'But Wait, Madam Secretary—I'm Not Fussing At You': Kennedy Presses McMahon Over $1 Trillion Program

Forbes Breaking News

At today's Senate Appropriations Committee hearing, Sen. John Kennedy (R-LA) questioned Education Sec. Linda McMahon.

Transcript

00:00Madam Secretary, I want to welcome, by the way, I want to ask you about the TRIO program

00:13that has been mentioned, and it's sister program, Gear Up.

00:19Okay. We spend $1.58 billion a year on TRIO? Yes. That's $1,580 million a year. Is my math right? I think that's right, sir.

00:42And how long have we been spending $1,580 million a year on this program?

00:51I'm not sure of the total length of time of the program.

00:54More than 10 years? Yes.

00:57So that's over a trillion dollars we've spent on this program.

01:01And in this program, this trillion dollars we've spent, we give this money, as I appreciate it,

01:10to colleges and universities to encourage poor kids to go to college. Is that right?

01:20To provide some of those kids who have not yet been exposed to what it takes to get ready to go to college.

01:28Okay. To encourage poor kids to go to college, right?

01:32Yes.

01:32Okay. And given that we've spent a trillion dollars, how many poor kids who otherwise wouldn't have gone to college

01:48have gone to college and graduated?

01:50A significant number, I would imagine.

01:52How many?

01:53I don't know exactly.

01:56Isn't that a question we should ask?

01:58I think so. And I'd be happy to get back to you with that answer.

02:01You know, the other thing about the...

02:02But wait, Madam Secretary, I'm not fussing at you.

02:07Do we have that number?

02:13I don't think so.

02:14I'm looking... We don't have it.

02:15I don't think so because there is the...

02:17Well, if we were... So we've spent a trillion dollars and we've given this money to universities

02:24and they're supposed to encourage poor kids to go to college,

02:27but we don't know how many poor kids went to college who otherwise wouldn't have gone to college

02:35and graduated, right?

02:40Correct.

02:42Well, what do your audits show?

02:45Well, that's the issue. And I mentioned it when I was...

02:48Are you able to audit?

02:49We're not. We're not able to audit. And there are constraints against the TRIO program for its accountability.

02:55The other issue with...

02:56Well, but I'm sorry to cut you off, but I don't want much time.

02:59So we spent a trillion bucks. We gave it to the colleges. We said, encourage poor kids to go to college.

03:05We don't know how many kids went to college because you don't have the authority to audit.

03:10How do you know these universities are not just using the money to operate instead of encouraging poor kids to go to college?

03:19I'm not sure.

03:21You don't know how?

03:22No.

03:22Because you can't audit.

03:23Correct.

03:24You understand, hope is not a strategy.

03:28Yes, sir.

03:30I mean, if you told the average American, we just spent a trillion dollars of your money,

03:36and we gave it to colleges and universities, and we said, encourage poor kids to go to college,

03:42but we don't know how many kids went to college who otherwise wouldn't have gone and who graduated.

03:50You understand the average American would ask us what planet we just parachuted in from, right?

03:57That's right.

03:58You know, Senator, if I may, there's one other issue on the TRIO program.

04:04What we have found is-

04:05I'm going to run out of time.

04:06You can make it fast.

04:08Take your time back then.

04:09Let me ask you a question about our skirmish with Harvard, and I don't want to get under the merits.

04:18President Trump has said that Harvard is violating federal law, and he's withholding their money.

04:28Is that right?

04:29Yes, sir.

04:31And Harvard has responded, we've never violated federal law, but if we did, we give you a pinky promise that we won't do it again.

04:43Is that right?

04:44Yes.

04:44And then President Trump said, okay, no offense, but, you know, I just want to be sure.

05:01So why doesn't Harvard, I will give Harvard the authority to appoint a monitor, pick a monitor, pick whomever they want.

05:09If the federal government has the right to veto the pick, so if they pick their brother-in-law, that wouldn't be fair.

05:17And Harvard has said, no, you just have to trust us.

05:20You have to accept their pinky promise.

05:23Is that basically what's going on?

05:25Well, and not only that, but Harvard did respond to our request for negotiations with a lawsuit.

05:30We're in the throes of litigation.

05:32If Harvard would just agree to a monitor, that would solve the problem, wouldn't it?

05:38Might serve part of it.

05:39The provost is what, vice provost that we've asked that would come on to be one of the monitors on that situation.

05:45I'm way over.

05:46I'm sorry, Madam Chair.

05:48Senator Reid.

05:49Well, thanks very much.

05:51Welcome, Madam Secretary.

05:53I'm not a great mathematician, but I think you were talking about a trillion dollars.

05:58I believe.

Category

Transcript

Recommended