00:20:10I don't know how his mind works, do I?
00:20:12How old are you, Mrs. Stone?
00:20:14Sixty-seven.
00:20:14The defendant is seventeen.
00:20:16He's young and he's fit.
00:20:18If he'd wanted to catch you up in that side street, what was there to stop him?
00:20:22All right, let's examine what actually occurred.
00:20:29You say he caught you, he caught up with you in the high road and grabbed your arm.
00:20:34Yes.
00:20:34Now, did he say anything?
00:20:35No.
00:20:36You're sure about that?
00:20:37Yes.
00:20:38But you said something to him, did you not?
00:20:40You said, if this is what you want, take it, but don't hurt me, or words to that effect.
00:20:46Yes.
00:20:46And it's not unreasonable to assume that you accompanied these words with the gesture of
00:20:51actually giving him the bag.
00:20:53Only because he was going to take it.
00:20:55But supposing he wasn't.
00:20:59Supposing he was simply lost and was following you to ask directions, and that in your anxiety
00:21:05to get away from him, you lost your footing, you slipped on the wet pavement, and...
00:21:09He pushed me.
00:21:11Deliberately.
00:21:12Like this.
00:21:13But you see, Mrs. Stern, we've already established the fact that the defendant had a weapon.
00:21:19In fact, he was carrying two pounds of lead piping.
00:21:23Now, if he'd meant to harm you, why on earth didn't he use it?
00:21:27I mean, why just push you?
00:21:29I imagine he'd have used it if he needed to.
00:21:33Isn't it possible that he reached out in the way that you describe in order to prevent you
00:21:39from falling?
00:21:40No.
00:21:40He pushed me.
00:21:41Now, this little cry you say he uttered.
00:21:45Yes.
00:21:45Now, you've stated this was just before he knocked you over.
00:21:48Yes.
00:21:49Wasn't it, in fact, after you fell, Mrs. Stern, that he called out in concern?
00:21:55He pushed me quite deliberately.
00:21:58You could see it in his face.
00:22:00Oh, you had a good look at his face, did you?
00:22:01Oh, yes.
00:22:02In the light from the shop window.
00:22:04His features were quite distinct.
00:22:06Now, this previous mugging, Mrs. Stern, this former mugging, your attacker came from behind,
00:22:14as I understand, striking you over the shoulder from behind.
00:22:18Yes.
00:22:18Yet this boy not only spoke to you, allowing you to hear his voice, but he allowed you to
00:22:24see his face as well.
00:22:25I caught sight of his face.
00:22:27That's all I know.
00:22:28It's not something I'm likely to forget.
00:22:30Well, then, how would you describe his face?
00:22:34The expression on it, I mean.
00:22:36He was staring.
00:22:37And if you could have seen your own face at that moment, supposing for one second you
00:22:43could, how do you imagine you looked to him?
00:22:45Looked?
00:22:46Yes, the expression on your face.
00:22:49Frightened, I imagine.
00:22:50Exactly.
00:22:50You see, I'm going to put it to you, Mrs. Stern, that you were both frightened, that the expression
00:22:59you saw on his face mirrored that of your own, that the defendant was frightened, or at least
00:23:05disconcerted, by your overt hostility towards him, and that you were frightened because of
00:23:10your previous experience with a mugger.
00:23:14One does not like to be in any situation where you lose control.
00:23:18You think your fear made you lose control?
00:23:25I did not want my life to end, ignominiously and alone, in some back street.
00:23:32I am nearer the end of my life than the beginning.
00:23:35Death is no longer something that happens to someone else.
00:23:39If anything, I'm grateful to him.
00:23:42Grateful?
00:23:44Until that night, I was never sure which was worse.
00:23:48Death, or the fear of it.
00:23:52That night, he provided me with the answer.
00:23:54The case of the Queen against Owen will but resume to prince.
00:23:59The case of the Queen against Owen will be resumed tomorrow in the Crown Court.
00:24:29The case you're about to see is fictional.
00:24:59The procedure, however, is legally accurate.
00:25:02The characters are played by actors, but the jury is selected from members of the general
00:25:05public.
00:25:07Kevin Owen is accused of robbery and assault, causing actual bodily harm to Mrs. Jean Stone,
00:25:12while attempting to steal her handbag on the night of November the 27th in the Fulchester
00:25:17High Road.
00:25:18He's also accused of possessing an offensive weapon.
00:25:21We rejoin the case with Mr. Corrie, opening for the defense.
00:25:25Kevin Owen is in the witness box.
00:25:28All truth and nothing but the truth.
00:25:36You are Kevin Donald Owen, and you live at 19 Ambrose Street, Fulchester.
00:25:45Could you answer the question, please?
00:25:48Yeah.
00:25:49And will you tell the court your age, please?
00:25:52Seventeen.
00:25:53Have you ever been in trouble with the police before?
00:25:56No.
00:25:57Your Honor, in order to explain the defendant's behavior on that night, I want to provide the
00:26:03court with some information relating to the circumstances regarding his home life.
00:26:08The substance of his case depends absolutely on my being allowed to do this.
00:26:11Your Honor, we can all claim to have less than happy home lives.
00:26:15I cannot see that it makes for a defense.
00:26:18Or an excuse come to that for the charges the defendant is facing.
00:26:23I go back to my original point, Your Honor.
00:26:25I'm not disputing that the defendant's behavior that night needs explanation, which is not at
00:26:30all the same thing as an excuse.
00:26:32But how can I convincingly provide any explanation without first pointing to its cause?
00:26:39And bearing in mind the defendant's age, Mrs. Hunter, it does seem a reasonable point.
00:26:44But don't stray too far off the point, Mr. Corrie.
00:26:48I'll see that we don't.
00:26:49Thank you, Your Honor.
00:26:51You are an only child, are you not, Mr. Owen?
00:26:56Mr. Owen, do you have no brothers or sisters?
00:27:00No.
00:27:01And prior to the night of the 27th of November, you lived at home?
00:27:05Yeah.
00:27:06Have you always lived at home with your parents?
00:27:08Yeah.
00:27:09Would you describe your relationship with them as close?
00:27:12Yeah.
00:27:13Now then, tell me about school.
00:27:16What schools have you attended?
00:27:18I haven't.
00:27:19He doesn't mean any school you're attending now, he means in the past.
00:27:24I know what he means, I already told him.
00:27:26Yes, but I'm asking you again, you see, so that you can tell the court.
00:27:29And when you say you haven't attended school, as his honor says, I don't mean sixth form, for instance.
00:27:35I mean school generally.
00:27:37Infants, primary, secondary?
00:27:39Not them either.
00:27:40Are you telling us you've never been to school at all?
00:27:43No.
00:27:44Yeah.
00:27:45Well, who was responsible for your education?
00:27:48My mother and dad, mostly mother.
00:27:51Did your mother explain to you why you didn't go to school?
00:27:56She said I was better off without it, better off at home.
00:28:00Did you ever question that?
00:28:02Sometimes.
00:28:03What was her reply?
00:28:04I was better off at home.
00:28:07Is that all she said on the matter?
00:28:09Yeah.
00:28:10Now, in your recollection, do you ever remember anyone coming to the house from the education authorities
00:28:16to discuss this with your mother?
00:28:18No.
00:28:19And people didn't come to the house.
00:28:21If they did, I'd go upstairs.
00:28:23Why was that?
00:28:24So their mother could deal with them.
00:28:26So, if there ever were any visitors, you didn't see them?
00:28:29Only from the landing.
00:28:30I'd watch through the banisters until the coast was clear.
00:28:33Well, how do you mean, until the coast was clear?
00:28:35Then I'd go down again.
00:28:37So, your mother made it plain to you that she didn't want you downstairs when she had visitors?
00:28:47Just answer as best you can.
00:28:49She didn't want them interfering.
00:28:52Interfering with what?
00:28:53Us.
00:28:54The family.
00:28:55Well, that's the only explanation she gave you?
00:28:58Yeah.
00:28:59Now, apart from these infrequent visitors you were not allowed to meet, what other companions
00:29:05did you have, apart from your parents?
00:29:08A.
00:29:09Well, I'm talking about friends of your own age.
00:29:13Do you, in fact, have any friends of your own age?
00:29:16No.
00:29:18Do you, in fact, have any friends at all?
00:29:22No.
00:29:23Why is that?
00:29:26Didn't want any.
00:29:28Now, before the night we're talking about, how often did you go out of the house?
00:29:33Now and then.
00:29:34And where did you go?
00:29:36My dad would take me for a drive Sundays.
00:29:41He takes me down the chippy sometimes.
00:29:43I'd wait in the car for him.
00:29:44We'd go walking, too, on the dales.
00:29:46Well, these excursions, these trips out, were they always with your father?
00:29:51Yeah.
00:29:52And apart from them, where did you go?
00:29:55Different places.
00:29:57He took me fishing once, but Mother said no after that.
00:30:01I don't swim.
00:30:02No, I mean apart from these trips out with your father, where did you go?
00:30:05I didn't.
00:30:06I didn't.
00:30:07So, you never went out of the house alone?
00:30:11No.
00:30:12Why was that?
00:30:14Did you ever ask your mother why not?
00:30:17Sometimes.
00:30:18And what did she say?
00:30:20She said I was better off at home, away from prying eyes.
00:30:25Now, what did she mean by prying eyes?
00:30:27She said people weren't kind.
00:30:29I was better off without them.
00:30:31What did you think, Kevin, when you looked out of the window and saw people in the street?
00:30:35As a child, say, when you, seeing children of your own age, playing, going to school.
00:30:40How did you feel about that?
00:30:42You must answer the questions put to you.
00:30:49Angry?
00:30:50Sad?
00:30:51What?
00:30:52Both.
00:30:53When you told your mother how you felt, what did she say?
00:31:00She said I wasn't like them, the other kids, so they wouldn't like me.
00:31:04In what way were you supposed to be unlike them?
00:31:07I mean, how were you different from them?
00:31:10Just different.
00:31:12Do you watch a lot of television, Kevin?
00:31:15I've got one in my room.
00:31:17A colour one, remote control.
00:31:19There's a hard one downstairs, but my picture's better.
00:31:22Yes, I understand you like crime shows, police shows, Juliet Bravo, The Professionals, that
00:31:27kind of thing.
00:31:28Yeah.
00:31:29Now, there was an episode of Juliet Bravo on that night, was there not?
00:31:32Do you know the night we're talking about?
00:31:34Yeah.
00:31:35Now, is that why you mentioned it to that police officer?
00:31:38Yeah, except he doesn't watch it.
00:31:40He said real life isn't like that.
00:31:42Did he?
00:31:45Now, let's get down to that night itself.
00:31:47You've already said that up until then, you hadn't been out of the house on your own before.
00:31:52Yeah.
00:31:53Now, what made you go out on your own that night?
00:31:57We had words.
00:32:00We?
00:32:01Me and mother.
00:32:03What about?
00:32:04About this music.
00:32:06Yes, go on.
00:32:09Across the road, there was this party.
00:32:12I could see people coming and going, all dressed up.
00:32:16The lights were on, and I could see them dancing.
00:32:19The shapes of them on the curtains when they were dancing.
00:32:22Did you want to go to this party?
00:32:23Yeah.
00:32:24What did your mother say?
00:32:26She said no.
00:32:27She said I hadn't been invited.
00:32:29I didn't know them.
00:32:30She said they wouldn't want to know me.
00:32:32I said they wouldn't notice me.
00:32:34I'd just stand in a corner and watch.
00:32:37But she said no.
00:32:38But you decided to go anyway.
00:32:40She locked the front door.
00:32:41It's got this lock on the inside with a key.
00:32:43Well, she locked it, put the key in her pocket, and said for me to stop going on about it.
00:32:48Her mind was made up.
00:32:49Then what happened?
00:32:51I went to my room.
00:32:54I could still hear the music and their voices.
00:32:57What?
00:32:58From the party, you mean?
00:32:59No.
00:33:00Mother and fathers downstairs shouting.
00:33:03So what did you do?
00:33:05I put the television on.
00:33:07And then I switched off the lights, and I sat by the window so that I could see the party.
00:33:12Well, after a bit, Dad went out.
00:33:14He got into the car and drove off.
00:33:16Well, he often does that after a fight.
00:33:19So I switched the television off.
00:33:22The house was quite quiet.
00:33:24Then I got into bed, and I pulled the covers up to my chin and closed my eyes like I was asleep.
00:33:30Well, she came in and stood by the bed.
00:33:33And then she kissed me goodnight like she always does.
00:33:36Then she left.
00:33:38Go on.
00:33:40Well, I waited till I could hear her bedroom door close.
00:33:43Her room's next door to mine.
00:33:45Dad's is at the end of the passage.
00:33:49Then I started counting.
00:33:51I could still hear the music from the party sort of thumping, and I counted in time with it.
00:33:56Well, when I got to a thousand, I got out of bed and went to the window.
00:34:01Well, I got myself onto this little roof and worked myself to the edge till I was hanging on it.
00:34:06There's been this film on the television where someone did that.
00:34:12Well, then I let go and landed all this junk in the front garden.
00:34:16I thought my legs were broken.
00:34:22Well, then I heard Dad's car.
00:34:23Well, it's got this engine noise.
00:34:25You can spot even at the end of the road.
00:34:27You see, it's a Volkswagen.
00:34:29Well, I stood up to see if I could get my legs working.
00:34:33And then Dad parked his car and went to the house.
00:34:35I could hear his keys jangling.
00:34:39Well, then I heard the bolt, and I knew I was for it.
00:34:42I couldn't get back inside.
00:34:43So, what did you do next?
00:34:45Well, it didn't seem such a good idea about the party.
00:34:48But in case Mother found out I was gone and went there looking for me.
00:34:51So, where did you go instead?
00:34:54I don't remember.
00:34:57Try for us, Kevin, will you?
00:35:04I thought if I could find somewhere to spend the night, I could get back in in the morning.
00:35:08Well, Dad's always up first, and I knew he'd have to unbolt the door to fetch in the milk.
00:35:12I could dodge back in then and get to my room without Mother knowing.
00:35:15So, what did you do?
00:35:17I took a bit of piping from the pile of junk.
00:35:21Why did you do that?
00:35:23Well, it was late. Dark. I felt safer with it.
00:35:28I see. So, when you found yourself locked out, where did you decide to go?
00:35:32A bus shelter. I remember seeing one when I was out with Dad.
00:35:39Well, I kept on walking, but I couldn't find it.
00:35:42All the roads looked the same. All these houses, with the lights on upstairs and closed curtains.
00:35:47And no one around to ask. Until her.
00:35:50Now, when you saw Mrs. Stone, what did you do?
00:35:55Well, she was just up ahead of me.
00:35:58I called out to her, but she didn't seem to hear.
00:36:01She just crossed the street, so I went after her.
00:36:03And when did you actually catch up with her?
00:36:06In this big main road.
00:36:08Well, I thought maybe she was deaf being old, so I caught hold of her sleeve.
00:36:12Just to speak to her, just to ask where the bus shelter was.
00:36:17But she hit me.
00:36:19With her fist?
00:36:20No, her bag. She hit me with it on the chest.
00:36:23So what did you do?
00:36:25Well, I tried to take it from her to stop her doing it again.
00:36:28And then what?
00:36:30Well, she tried to pull away from me and sort of keeled over.
00:36:33You didn't push her?
00:36:36You didn't push her?
00:36:38No, she just fell backwards.
00:36:40And you're quite sure, Kevin, that you didn't push her, causing her to fall?
00:36:45No, I just wanted to stop her hitting me with her bag.
00:36:52Tell us what happened then.
00:36:55She was on the ground, and I was standing over her.
00:36:59And then these lights came on.
00:37:01What lights were these?
00:37:02Car lights, headlamps, pointing at me, coming towards me.
00:37:06So I ran.
00:37:07Why did you run?
00:37:10Kevin, if what you tell us is true, why did you run away?
00:37:15I thought there'd be trouble.
00:37:17Mother would have found out, wouldn't she?
00:37:18Well, since it was your mother's idea that you shouldn't attend school, do you perhaps resent her for it?
00:37:27No.
00:37:28But you do admit feeling angry and sad as a child when you saw other children going to school and so on.
00:37:33Well, either you did mind or you didn't.
00:37:34I mean, it would be rather odd if you didn't mind, wouldn't it, the picture we've had of a solitary child virtually imprisoned at home.
00:37:46You must feel something about that, surely.
00:37:47I wasn't imprisoned.
00:37:48I could come and go as I pleased.
00:37:49But you didn't, did you?
00:37:50At least not without one of your parents.
00:37:51I didn't want to go out.
00:37:52I enjoyed my own company.
00:37:53What's wrong with that?
00:37:54Now, let's talk about these lessons your mother gave you.
00:37:55What did they consist of?
00:37:56What did they consist of?
00:37:57What did they consist of?
00:37:58What did they consist of?
00:37:59What did they consist of?
00:38:00Reading and stuff.
00:38:01So you can read and write Sure, I can.
00:38:03And you can.
00:38:04And you did these lessons when?
00:38:05Every morning.
00:38:06What about weekends?
00:38:07Sometimes.
00:38:08The holidays.
00:38:09Christmas holidays.
00:38:10Holidays?
00:38:11We just went there for lunch.
00:38:12But there was nothing better for me.
00:38:13Little goodies.
00:38:14Little vegetables.
00:38:16People that have nothing been.
00:38:17Listen fortunately.
00:38:18Yes, oh, but this is the best time now.
00:38:19Number one.
00:38:20Well, she's all for all good that.
00:38:21One of the things I can do, is that people?
00:38:22Well, these things have never happened.
00:38:23Anyone who really wanted to talk about a living so experience?
00:38:24What if you didn't live there?
00:38:25No, you don't do me.
00:38:26Theced, you'll try them not to go out soon, but he didn't know
00:38:28?
00:38:29We just went straight through.
00:38:31Didn't you mind that?
00:38:35I must ask that the defendant answer the question, Your Honor.
00:38:39Just answer yes or no.
00:38:44Sometimes.
00:38:46Or sometimes.
00:38:48Now, isn't it a fact that this hostility sometimes spilled over into arguments with your mother?
00:38:53Sometimes.
00:38:54Isn't it a fact that you once attacked your mother?
00:38:57Physically attacked her?
00:38:58You threw a telephone directory at her, hitting her in the eye, for which she had to have hospital treatment.
00:39:03It was an accident.
00:39:04Your Honor, I really must object to this line of questioning.
00:39:07I'm afraid, Mr. Corrie, since you yourself opened up the whole question of the defendant's home life,
00:39:12the prosecution must be allowed to develop it.
00:39:15Thank you, Your Honor.
00:39:17Now, how many times have you and your family moved house in the past, say, ten years?
00:39:23A few times.
00:39:24Approximately how many?
00:39:26Four, five.
00:39:28Why was that?
00:39:29No special reason.
00:39:31Didn't it strike you as odd?
00:39:33No.
00:39:35Didn't your parents continually move because of your rows?
00:39:38As a result of which your mother was terrified a neighbor might complain.
00:39:42Which might have resulted in the involvement of the education authorities.
00:39:45No, we moved because we wanted to.
00:39:47Anyway, it wasn't me who started all the rows.
00:39:49I'm not suggesting that it was.
00:39:52But since my learned friend has opened this up, we might as well get to the truth of it.
00:39:56And the truth I suggest is that you and your mother shared a violent and volatile relationship,
00:40:01from which it would not be unreasonable to assume you were determined to escape.
00:40:06Am I right?
00:40:09What?
00:40:10At 17, at a time when most young men are about to leave home and be independent,
00:40:15are you asking us to believe that you were happy to continue living in such an acrimonious and hostile atmosphere?
00:40:22I had nowhere else to go, did I?
00:40:25Oh, so the thought had occurred to you to leave?
00:40:28No.
00:40:29Well, if that was the case, presumably only because the practicalities stopped you.
00:40:34The lack of anywhere else to go, and more importantly, the lack of money.
00:40:44Yes.
00:40:47Now, let's move on to the subject of television.
00:40:50You say you watched a good deal of it.
00:40:54Yeah.
00:40:55I imagine, if nothing else, because it gave you an idea of the outside world,
00:40:58with which you'd had so little contact.
00:41:00I just like watching it.
00:41:02And when you say, a good deal, what does that mean exactly?
00:41:06You've told us that you sometimes watched in the afternoon.
00:41:08Did you also watch in the evenings as well?
00:41:11Yeah.
00:41:11Well, on average, that could be up to eight hours a day.
00:41:14Some people would think that excessive.
00:41:15Now, you said, when you were on the roof outside your bedroom,
00:41:22you'd seen someone do it in a television film.
00:41:25So?
00:41:26Did that give you the idea to escape over the roof in the first place?
00:41:29I didn't stop to think about it.
00:41:31According to your evidence, you did.
00:41:32You specifically said that you saw a television film where a similar thing occurred.
00:41:40Now, the evening before the 27th, the evening before the alleged assault,
00:41:44did you also watch television?
00:41:47Probably.
00:41:48Did you?
00:41:48Or didn't you?
00:41:50Yeah.
00:41:51Now, do you remember seeing a local news report
00:41:54concerning a mugging case in a Manchester street?
00:41:56It was shown on both major networks.
00:42:01Well, I'll refresh your memory.
00:42:03In the hope of locating witnesses,
00:42:06it re-enacted a mugging in a Manchester street.
00:42:09In this case, an old man who was followed by a youth with a stick
00:42:12who attacked and robbed him.
00:42:15You've already stated a preference for television programs connected with crime
00:42:19and that you were watching television that night.
00:42:21How could you have missed it?
00:42:23I didn't miss it.
00:42:24That's why I took the piping.
00:42:25I was afraid the same thing might happen to me.
00:42:30Well, let's turn to the night itself.
00:42:33You say you wanted to go to a party, but your mother prevented you.
00:42:37Yeah.
00:42:37And you quite calmly accepted this and went up to your room.
00:42:39She'd locked the front door.
00:42:41So you decided to wait until she'd gone to bed and go out by the window?
00:42:44Yes.
00:42:45No.
00:42:46It just happened that way.
00:42:47I suggest you planned it to happen that way.
00:42:50Some plan.
00:42:51I'm not that stupid.
00:42:52And neither is this jury.
00:42:54Do you really expect us to believe all this nonsense about a bus shelter?
00:42:58It's the truth.
00:42:59I suggest that the truth is, when you found yourself locked out of your house that night,
00:43:03you realized it was your chance to get away, didn't you?
00:43:06But you had nowhere to go, and more importantly, no money.
00:43:11But you remembered that news item, didn't you?
00:43:13And you knew your problems could be solved.
00:43:16And that's the real reason you took that bit of lead with you, wasn't it?
00:43:19No.
00:43:19I said why.
00:43:20Because if you could just get some money, you could get a bed for the night.
00:43:24Not to mention food and clothing.
00:43:26I didn't need food or clothes.
00:43:28I was going back in the morning.
00:43:29Well, after all these rows we've heard about, I suggest that you deliberately followed Mrs. Stone
00:43:35with the express intention of assaulting her in order to steal her handbag.
00:43:39Isn't that really what happened?
00:43:41I said what happened.
00:43:42I said.
00:43:44I said what happened.
00:43:45No more questions, Your Honor.
00:43:53I swear by Almighty God, the evidence I give shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
00:44:05You are Mrs. Catherine Angela Owen, and you live at 19 Ambrose Street, Fulchester?
00:44:11Yes.
00:44:12Would you tell us, please, your relationship with the defendant?
00:44:15I'm his mother.
00:44:17Now, perhaps you could start off by telling us something about the defendant.
00:44:22What is it you want to know?
00:44:24Well, how you get on together, for instance.
00:44:27He's my son.
00:44:29So parents don't always have good relationships with their offspring, do they?
00:44:34I can only speak for myself.
00:44:37Well, then, would you describe your relationship as being close?
00:44:41Yes, very.
00:44:42And Kevin himself, how would you describe him?
00:44:45Honest.
00:44:47Honest.
00:44:48Kind.
00:44:50Gentle.
00:44:51Yes, we've heard evidence that might suggest the contrary, Mrs. Owen, that you used to argue quite frequently.
00:45:00Arguments are not uncommon in any family, are they?
00:45:02Is it true that during one of these arguments, Kevin threw a telephone directory at you, injuring your eye?
00:45:09Well, that was an accident.
00:45:11A silly accident.
00:45:13He's at that age, isn't he?
00:45:15I mean, all children at this age rebel against their parents, rebel against discipline.
00:45:21It's perfectly natural.
00:45:22So, all in all, his behavior has given you no great cause for concern on that score.
00:45:28You regarded it simply as that of a typical teenager.
00:45:33Yes.
00:45:33Did he ever, perhaps in a temper, ever express a wish to leave home?
00:45:39Permanently, I mean.
00:45:41Why should he?
00:45:42He never once said or indicated that this might have been on his mind?
00:45:45Never.
00:45:46Did Kevin ever show any resentment over the fact that you opted to educate him at home?
00:45:51I should warn you, Mrs. Owen, that you do not have to answer that question if you feel it might incriminate you to do so.
00:45:58I don't mind answering the question.
00:46:01Children who do go to school complain about it occasionally, don't they?
00:46:06Of course he complained sometimes.
00:46:07I'd have been surprised if he hadn't.
00:46:10But not sufficiently for it to amount to hostility between them?
00:46:14No, certainly not.
00:46:17Thank you, Mrs. Anne.
00:46:21You say you opted not to have Kevin educated at school.
00:46:26Why?
00:46:30You've had him up here, talked to him.
00:46:33That hardly answers my question, Mrs. Owen.
00:46:36I decided it wouldn't be in his best interest.
00:46:39As his mother, I consider I have that right.
00:46:41Even though you were breaking the law in exercising that so-called right?
00:46:46I did what I thought was best.
00:46:49And what has the law got to do with what is best for one's own child?
00:46:53But what we have to ascertain is why.
00:46:56The basis on which you made this extraordinary decision.
00:47:00He wouldn't benefit from it, would he?
00:47:02Why not?
00:47:04Mrs. Owen, why wouldn't he benefit from an education like any other child?
00:47:08Because he's not like any other child.
00:47:12In what way is he so unlike other children?
00:47:15Other people of his own age?
00:47:21He's retarded, isn't he?
00:47:23He's retarded.
00:47:24ORCHESTRA PLAYS
00:47:54The Queen against Owen will be concluded tomorrow in the Crown Court.
00:48:24The case you're about to see is fictional.
00:48:33The procedure, however, is authentic.
00:48:35The characters are played by actors, but the jury is selected from members of the public.
00:48:40Kevin Owen is charged with assault, causing actual bodily harm, robbery, and possessing
00:48:45an offensive weapon.
00:48:46His mother is now being cross-examined by the prosecution.
00:48:50Mrs. Owen, you stated that your son, the defendant, is retarded.
00:48:56Yes.
00:48:57Is that opinion based on a medical diagnosis?
00:48:59Mrs. Owen, if you mean a doctor, he hasn't needed one, not for years.
00:49:05But someone must have diagnosed his condition in the first place.
00:49:11There was a problem at his birth.
00:49:13I went into labor prematurely.
00:49:18The cord was round his neck.
00:49:21He had difficulty breathing.
00:49:23Later, when he was a few months old, he wasn't progressing as other children.
00:49:29He wasn't smiling or holding his head up.
00:49:32Naturally, I was worried.
00:49:33I took him to my doctor, who referred me to the local hospital.
00:49:36They said it might all be connected with the birth, lack of oxygen, that I might have to
00:49:45reconcile myself to the possibility that there might be brain damage.
00:49:49And did they subsequently confirm this diagnosis?
00:49:52No.
00:49:53They didn't run tests.
00:49:55I didn't go back.
00:49:57I didn't need their diagnosis confirmed.
00:50:00I'm his mother.
00:50:01I could see how he was for myself.
00:50:04Well, even assuming you were right.
00:50:05Surely you wanted him to get help, receive treatment.
00:50:09I've seen the kind of treatment the mentally handicapped get.
00:50:14Do you mind explaining that?
00:50:17My sister, my youngest sister, is retarded.
00:50:21I grew up seeing how people treated her.
00:50:25I didn't want that for Kevin.
00:50:28If it was something in me, something genetic,
00:50:31it was my responsibility to look after him, to shield him from that.
00:50:36So you didn't go along with the theory that it was due to an accident at birth.
00:50:43Accident at birth.
00:50:44Genetic accident.
00:50:45What does it matter?
00:50:47I could see how he was, and I knew what had to be done for him.
00:50:51You mean by, uh, locking him away from prying eyes?
00:50:58I mean, love.
00:51:00With respect, Mrs. Owen, love doesn't solve everything.
00:51:04That's easy to say when you've never been deprived of it.
00:51:07I grew up seeing all my mother's love diverted to someone else.
00:51:10Your sister, you mean?
00:51:12Yes.
00:51:13I didn't resent it.
00:51:15I understood.
00:51:18Naturally, it made me unhappy.
00:51:20But then, when I had Kevin, I realized it was all a preparation.
00:51:28There is, after all, a point to pain.
00:51:33By devoting myself to him, I could make sure he felt none.
00:51:37Didn't it occur to you that his progress might have been swifter if he'd gone to school,
00:51:43mixed with people, other children?
00:51:45And watched him struggling to keep up, struggling to keep pace.
00:51:49Well, what about a special school that could cater for his needs?
00:51:51No.
00:51:52Why not?
00:51:53Because I could give him everything he needed.
00:51:56Everything.
00:51:57And you explained to him, did you, when the subject of education came up between you?
00:52:02In terms he would understand, yes.
00:52:05And did he understand?
00:52:06Yes.
00:52:06I suggest that he didn't, Mrs. Owen.
00:52:08I suggest that he was in a great deal of conflict over this.
00:52:11He loved you.
00:52:12You were his mother.
00:52:13He knew that you needed him.
00:52:14Yet he was also growing up and wanted to experience life.
00:52:18Except that this mother's love you talked of wouldn't let you recognize it.
00:52:24Mrs. Hunter, this witness is not an expert in psychosociology.
00:52:28What can you know about mother love?
00:52:30Many of us have children, Mrs. Owen.
00:52:33And we all have to face the fact that there comes a time when you have to let them go.
00:52:38I've already said any conflict there was between us is simply because of his age.
00:52:43So you do acknowledge that he's normal, that he conforms to the average pattern of a teenager?
00:52:49Anyone, whatever their mental age, is capable of anger.
00:52:52So you concede he got angry?
00:52:54Occasionally, of course.
00:52:56And did this anger sometimes spill over into violence?
00:53:00No.
00:53:01You see, I suggest that Kevin is not as slow as you would have us believe.
00:53:06That the events of the night of November the 27th were entirely in keeping with his behavior in the past few years.
00:53:12And that he knew perfectly well what he was doing.
00:53:16Which was to get money in order to leave a home which he found increasingly oppressive and suffocating.
00:53:23No.
00:53:26Would you say he was obsessed by television?
00:53:31He enjoys watching it, if that's what you mean.
00:53:33To the point that he did very little else?
00:53:36It's a harmless enough activity, I would have thought.
00:53:39Is it?
00:53:40I put it to you.
00:53:42That due to the circumstances of his home life,
00:53:45the characters and events he saw on television were virtually the only outside contact that he had.
00:53:50And therefore had a fundamental influence on his behavior.
00:53:55As the person closest to him, wouldn't you confirm this?
00:53:57Well, let me put it another way.
00:54:02In your experience, did Kevin ever try to emulate anything he saw on the television?
00:54:09What child doesn't?
00:54:10We're not speaking about a child, Mrs. Owen.
00:54:13We're speaking about a young man who is very near to voting age.
00:54:16Age is not something that is simply measured in years.
00:54:22For the purposes of this court, Mrs. Owen, I'm afraid that it is.
00:54:26Mr. Owen, we've heard that Kevin and his mother often rowed,
00:54:39and that once or twice these are alleged to have erupted into violence.
00:54:43Now, were you ever present during any of these occasions?
00:54:48I certainly wouldn't say violent.
00:54:50Well, how would you describe them, then?
00:54:51Well, people tend to lash out, don't they, in a row?
00:54:54Well, they were never of a serious nature.
00:54:57No, no.
00:54:59Now, how about Kevin's nature?
00:55:02How would you describe that?
00:55:03He's affectionate, then.
00:55:05A little on the timid side.
00:55:07Timid?
00:55:08Quiet, introverted.
00:55:10You see, we've heard that your family often moved house,
00:55:12and it's been suggested that it was because of Kevin's behavior,
00:55:16because of the rouse he caused and the complaints from neighbors.
00:55:20Now, is there any truth in that?
00:55:21No, we moved because of my job.
00:55:23I'm a salesman.
00:55:24You get transferred a lot in my life.
00:55:27Would you describe your family as being a happy one?
00:55:30In the circumstances.
00:55:32Presumably, you mean the circumstances of Kevin's condition.
00:55:35Mrs. Owen has already told us something of her theories concerning that matter.
00:55:39Yes, I mean that.
00:55:40Now, then, knowing Kevin as you do,
00:55:42do you believe he is capable of attacking and assaulting an old lady in order to steal from her?
00:55:50No.
00:55:52How about lying?
00:55:53Has he ever lied to get himself out of trouble, perhaps?
00:55:57No, he doesn't even know what a lie is.
00:55:59It's painful to see it sometime, that kind of honesty.
00:56:01You wonder how someone so transparent could possibly survive.
00:56:05Now, on the night of the 27th of November, Mr. Owen,
00:56:10did you and Mrs. Owen have a row?
00:56:13Yes.
00:56:14About what?
00:56:15Well, Kevin got a duty to his head to go to this party over the road.
00:56:18People were coming and going as they pleased,
00:56:20and I didn't see the harm in it.
00:56:22He'd never been to one, you see.
00:56:23I thought it was about time he did.
00:56:26I thought it was about time a few changes were made.
00:56:28And prior to that night, had he ever attempted to leave home before?
00:56:32No.
00:56:33Had he ever said he wanted to leave home before,
00:56:36to live somewhere else, perhaps?
00:56:38Never.
00:56:38Not even in anger?
00:56:40You don't understand, you see.
00:56:41He and his mother, they're like a married couple.
00:56:44I joke about it sometimes.
00:56:46They couldn't manage without each other.
00:56:50Now, the defendant has said that he saw a bus shelter on an outing with you.
00:56:54Do you remember any mention of that?
00:56:56We passed it once.
00:56:57It's quite near us, though.
00:56:57There was a young couple in it, you know, kissing,
00:57:00and it made an impression on Kevin.
00:57:01He said he looked like a little house,
00:57:03and he'd like to live there with someone to share it.
00:57:05So it wouldn't be unnatural for him to attempt to find it
00:57:08once he found he'd been locked out for the night?
00:57:10No, that would be just like him.
00:57:13Well, the subject of television now,
00:57:15would you say it's influenced his behaviour at all?
00:57:19Not especially.
00:57:20He's never tried to copy the behaviour of characters on television?
00:57:24He does a very good impression of David Bellamy.
00:57:26Yes, I was thinking more of crime programmes.
00:57:30Well, he enjoys programmes like that,
00:57:31but so do millions of other people.
00:57:33They don't go around robbing banks and mugging old ladies.
00:57:37Why should my son be any different?
00:57:40Thank you, Mr. Owen.
00:57:40Well, the fact is, Mr. Owen,
00:57:44your son is different, isn't he?
00:57:47Well, according to your wife's testimony, he is.
00:57:51This diagnosis she made concerning him,
00:57:54did you agree with it?
00:57:56Up to a point.
00:57:57And what is that point, exactly?
00:57:59Well, when he was a baby,
00:58:00wherever he went,
00:58:01to a friend's house or to the park,
00:58:03baby was doing things he wasn't.
00:58:05I mean, children even younger than him.
00:58:06Walking, talking and so on.
00:58:09We used to lie awake at night worrying.
00:58:11My wife's younger sister,
00:58:12she's Mongol,
00:58:13Down syndrome, they call it now.
00:58:15Of course we knew Kevin wasn't like that,
00:58:17but the thought of it was always there.
00:58:20Even when she was pregnant,
00:58:21the thought of it was there.
00:58:23She said it would be our punishment.
00:58:26Punishment?
00:58:27Oh, I didn't mean that exactly.
00:58:28Well, what did you mean?
00:58:29My wife and I,
00:58:30we were very happy when we were first married.
00:58:32Happiness like that, affection like that,
00:58:34she was unused to.
00:58:35Made her uneasy.
00:58:36She always said she'd have to pay for it one day.
00:58:39It was rather a bleak view of life, wasn't it?
00:58:42Well, that's the way she saw things.
00:58:44Sees things.
00:58:44See, so the defendant,
00:58:47or rather your wife's diagnosis of him,
00:58:49was supposed to balance things.
00:58:52Is that what you're really asking us to believe?
00:58:54Yes, it's not logical.
00:58:55I know I tried to tell her that.
00:58:57But my wife doesn't operate on logic.
00:58:59She trusts more to her emotions,
00:59:01and there's nothing like a child to bring out emotion.
00:59:04So you didn't consider this diagnosis of Kevin
00:59:07in the same light?
00:59:08Well, I know these things happen.
00:59:10I mean, when you have children,
00:59:11it's like a lottery.
00:59:11You can't always guarantee what you'll get.
00:59:13You said you only agreed with your wife's diagnosis
00:59:16up to a point.
00:59:18At what point did you start to doubt it?
00:59:20Well, I remember taking Kevin to a playground
00:59:23when he was small.
00:59:24There are other families there with this toddler,
00:59:30and this toddler, he stood there dribbling,
00:59:33looking around as if he didn't know where he was,
00:59:35like young children do.
00:59:38The parents laughed.
00:59:39When you've been given cause to doubt your child in that way,
00:59:43you look at things very differently.
00:59:44You can't just laugh and shrug it off.
00:59:46With respect, Mr. Owen,
00:59:47you haven't answered my question.
00:59:50At what point did you start to doubt the accuracy
00:59:52of your wife's diagnosis concerning the defendant?
00:59:57My contact with Kevin wasn't all that it should have been.
01:00:00My work took me away from home a lot,
01:00:01and I remember when he was about eight,
01:00:03I was in Manchester on a job,
01:00:05and I was parked near this playground,
01:00:07waiting for a client,
01:00:07and there was two lads playing around.
01:00:09They were about Kevin's age, more or less,
01:00:12and they reminded me of him.
01:00:14I realized then that he could have been out
01:00:16playing like them,
01:00:17and there was no difference.
01:00:19So you don't now consider your son
01:00:21to be different at all?
01:00:23Only in that we have made him so.
01:00:25Did you ever confront your wife with this?
01:00:28Yes, but I'd left it too late.
01:00:29In what respect?
01:00:31She wanted a baby.
01:00:32I wanted a son.
01:00:34Can you explain what you mean by that?
01:00:37She had built her life around the fact
01:00:38that she had a child
01:00:39who would probably never grow up.
01:00:41When children grow up,
01:00:43they leave home, don't they?
01:00:45Now, you say your contact with your son
01:00:48wasn't all it should have been.
01:00:49Was that only because your work
01:00:50took you away so much?
01:00:53No.
01:00:54The fact is, Mr. Owen,
01:00:55you have been, at least partially,
01:00:57living with another woman
01:00:58for the past ten years.
01:01:01Yes.
01:01:03Now, in your opinion,
01:01:05how did Kevin, as he got older,
01:01:06respond to your wife's treatment of him,
01:01:09this continually treating him as a child?
01:01:11He seemed to accept it.
01:01:12Seemed?
01:01:12Sometimes he got a little restless.
01:01:14And did this cause rouse?
01:01:15If they were rouse, they came from me.
01:01:17From you?
01:01:17Yes, she had to be told.
01:01:19See what she was doing to him.
01:01:20It was up to me to tell her.
01:01:20But it was too little, too late.
01:01:24Why do you keep saying
01:01:25it was too late, Mr. Owen?
01:01:28Well, it suited me,
01:01:29her belief about Kevin.
01:01:30He filled the gap I'd left in her life.
01:01:33People say a family is unhappy
01:01:34where there's no love.
01:01:37An excess of it
01:01:37can have the same effect.
01:01:38Your name is Carla Elizabeth Wright,
01:02:00and you're a psychiatrist
01:02:01in the psychiatric department
01:02:02of Forchester General Hospital?
01:02:04I am.
01:02:05Will you tell us, please,
01:02:06how you came to know the defendant?
01:02:08The social worker handling his case
01:02:10at the remand centre
01:02:11asked me to see Kevin
01:02:12in order to make
01:02:13a clinical assessment of him.
01:02:15And how many times
01:02:16did you see him in all?
01:02:17We had four one-hour sessions.
01:02:19Were you able to make
01:02:20an assessment after that time?
01:02:21I was able to come
01:02:22to some conclusions, yes.
01:02:23Would you be kind enough
01:02:24to tell us what they were, please?
01:02:26Kevin is cross-lateral,
01:02:28a condition sometimes
01:02:29confused with dyslexia.
01:02:31What does being cross-lateral mean?
01:02:34Well, at its simplest,
01:02:35it's where neither side
01:02:36of the brain is dominant.
01:02:37If you're left-handed,
01:02:39the right-hand side
01:02:39of the brain is dominant,
01:02:40and vice versa.
01:02:42In Kevin's case, it's equal.
01:02:44This has given him certain
01:02:45motor and coordination problems,
01:02:48also a difficulty with reading,
01:02:49which he tends to see
01:02:50in mirror writing.
01:02:52However, it's got nothing to do
01:02:53with his overall intelligence,
01:02:55which I place as above average.
01:02:57Anything else?
01:02:59His lack of contact with people
01:03:00has given him a lot of inhibitions,
01:03:02resulting in a somewhat awkward,
01:03:05abrupt manner.
01:03:07He has a tendency towards depression,
01:03:10but I found no evidence
01:03:11of any psychotic behavior.
01:03:13In fact, on the whole,
01:03:15I find him cooperative
01:03:16and responsive.
01:03:17Would you define for us,
01:03:18in layman's terms, please,
01:03:20what you mean by psychotic?
01:03:22A severe mental derangement
01:03:24involving the whole personality.
01:03:26And you found no evidence of this
01:03:28during your sessions
01:03:29with the defender?
01:03:30No.
01:03:31Now, we've heard stories
01:03:33about fits of violent temper.
01:03:36Can you shed any light on that?
01:03:39Yes, that was something
01:03:40we touched on.
01:03:42In my view,
01:03:43such symptoms are quite in accord
01:03:45with the circumstances
01:03:46of his home life,
01:03:47the depression and so on.
01:03:49Now, did he ever,
01:03:50during your interviews with him,
01:03:52indicate that he was anxious
01:03:53to leave home,
01:03:54to leave his mother?
01:03:55Well, on the contrary,
01:03:57he spoke of her
01:03:58almost continuously.
01:03:59He's almost entirely
01:04:00dependent on her.
01:04:02Yes, now you say
01:04:03his manner can be abrupt.
01:04:05Could you elucidate?
01:04:08Because he's inexperienced
01:04:10in dealing with people,
01:04:11he finds it rather hard
01:04:13to talk to them, initially.
01:04:16He tends to be rather
01:04:17brash, I suppose, curt.
01:04:20Could this curtness
01:04:21be mistaken for aggression,
01:04:24appear threatening,
01:04:25to someone who didn't know him?
01:04:27I imagine so.
01:04:29Could you be more specific,
01:04:30Dr. Wright?
01:04:32Without a more specific instance,
01:04:34no.
01:04:35All right, then.
01:04:35Let me give you a scenario
01:04:36of an old lady,
01:04:39frightened out,
01:04:40alone on the street at night.
01:04:42And the defendant addressed her,
01:04:44called out to her.
01:04:46Now, could his manner
01:04:46seem threatening then?
01:04:48Very much so, I'd say.
01:04:52How great an influence
01:04:54would you say
01:04:55that television has played
01:04:56in his life?
01:04:58Considerable influence,
01:04:59obviously.
01:05:01Would you say sufficient influence
01:05:02to make him mimic people
01:05:04or events on television programs?
01:05:05It might occur to him,
01:05:08but his lack of confidence
01:05:10would be an impediment,
01:05:11certainly outside the home.
01:05:14He's been brought up
01:05:15believing himself
01:05:16to be different.
01:05:18If he does have any ambitions,
01:05:19it would be to dispel that,
01:05:21to make himself
01:05:22as inconspicuous as possible.
01:05:25He has an acute fear
01:05:27of people staring at him.
01:05:28You say the defendant
01:05:34has a tendency to depression.
01:05:36Yes.
01:05:37About what?
01:05:39What was he so depressed
01:05:40about, Dr. Wright?
01:05:42The fact that he was lonely.
01:05:44Did he blame anyone for this?
01:05:47No, he barely recognized
01:05:48the cause himself.
01:05:50But he was aware
01:05:50that he wasn't altogether happy.
01:05:54He has a very low expectation
01:05:56of happiness.
01:05:57That seems to be
01:05:58something he got
01:05:59from his mother.
01:06:00He doesn't expect life
01:06:02to be something one enjoys,
01:06:04simply something
01:06:05one must get through.
01:06:07This gave him
01:06:07a negative outlook on life,
01:06:09which consequently
01:06:09contributed to his depression.
01:06:11You used the word
01:06:12symptom in connection
01:06:13with his alleged
01:06:14outbursts of temper.
01:06:16Did I?
01:06:17What did that mean exactly?
01:06:20Perhaps it was
01:06:21the wrong choice of word.
01:06:22Well, if you tell us
01:06:22what the word means
01:06:23in layman's terms,
01:06:25perhaps we can decide
01:06:26whether it was appropriate
01:06:26or not.
01:06:27It's obvious
01:06:28what it means.
01:06:29Surely an external sign
01:06:30indicating something
01:06:31is wrong.
01:06:32So if we assume
01:06:33that your choice of words
01:06:34was not inaccurate,
01:06:36what was wrong with him
01:06:37to give him
01:06:37these fits of temper?
01:06:38Frustration at his situation,
01:06:43I imagine.
01:06:46Now, you say
01:06:47he's almost entirely
01:06:48dependent on his mother.
01:06:50Yes.
01:06:51Well, isn't that
01:06:51rather an unhealthy
01:06:52state of affairs
01:06:53for a young man
01:06:54of his age?
01:06:55It's inevitable,
01:06:56I'd have thought,
01:06:57given the facts
01:06:57of his upbringing.
01:06:58And don't the facts
01:06:59also suggest to you
01:07:00that he resented
01:07:01his deprivation
01:07:02and therefore
01:07:03sought of away
01:07:03from escaping from it?
01:07:04his relationship
01:07:07with his mother
01:07:08is very complex.
01:07:11If he does
01:07:12resent her,
01:07:14I doubt he's
01:07:15ever acknowledged it.
01:07:17These things are
01:07:17very painful,
01:07:18go very deep.
01:07:21He never spoke
01:07:22of wanting
01:07:22to leave home
01:07:23to me.
01:07:23but actions
01:07:24sometimes speak
01:07:25louder than words,
01:07:26don't they?
01:07:28Isn't that
01:07:28rather a cliché?
01:07:30Oh, come now,
01:07:30Dr. Wright.
01:07:32Isn't human behaviour
01:07:33rather a cliché?
01:07:36Now, what is his
01:07:37attitude towards
01:07:38women,
01:07:39aside from his mother?
01:07:42He's had virtually
01:07:43no contact with them.
01:07:44And has this complex
01:07:45and obviously troubled
01:07:46relationship with his mother
01:07:47coloured his view
01:07:49of all women, perhaps?
01:07:50Made him regard them
01:07:51in rather
01:07:51an oppressive light?
01:07:54It's not inconceivable.
01:07:56You've also spoken
01:07:57of his intelligence,
01:07:58which you rate
01:07:58quite highly.
01:08:01Yes.
01:08:02Now, is he
01:08:02intelligent enough
01:08:03in your estimation
01:08:04of him to lie,
01:08:05if necessarily,
01:08:07quite ingeniously?
01:08:09He's certainly
01:08:10intelligent enough to.
01:08:11Whether or not
01:08:12it would occur to him
01:08:13is another matter.
01:08:13But the mental capacity
01:08:14is there,
01:08:15should he wish to.
01:08:17As much as it is
01:08:18with anyone, yes.
01:08:20Now, these sessions
01:08:21you had with him,
01:08:23would you place
01:08:24his intelligence
01:08:25high enough to let us
01:08:26say he would attempt
01:08:27to mislead you,
01:08:30give you a false impression
01:08:31of his character?
01:08:33I'm a trained psychiatrist.
01:08:35I doubt he'd have succeeded.
01:08:36But once again,
01:08:37you concede
01:08:37it's not impossible
01:08:38that he should try.
01:08:40But why should he want to?
01:08:41To substantiate his story,
01:08:43for the events
01:08:44leading up to his attack
01:08:45on Mrs. Stone,
01:08:46to win your sympathy,
01:08:47and therefore,
01:08:48ours.
01:08:48My sympathy
01:08:49is not that easily won.
01:08:51But in the end,
01:08:52we are talking about
01:08:53opinions, are we not?
01:08:55Your opinion
01:08:56of his character
01:08:56based on these
01:08:57intermittent sessions
01:08:59you had with him.
01:09:00My professional opinion,
01:09:02yes.
01:09:03Have you ever been wrong
01:09:04in a professional opinion
01:09:05concerning a patient?
01:09:07I'm not infallible.
01:09:09Are you?
01:09:09Dr. Wright.
01:09:10We are talking about
01:09:14a boy who,
01:09:15in your own words,
01:09:16is above average intelligence
01:09:17and whose mother
01:09:18says he is retarded.
01:09:21You see,
01:09:21I believe when he came
01:09:22across Mrs. Stone
01:09:23that night,
01:09:24his attack on her
01:09:25was not simply
01:09:26to get her money,
01:09:28but a vicious attack
01:09:29on her as a woman
01:09:30who, like his mother,
01:09:32stood in the way
01:09:33of what he wanted.
01:09:35Have you been reading
01:09:36Reader's Digest?
01:09:37Dr. Wright,
01:09:38don't be impertinent.
01:09:40Members of the jury,
01:09:45the charges against
01:09:46the accused
01:09:47are those of robbery,
01:09:48assault,
01:09:49occasioning actual
01:09:50bodily harm,
01:09:51and possessing
01:09:52an offensive weapon.
01:09:55Now, the prosecution case
01:09:56is that the defendant,
01:09:57in his anxiety
01:09:58to get away
01:09:59from an unhappy home life,
01:10:00deliberately attacked
01:10:02Mrs. Stone
01:10:02in order to steal
01:10:04her handbag from her,
01:10:05and that the attack
01:10:06and the robbery
01:10:07were not only deliberate,
01:10:08but maliciously premeditated.
01:10:11The defense admits
01:10:13that the events
01:10:13of the night in question
01:10:14need explanation,
01:10:16but they claim
01:10:17that they were due
01:10:17to the facts
01:10:18of his home life,
01:10:20that he never intended
01:10:21to attack Mrs. Stone,
01:10:22but simply to ask
01:10:24directions from her.
01:10:25They maintain
01:10:26that it was, in fact,
01:10:27Mrs. Stone's own fear
01:10:29of being mugged,
01:10:30which precipitated
01:10:31the situation,
01:10:32and that she slipped
01:10:33and fell to the pavement.
01:10:35Now, there was a witness
01:10:37to the alleged attack
01:10:38on Mrs. Stone,
01:10:39and you must weigh
01:10:39his evidence up
01:10:40very carefully.
01:10:41Whether or not,
01:10:42as the prosecution claim,
01:10:44he was impartial
01:10:45and had a clear view
01:10:46of what he saw,
01:10:48or, as the defense claim,
01:10:50his view was handicapped
01:10:51firstly by the rain,
01:10:53and secondly,
01:10:53by his opinion
01:10:55of the incident
01:10:55being colored
01:10:56by prejudice.
01:10:58You must also remember
01:10:59that it is for the prosecution
01:11:00to prove the case,
01:11:02so you must therefore
01:11:03be satisfied
01:11:04beyond reasonable doubt
01:11:05of his guilt.
01:11:06It is not for the defendant
01:11:08to prove his innocence.
01:11:11And will you now retire,
01:11:12elect a foreman
01:11:13to speak for you,
01:11:14and consider your verdict.
01:11:20On the first count
01:11:21in the indictment,
01:11:22that of robbery,
01:11:23do you find the defendant,
01:11:24Kevin Owen,
01:11:25guilty or not guilty?
01:11:26Not guilty.
01:11:27On the second count,
01:11:29assault occasioning
01:11:30actual bodily harm,
01:11:31do you find the defendant
01:11:32guilty or not guilty?
01:11:34Not guilty.
01:11:35On the third count,
01:11:36being in possession
01:11:37of an offensive weapon,
01:11:38do you find the defendant
01:11:39guilty or not guilty?
01:11:41Guilty.
01:11:44Kevin Donald Owen,
01:11:47it is unlawful
01:11:48to carry dangerous objects
01:11:50in public places,
01:11:52but as you have been acquitted
01:11:53of the charges
01:11:54of robbery and assault,
01:11:55I shall give you
01:11:57a conditional discharge
01:11:58for two years.
01:12:00All stand.
01:12:00All stand.
01:12:01.
01:12:06.
01:12:10.
01:12:16.
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