One month after the Pahalgam terror attack, Prime Minister Modi delivered a strong warning to Pakistan during a visit to Bikaner, stating that terrorists now know the consequences when 'sindoor turns into barood'. Despite India's strikes on terror bases in Pakistan, the four attackers behind the Pahalgam massacre remain at large. The program discusses the challenges in hunting terrorists, India's diplomatic efforts, and the response to the attack. Experts analyze the diplomatic, security, and intelligence aspects, questioning accountability and lessons learned. The discussion includes Pakistan's narrative, the need for human intelligence, and suggestions to reach out to Kashmiri people. Additionally, the program covers the shooting at a Jewish museum in Washington DC and the International Booker Prize win for Kannada author Banu Mushtaq.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today. This is your
00:03primetime destination, news, newsmakers, talking points. Tonight's big talking
00:07point, it's exactly one month after the Pahalgam massacre. What really has
00:13changed in the past month? We're going to discuss that and raise several relevant
00:20questions. Also, two Israeli embassy staff killed in Washington. What are the
00:25implications of that for that conflict? And the Booker winner, Manu Mushtaq, will
00:31be joining me. She's among my special guests on the show today. So we've got
00:35plenty to look forward to, as always, on the news today. But first, it's time for
00:41the nine headlines at night. One month since the Pahalgam terror attack, Prime
00:46Minister Modi delivers another warning to Pakistan. Claims terrorists now know
00:51what happens when sindoor turns into barood. Claims that sindoor runs through
00:58his veins, not blood. Rahul Gandhi says the rhetoric is designed for the camera.
01:07One month since the Pahalgam massacre, four attackers are still at large. Six
01:13terrorists have been eliminated in the Kashmir Valley in the last one week. But
01:17the main culprits remain at large. External Affairs Minister S. Jai Shankar
01:26targets Pakistan's army chief. Claims there's a clear link between the Pahalgam
01:31attack and General Asim Munir slams radical Pakistani leaders and army for
01:36fueling cross-border terror. India sends out a warning to Turkey and China, urges
01:46to stop backing cross-border terror. The MEA says ties must be built on mutual
01:51respect and sensitivity. Two Israeli Embassy staffers killed in firing
01:57outside a Jewish museum in Washington DC. Alleged free Palestine chant by
02:02attacker during the arrest. Trump condemns it, says killings based on
02:07anti-semitism must end. Supreme Court reserves its order on a pre-seeking and
02:14interim stay on the Waqf Amendment Act 2025, following arguments challenging
02:19the Act's constitutional validity. DBI files charge sheet against seven people
02:25including former Jammu and Kashmir Governor Satyapal Malik in connection
02:29with an alleged corruption in a hydropower project. The opposition claims
02:33Malik is being targeted because he was exposing the Modi government.
02:40Storm in Karnataka over the Ramya Rao case and alleged links to Home Minister
02:49Parmeshwara's education companies as ED raids the Home Minister's Medical
02:54College for a second straight day. DK Shivkumar comes in defense of his
02:59colleague. The major security scare at actor Salman Khan's residence. 36 year
03:05old model Isha Chhabria entered the actor's Bandra home at around 3 a.m.
03:10is booked for criminal trespass.
03:18Let's first though turn to our top story tonight. Prime Minister Narendra Modi
03:24went all guns blazing once again against Pakistan. During a visit to Bikaner in
03:30Rajasthan exactly a month after the Pehalgam massacre, the Prime Minister
03:34fumed at the manner in which that terror attack had taken place. Once again
03:39squarely blaming the Pakistan based sponsored terror. But he said that
03:45terrorists now know what happens when Sindoor turns into Barood. He went on to
03:51add that he is will keep to his promise to reduce terror to rubble and won't let
03:58the country down at any cost. Listen in first to the Prime Minister in Bikaner.
06:28Tough words there from Prime Minister Modi in Bikaner. The Congress
06:49though persisted with its demand saying they want a joint Parliament session on
06:56Operation Sindoor. Listen in to what Praniti Shinde, the Congress MP and
07:01spokesperson said.
07:04When the country is asking for clarity, transparency and decisive leadership,
07:08then Prime Minister Modi should be included in the general assembly.
07:13And a special session of Parliament should be convened to discuss Op Sindoor and the Pehalgam attack.
07:23Why is Modi ji running away from this?
07:26What does the Modi government want to hide? Why doesn't it want to discuss these important national issues in the Parliament?
07:37The people of the country need scripted speeches, drone shots and orchestrated and choreographed silence.
07:46They don't want that. They want an honest answer.
07:51Now remember, all of this is exactly one month since the terror attack in the Baisaran Meadows near Pehalgam.
07:57While in this period India has struck terror bases in Pakistan and also struck at key air bases in Pakistan,
08:06there are still several questions unanswered. Including, where are the terrorists behind the attack?
08:14And how will accountability be fixed for the security lapses in Pehalgam?
08:20The fight to catch the terrorists over the last month has still not yielded results.
08:26Why is it so tough? Kamaljeet Sandhu and Mir Fareed with this report.
08:36A month ago, 25 tourists and one local villager were gunned down in Pehalgam.
08:42The sketches of four alleged Lashkar-e-Taiba terrorists including at least two Pakistanis
08:48allegedly involved in the massacre were released by the investigation agencies within 24 hours.
08:54The manhunt for the monsters of Pehalgam is yet to find success.
08:58The search and destroy operations have widened from Pehalgam to vast forest area of south and central Kashmir.
09:06The mission includes physical scanning of large areas from Anantnag to Kokarnag,
09:11from Tral to Srinagar's Dachigam forest.
09:15Experts say finding the terrorists could be like finding a needle in the haystack.
09:36And similarly, we also keep upgrading our systems of catching the terrorist intercepts
09:42as also the way we handle the counter-terrorist operations.
09:47In the last one month, security grid including the army, police, Rashtriya Rifles and CRPF
09:54carried out multiple operations resulting in three encounters.
09:58Two in South Kashmir and one in Kishtiwar.
10:02Six terrorists including a senior commander of the resistance front,
10:06the Lashkar Front believed to be behind the several terror attacks were killed.
10:10However, the terrorists behind Pehalgam massacre somehow eluded the net.
10:33The terrorists have been moving in those areas.
10:37So, it's a question of time and I am sure all the agencies, all the security forces would be hunting for them.
10:46The NIA which took over the probe from the Jammu Kashmir police has interrogated numerous locals
10:53including pony operators, shopkeepers and photographers.
10:58The agency has also analysed mobile phone data, videos and images from the attack site.
11:04The reward of 20 lakh rupees have been announced for any credible leads.
11:11In the immediate aftermath of the attack, hundreds of individuals including alleged
11:16overground workers of terror outfits were detained.
11:20Most were released after questioning.
11:24With a pause in Operation Sindoor,
11:26many say the security forces can fully concentrate on operations in hinterland.
11:31And that is why multiple counter-terror operations are currently taking place
11:35both in South Kashmir as well as in Jammu division.
11:39And this is where security forces say it's only a matter of time
11:42where they get the perpetrators behind the Pehalgam terror attack.
11:46With camera person Aman, this is Kamaljeet Sandhu for India Today.
11:51Let me bring you a 30 day report card.
11:55Pluses and minuses.
11:57First the pluses in the last 30 days since Pehalgam.
12:01India has struck terror bases in Pakistan.
12:04And not just any terror bases, they have struck the headquarters for example
12:08of the Lashkar-e-Taiba in Muridke and of the Jaish-e-Mohammad in Bawalpur.
12:16On the minus side though, no accountability has been fixed yet for the Pehalgam terror lapse.
12:22So that's number one.
12:24Let's turn to number two.
12:26Indus water treaty in abeyance.
12:28There are many who believe that the treaty needs review.
12:31It's a 1960s treaty.
12:32India is using water as an effective weapon for now to negotiate.
12:37On the other hand, Pakistan's army leadership has only got further consolidated.
12:43General Asim Munir has now designated himself as field marshal.
12:47That's the minus.
12:49Again on the plus side.
12:51India is building a relative political consensus with all party delegations
12:57going across the world to take India's viewpoint.
13:00On the other hand, Pakistan got its IMF loan and has not been isolated globally.
13:06In fact, many countries have made a distinction between Pakistan and terror.
13:11So that remains a question mark, almost a minus.
13:15And number four, the fact is that you've got...
13:21Okay, these are our three pluses and minuses.
13:23We'll bring you more in a moment.
13:25But one month after Pehalgam, what has changed?
13:29What are the challenges in the hunt for terrorists?
13:32Will accountability be fixed for the Pehalgam lapses?
13:37Operation Sindoor, has Pakistan learnt its lessons?
13:41How has India fared on the diplomatic front?
13:44Let's try and get an overview today.
13:46Joining me now, Lieutenant General A.K. Bhatt, former GOC 15 Corps, former DGMO.
13:51I'm also joined by Kuldeep Khoda, former DGP Jammu and Kashmir,
13:55former intelligence chief also of the J&K police.
13:58Amitabh Bhattu is Dean and Professor, School of International Relations, JNU
14:02and someone who's tracked India, Pakistan and Kashmir for decades.
14:06And K.C. Singh, former Secretary MEA at the Government of India.
14:10I appreciate all of you joining us.
14:12I want to come to the first question, which is 30 days after Pehalgam,
14:16we have still not been able to find the terrorist responsible for it.
14:21Kuldeep Khoda, as someone who's been involved in anti-terror operations
14:25when you were on the ground as DGP J&K and a former intelligence chief,
14:30how do you see that?
14:32Could the terrorists have actually escaped and crossed the LOC
14:35or do you believe that we are closing in on them?
14:38Rajdeep, our security forces, including the J&K police, have an excellent record
14:43of dealing with the terrorists who have been involved in similar incidents in the past.
14:48And it's a matter of time that they'll be either captured or eliminated.
14:52In most of the cases, they usually get eliminated because they get caught
14:56in some situation where they get neutralized.
14:59So, you don't think that they have crossed over?
15:02You don't think that they have managed in these 30 days to cross over?
15:05You're reasonably confident that they are still in the Kashmir Valley?
15:09You know, considering the area where they operated, the Baisarini area of Pehalgam,
15:15it's not very easy for them to manage crossover, especially when the security forces
15:21along the border are quite alert. The border is active. It is still sort of active.
15:28It will be very difficult for them to cross over. And especially after 22nd April,
15:33lots of operations have been launched all over, including Kishtwad, Bhadrawal, which has
15:38resulted in two operations, including one today also, where two terrorists got
15:42killed in Kishtwad and we lost one, Amin Jawan also. And there was an encounter in which
15:46three Jaish terrorists were killed in Pulwama also. Post Pehalgam,
15:50seven terrorists have been eliminated of both LET and Jaish. So, it's a matter of time when they'll be caught.
15:56In the past also, you know, similar thing happened when Pulwama occurred in 2019.
16:01There was lots of, you know, queries why they are not getting eliminated or captured.
16:06The investigation was carried out by NIA. 19 terrorists were identified.
16:13Seven of them, including the one who was suicide bomber, got eliminated in various encounters.
16:19Seven got arrested and five probably they have either crossed over or they have died as
16:24unknown terrorists in different encounters. So, it is not that the terrorists don't get caught.
16:31You know, average life of a terrorist is about six months to one year. In fact, 65% of the
16:36terrorists, that is the track record of our survey which we have carried out,
16:4165% of the terrorists get killed within one year. Some of them have slightly more time period, some have slightly less.
16:51So, we should not be despondent. So, you are saying don't be despondent by the fact that one month has
16:56gone and the terrorists have still not been tracked down. Okay, that's one question that I want to raise.
17:01I also want to raise questions concerning our military operations. General Butt, do you believe that our
17:10military operations have succeeded in ensuring that, as the prime minister claimed today,
17:17that we have sent out a toughen up message to terrorists or do you believe that on the other hand,
17:23it is actually given the Pakistani army leadership a fresh lease of life.
17:28You have got the general who is calling himself now a field marshal. So, Pakistan is claiming victory in a way.
17:34Okay, I will answer both of your questions. But before that, the question you put to the DGP, let me assure you, we will get the terrorists.
17:44Few days, few weeks, few months and if at all they happen to go to Pakistan, a few years. But we will definitely get them.
17:53Now, coming to your question about military targets and what we have achieved with it. We have very emphatically,
18:01surgically and with resoluteness targeted nine terrorist camps and hit them. Hit them where we wanted to send a message.
18:12And thereafter, when Pakistan has reacted, despite telling them that we do not want to escalate it,
18:18we have used the airports to hit them at the airfields. And if it had gone beyond, we would have hit them harder.
18:25So, let me assure you, the message we wanted to send for the cost of the 22 terrorists who had died, we have done it.
18:33Very emphatically. Now, that's a tragedy. That in Pakistan, whatever you do, the Akhars or the bosses of Pakistan will always upgrade themselves.
18:44Who can stop Asif Munir from becoming a field marshal or maybe higher if there is a rank.
18:51They can bestow anything on them and declare victory when there is total defeat. That is what I will say.
18:59But have we, General Bhatt, sent a powerful enough signal for the Pakistan army to abandon its policy towards terror?
19:09So, let me assure you that what we have done in Sindhur is an emphatic message.
19:17And the other part of the message is that the operation is ongoing. And the new normal which has been set,
19:24that another terrorist act, you will again be punished. Let me tell you, it is a very strong message and it will deliver results.
19:34Okay. Let me take then the diplomatic angle for a moment. And I want to play K. C. Singh, what was said by S. Jai Shankar,
19:45external affairs minister today in an interview in Europe that he did, about the Pakistani role,
19:51as well as the fact that Julia Kozak, the IMF director communications, has defended the loan to Pakistan.
19:58Listen in to them and then I will come to you, K. C.
20:01It started because it was triggered by a very barbaric terrorist attack in the Indian Union territory of Jammu and Kashmir
20:13where 26 tourists were murdered in front of their families after ascertaining their faith.
20:21And it was done in a way in which it was intended to harm tourism which is the mainstay of the Kashmir economy
20:30and to create a religious discord. Deliberately an element of religion was introduced.
20:38And to understand that you got to also see that on the Pakistani side, you have a Pakistani leadership,
20:45especially their army chief who is very driven by extreme religious outlook.
20:51It is part of a standard procedure under programs that our executive board conducts periodic reviews of lending programs to assess their progress.
21:02And they particularly look at whether the program is on track, whether the conditions under the program have been met,
21:09and whether any policy changes are needed to bring the program back on track.
21:15And in the case of Pakistan, our board found that Pakistan had indeed met all of the targets.
21:23So there you have IMF claiming, K.C., that Pakistan met its target. The loan goes ahead.
21:29In the diplomatic context, have we been able to isolate Pakistan?
21:34Have we been able to sufficiently convince the global community that Pakistan is an epicenter for terror?
21:40Well, I think that's the battle that is on now.
21:44I have in an article I've written in a Bombay newspaper called it a battle of narratives.
21:50And Pakistan has always been better at marketing their narrative because they're much more approachable,
21:57much more accessible, their prime minister is available, their senior military.
22:01Somehow we were reluctant to share information. We were reluctant to market our story.
22:08We have a story. We have a very good story. But somehow I think we've been deficient at marketing it.
22:14And that's why. And then on top of that, you've got President Trump interfering.
22:19Even yesterday when the South African president is meeting him, he again brings up India.
22:23Pakistan has created an equivalence and he again brings in.
22:26He is so desperate for a Nobel Prize that if there's any dispute anywhere in the world, you know,
22:32he wants to be seen as somewhere on the sidelines of that, though he'll do nothing much thereafter.
22:37Economist magazine put it very well. They said his problem is he wants to mediate,
22:42but he will never commit himself fully or commit his resources fully or really seriously get involved in it.
22:49And he's continuing the same semi-serious way, which is helping Pakistan.
22:54And the second thing which is happening is that Pakistan is now a non-permanent member
22:59of the Security Council from the beginning of this year till the end of 26.
23:04And that is why the delegations which have gone out, we are targeting 13 countries.
23:09There's no point in sending someone to China or to Pakistan.
23:13The other 13 we are sending our delegations to because the battle is going to be there.
23:18And Pakistan will be chairing the Security Council in July,
23:23which gives it an opportunity to bring up the issue as they want in the form they want.
23:28We can contest it, but they may bring up Indus Waters Treaty.
23:32They may bring up other things. And that is what Pakistan wanted.
23:36That's why they said they won. They didn't mean militarily they won.
23:41What they meant was they buy. And this is an old Pakistani trick.
23:45When you escalate, they start moving their nuclear weapons around.
23:49And that's when the Americans get concerned, the rest of the world gets concerned,
23:53and the Americans jumped in. Because even a day earlier, Trump was saying that,
23:57you know, we have nothing to do with it. Vance was saying it's none of our concerns.
24:01And then all of a sudden, we are having the American president announce
24:04that a ceasefire is available. And he did the same thing in 2019.
24:08So this is a very old game. And that's what Pakistan wanted.
24:12They wanted international attention. They wanted Kashmir.
24:15So has Pakistan, net you are saying, when it comes to the battle of narratives,
24:19at least Pakistan in this one month, has not been fully,
24:24I mean, have we been able to neutralize that narrative? Yes or no?
24:29We are still fighting that narrative. That's why you sent out seven delegations.
24:33And you sent them to 33 countries, not 13 countries. So you even sent to other countries.
24:39I haven't fully followed the logic of that. But they've gone to 33 countries.
24:44Essentially, you want to focus on the Security Council members. But yes,
24:49they have their narrative both in the media. We can curse the Western media.
24:54But then have you engaged the Western media? You know, you can't be just reading out a statement.
24:59That is not briefing. You have to brief. You know, I've written in a newspaper today.
25:05Casey, I take your point. You know, I want to move on a bit. You know, let me bring in other.
25:10Amitabh Mattu, give me your overview. Give me your overview. I put out certain pluses and minuses.
25:1630 days later, can we say with confidence, as the Prime Minister said today,
25:21that we have sent out a tough message to Pakistan. Enough is enough. There is a new normal in place.
25:27Thank you, Rajdeep. And I heard all the distinguished practitioners speak.
25:32So let me give an academic, more forensic, clinical view.
25:37I think there is no doubt that in terms of the strikes within Pakistan,
25:42deep within Pakistan and Pakistan occupied Kashmir, we have crossed the Rubicon.
25:47We demonstrated that an attack or a terrorist attack on Jammu and Kashmir will invite a response
25:55so that Pakistan Army, its proxies, the terrorists feel the cost.
26:01The question is, is this now going to deter the Pakistani Army and its proxies
26:09from indulging in the barbaric acts like they did in Pahalgam?
26:14The proof of the pudding will be in the eating. Only time can tell.
26:18The logic of deterrence is that you only know when it fails.
26:25If I was a Pakistani rational policymaker, I would be deterred.
26:29Then Pakistan, however, is not a rational state.
26:33And you cannot always assume that there will be a careful cost-benefit analysis in its policies.
26:41The second question, was there an intelligence failure? Of course there was.
26:46I think, for one, New Delhi and Srinagar relied far too much on electronic intelligence
26:54with the result that the human element, what I call the civil security grid,
27:00had become marginal to your intelligence operations.
27:03Secondly, we did not actually anticipate that tourists would be attacked,
27:08that tourists who are soft targets, who invite really the worst kind of response
27:17from public opinion would be targeted in this fashion.
27:20We hadn't anticipated that, and we didn't have the human intelligence on the ground.
27:24These are battle-hardened terrorists. I agree with what Khoda Saab has said.
27:29They have a short shelf life, and I'm sure they will be neutralized.
27:33But it is important to recognize that if we have to prevent another Pahalgam,
27:39we need to strengthen our infrastructure.
27:43Diplomatically, of course, with Donald Trump in the White House, all bets are off.
27:49There are no reasonable, rational calculations, again,
27:53which can determine how Trump will respond.
27:57So, on the table are numerous theories on why Pakistan seems to have got the bailout from IMF,
28:03why does Pakistan seem to have a responsive voice,
28:07from the fact that Pakistan has a stronger lobbyist,
28:10to the point that Pakistan seems to have bought into crypto,
28:15which is, as you know, seen as often as a front for the Trump family's fortunes.
28:21So, there are various explanations.
28:23India, as a democracy, hopes that its story will sell for itself. It's a victim.
28:28And, unfortunately, in this world of fast-moving narratives,
28:33it's not the simple narrative which most people absorb.
28:37They just want to find a more deeper story, which, unfortunately,
28:42often India is not able to communicate with the same kind of quickness and cunning
28:47as Pakistan's media managers seem to do. Whether it is right or wrong to send all these delegations,
28:53at least the message is that India stands united, and across the party divide, we are speaking in one voice.
29:00That's a pretty comprehensive view you've given us there, Professor Mattu,
29:04but I want to come pick up on one of those points, which is troubling.
29:07We need to fix accountability. This program is being done one month after Pahalgam.
29:12And I think it is important to know, is accountability being fixed?
29:16Pulwama 2019, we are not sure whether accountability was fixed, Mr. Khoda.
29:20Now, even at the Jammu and Kashmir police level, at the level of intelligence,
29:25at the level of the Unified Command, at the level of the LG, whose office is in charge,
29:30no one is removed. After 2008, the Home Minister of the country was removed.
29:35The Chief Minister of Maharashtra resigned. It seems, has accountability been fixed?
29:41Should this question not be asked, Mr. Khoda? Will accountability be fixed for the lapses in Pahalgam, a major security lapse?
29:49Rajdeep, I'm sure that there'll be quite a bit of postmortem as to why this incident happened,
29:56and how it can be prevented in future. You referred to Pulwama incident…
30:00Should heads not roll? Should heads not roll, Mr. Khoda? No heads are rolling?
30:04I'm coming to that. Post Pulwama incident in 2019, one DOSP of ours was found to be involved indirectly in the form of
30:14aiding and abetting terrorists, providing some logistic support. He was arrested, he was dismissed from service,
30:20and he's still in prison, he's facing the trial. So, it's not that the accountability is not fixed.
30:25Probably, it will not be made out in open, but measures are taken, everything is considered,
30:31with every operation or with every incident, we try to find out how it can be refined further.
30:37But one thing I want to underline is that we have to take human intelligence to slightly higher levels,
30:46because we are trying to relegate it to background and depending more on technical intelligence.
30:52Human intelligence is very important. Technical intelligence gives you an overall view of the happening.
30:57I think you make an important point that human intelligence somewhere, and the other point,
31:01which many people are making, General Bhatt, is what about the unified command?
31:06You see, the unified command has to ensure coordination at every level in a state like Jammu and Kashmir.
31:13And there's a feeling that somewhere there have been weaknesses in the system that we are not willing to acknowledge.
31:18Do you believe post-Pahalgam, there is enough attention on that?
31:21That we need to have a unified command that is functioning effectively under leadership.
31:27You need to fix the gaps in the system.
31:31So, well, let me assure you, the security forces there will go to the depth of it,
31:40find out what were the faults, take necessary corrections, and if necessary, heads will roll.
31:47Not to worry about that. That is not important today.
31:50What is important is, yes, to get the lessons right and to correct them.
31:55So, what is the biggest lesson, General Bhatt, according to you?
32:00Let me assure you, DGP Khoda has been there. I was a young officer and later as a Corps commander.
32:07The best coordination amongst security forces is there in Srinagar, 15 Corps.
32:15I am proud of it. As a Corps commander, I thought that was the hallmark of my command there.
32:21And it has carried on.
32:23Okay.
32:24Yes. You have to realize one thing.
32:28Tourists have been going there and the number has been increasing manifold.
32:35Yes, maybe that has brought our sights down.
32:38Because we assumed, and that was the assumption which has gone wrong, that they will never attack the tourists.
32:45Well, they have done that.
32:47So, you are saying that we have been shaken off in a way out of our complacency.
32:52We have learnt a lesson.
32:55We have learnt a lesson, you are saying. Okay.
32:57Have we learnt any lesson very quickly, KC Singh, diplomatically?
33:01Is there a lesson that we need to learn in particular to counter Pakistan narratives early enough
33:06that we are the victim, not the perpetrator?
33:09Rajiv, may I say a thing about counter-terrorism?
33:12As you know, I was coordinator of counter-terrorism of the MEA for two years.
33:16I led the first two delegations discussing counter-terrorism with Pakistan.
33:21Look, counter-terrorism has multiple dimensions.
33:24And I think what we did, one of the cardinal things, the 9-11 report of the USA, is information is always available.
33:32They knew that there are Arabs trying to fly planes, trying to learn how to fly planes in America.
33:38But then as the report says, it was a lack of imagination.
33:42You don't know how this may come into practice.
33:45Second thing is, no counter-terrorism works until you reach out to the minds and the hearts of the people.
33:53I think we reached a certain smug level where we thought 370 is done.
33:58It's a union territory.
33:59Governor's presence rule is there.
34:01We've just held the elections.
34:03But it's still a union territory.
34:05And we really made a serious attempt to reach out to the minds and hearts of the people.
34:10Because that is where the terrorists are recruited.
34:13It's not in thin air that terrorism arrives.
34:16So it's a multi-level approach.
34:19When you say accountability, it can't be just to the police or the intelligence officer.
34:23It's of the entire system.
34:25And I think till we understand that, you'll not be able to counter Pakistan.
34:30Can I just take your point about winning hearts and minds to an interview I did with a pony rider in Pahalgam two weeks ago.
34:39And I want Amitabh to give a final quick comment on that.
34:42This was a pony rider in Pahalgam listening to what he told me about Pahalgam's massacre.
34:55Yes, sir.
34:56Yes, sir.
34:57Yes, sir.
34:58Yes, sir.
34:59Yes, sir.
35:00Yes, sir.
35:01Yes, sir.
35:02Yes, sir.
35:03Yes, sir.
35:04Yes, sir.
35:05Yes, sir.
35:06Yes, sir.
35:07Yes, sir.
35:08Yes, sir.
35:09Yes, sir.
35:10Yes, sir.
35:11Yes, sir.
35:12Yes, sir.
35:13Yes, sir.
35:14Yes, sir.
35:15Yes, sir.
35:16Yes, sir.
35:17Yes, sir.
35:18Yes, sir.
35:19Yes, sir.
35:20Yes, sir.
35:21Yes, sir.
35:22Yes, sir.
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35:38Yes, sir.
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36:03Yes, sir.
36:04Yes, sir.
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36:06Yes, sir.
36:07Yes, sir.
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36:11Yes, sir.
36:12Yes, sir.
36:13Yes, sir.
36:14Yes, sir.
36:15Yes, sir.
36:16Yes, sir.
36:17Yes, sir.
36:18Yes, sir.
36:19Yes, sir.
36:20Yes, sir.
36:21Yes, sir.
36:22Yes, sir.
36:23Yes, sir.
36:24Yes, sir.
36:25Yes, sir.
36:26Yes, sir.
36:27Yes, sir.
36:28Yes, sir.
36:29Yes, sir.
36:30Yes, sir.
36:31Yes, sir.
36:32Yes, sir.
36:33Yes, sir.
36:34Yes, sir.
36:35Yes, sir.
36:36Yes, sir.
36:37Yes, sir.
36:38Yes, sir.
36:39Yes, sir.
36:40Yes, sir.
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36:42Yes, sir.
36:43Yes, sir.
36:44Yes, sir.
36:45Yes, sir.
36:46Yes, sir.
36:47Yes, sir.
36:48Yes, sir.
36:49Yes, sir.
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36:53Yes, sir.
36:54Yes, sir.
36:55Yes, sir.
36:56Yes, sir.
36:57Yes, sir.
36:58Yes, sir.
36:59Yes, sir.
37:00Yes, sir.
37:01Yes, sir.
37:02Yes, sir.
37:03Yes, sir.
37:04Yes, sir.
37:05Yes, sir.
37:06Yes, sir.
37:07Yes, sir.
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37:09Yes, sir.
37:10Yes, sir.
37:11Yes, sir.
37:12Yes, sir.
37:13Yes, sir.
37:14Yes, sir.
37:15Yes, sir.
37:16Yes, sir.
37:17Yes, sir.
37:18Yes, sir.
37:19Yes, sir.
37:20Yes, sir.
37:21Yes, sir.
37:22Yes, sir.
37:23Yes, sir.
37:24Yes, sir.
37:25Yes, sir.
37:26Yes, sir.
37:27Yes, sir.
37:28Yes, sir.
37:29Yes, sir.
37:30Yes, sir.
37:31Yes, sir.
37:32Yes, sir.
37:33Yes, sir.
37:34Yes, sir.
37:35Yes, sir.
37:36Yes, sir.
37:37Yes, sir.
37:38Yes, sir.
37:39Yes, sir.
37:40Yes, sir.
37:41Yes, sir.
37:42Yes, sir.
37:43Yes, sir.
37:44Yes, sir.
37:45Yes, sir.
37:46Yes, sir.
37:47Yes, sir.
37:48Yes, sir.
37:49Yes, sir.
37:50Yes, sir.
37:51Yes, sir.
37:52Yes, sir.
37:53Yes, sir.
37:54Yes, sir.
37:55Yes, sir.
37:56Yes, sir.
37:57Yes, sir.
37:58Yes, sir.
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38:00Yes, sir.
38:01Yes, sir.
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39:53Yes, sir.
39:54Yes, sir.
39:55Yes, sir.
39:56Yes, sir.
39:57Yes, sir.
39:58Yes, sir.
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40:00Yes, sir.
40:01Yes, sir.
40:02Yes, sir.
40:03Yes, sir.
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40:26Yes, sir.
40:27Yes, sir.
40:28Yes, sir.
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40:31Yes, sir.
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40:56Yes, sir.
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40:59Yes, sir.
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41:55Yes, sir.
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41:57Yes, sir.
41:58Yes, sir.
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42:00Yes, sir.
42:01Yes, sir.
42:02Yes, sir.
42:03Yes, sir.
42:04Yes, sir.
42:05Yes, sir.
42:06Yes, sir.
42:07Yes, sir.
42:08Yes, sir.
42:09Yes, sir.
42:10Yes, sir.
42:11Yes, sir.
42:12Yes, sir.
42:13Yes, sir.
42:14Yes, sir.
42:15Yes, sir.
42:16Yes, sir.
42:17Yes, sir.
42:18Yes, sir.
42:19Yes, sir.
42:20Yes, sir.
42:21Yes, sir.
42:22Yes, sir.
42:23Yes, sir.
42:24Yes, sir.
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42:26Yes, sir.
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42:29Yes, sir.
42:30Yes, sir.
42:31Yes, sir.
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42:33Yes, sir.
42:34Yes, sir.
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42:40Yes, sir.
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42:48Yes, sir.
42:49Yes, sir.
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42:52Yes, sir.
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43:29Yes, sir.
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43:57Yes, sir.
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46:59Yes, sir.
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50:21Yes, sir.
50:22Yes, sir.
50:23Yes, sir.
50:24Yes, sir.
50:25Yes, sir.
50:26Yes, sir.
50:27Yes, sir.
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50:29Yes, sir.
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51:11Yes, sir.
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51:52Yes, sir.
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52:40Yes, sir.
52:41Yes, sir.
52:42Yes, sir.
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52:44Yes, sir.
52:45Yes, sir.
52:46Yes, sir.