At Wednesday's House Appropriations Committee hearing, Rep. Mike Levin (D-CA) questioned Scott Cameron, a top advisor to Interior Sec. Doug Burgum, about the Army Corps of Engineers' proposed budget.
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00:00And I thank you, Ms. Malloy. At this time, I'd like to recognize my friend and colleague again from California, Mr. Levin, for five minutes.
00:08Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Cameron, back in February, DOGE published a list of agency offices whose leases were to be terminated.
00:17The Bureau of Reclamation Southern California Area Office, which provides water management support throughout Southern California, including in my district, was and is, I just checked the list again,
00:27on that list, along with hundreds of other facilities across the nation.
00:31The Southern California Area Office administers several essential programs that assist with water conservation and efficiency strategies,
00:38water recycling and desalination programs, and other watershed management activities.
00:43The decision to close this office and others like it makes our water less secure.
00:47And now Southern California is doing everything it can, charging ahead with innovative desalination and water recycling and reuse technologies.
00:54But when I look at what DOGE is doing regarding these lease cancellations,
00:58I fear that they'll leave communities like mine vulnerable, despite our best efforts to develop a resilient local water supply.
01:04Mr. Cameron, were you personally involved in the decision to close this office?
01:08Were you in the room?
01:10No, sir, I wasn't.
01:11My understanding is that the General Services Administration provided the department and other departments a list of leases that they were planning to cancel.
01:20And we have been very actively involved in terms of going back to GSA and indicating situations where we thought eliminating those leases would be problematic.
01:32That includes this office?
01:34Do you agree with the decision to close this office?
01:36I'm not aware of that particular lease, to be honest with you, Congressman.
01:40I'm happy to look into it.
01:41I can tell you that there are quite a few Bureau of Reclamation leases where we've been actively talking about GSA, about why it would be a real problem.
01:51But I'm happy to look into that one in particular.
01:53What criteria do you think that DOGE used to decide which offices to close?
01:58My impression is that it was actually a General Services Administration directive, whether it was the DOGE people at GSA, I don't know.
02:04I think they were looking at leases that were about to expire across the whole government, across all federal agencies.
02:12Do you think it's contrary to Reclamation's mission of protecting water resources in the interest of the American people to be closing these offices all over the place?
02:21We clearly have an interest and a need to operate the government as efficiently as possible, to stretch the dollars that the subcommittee provides.
02:30And where we've identified situations where we think it's counterproductive to close offices, we've been actively chatting with our friends at the General Services Administration, and at least in a number of instances, successfully so.
02:46I'm not aware of this particular situation, but I'm happy to look into it.
02:50Mr. Levin.
02:51Well, we'll follow up with you on that.
02:53Ms. Colasmo, I want to get back to the California projects that I mentioned earlier.
02:58Were you personally involved in the decision-making to not fund any of those projects, or not fund all of those projects?
03:06And do you have any idea who specifically was?
03:10Well, we deliberate the package with criteria, and we submit to OMB, and OMB and the administration make the decision.
03:15So do you have an actual human being that was responsible for making the decision?
03:19Do you have an email?
03:20Do you have...
03:21We don't make the decisions.
03:22We make recommendations.
03:22I understand that you don't personally, but you just said that OMB relayed those decisions to you.
03:27Do you have any correspondence with them that would indicate why those decisions were made?
03:30I do not have any correspondence.
03:33How did you...
03:33The Office of Management and Budget did their business, and they provided us the product.
03:35How did you learn that those determinations had been made?
03:39They provided us the final product.
03:41Who?
03:42The Office of Management and Budget did.
03:44Who specifically?
03:45They didn't provide it to me.
03:46I don't have a name, but it would be our examining unit.
03:48Okay.
03:49Who in your examining unit received the information?
03:52In our office?
03:53I'm trying to understand who at OMB made the call.
03:56Well, I think it goes all the way up to the director.
03:59Okay.
03:59So you're telling me Russ Vogt, the director of the OMB, personally made the decision to
04:02take $250 million away from California and the blue states to give it to the red states.
04:08Is that your testimony?
04:09My testimony is that he was engaged with his staff, as anybody would be, as much as I know.
04:13It's a simple yes or no question.
04:14I can't answer that question.
04:16Okay.
04:16I don't have full visibility on information.
04:18Okay.
04:19I appreciate that.
04:20We'll ask questions for the record to try to understand, get to the bottom of it.
04:24You said before the criteria used were life safety, flooding, and American prosperity.
04:29Which of these criteria were not met by the California projects that I mentioned earlier?
04:34I know the details of the California projects you're talking about.
04:36Well, let's unpack one.
04:37How about the Sacramento Delta?
04:38Do you agree that that Sacramento Delta region is perhaps most at risk for catastrophic flooding
04:43of anywhere in the western United States?
04:45I know they have challenges and risks, but I'm not at liberty to say what the trade-offs
04:49were on which the projects they chose.
04:51Do you not think that it meets life safety or flooding or American prosperity to try to
04:56protect lives and property in the Sacramento Delta region?
05:00I'm sure it does.
05:01How it stacks against other projects is not my call.
05:03Do you agree or disagree that it's one of the most flood-prone areas in the western United
05:09States, if not the entire country?
05:10It's certainly susceptible to flooding.
05:12All right, so it sounds like it doesn't meet the criteria that you laid out before.
05:17I don't think OMB followed, and I think you're getting played by OMB, and you don't even
05:21know who at OMB.
05:22And with that, I'll yield back.
05:26Thank you, Mr. Levin.
05:27At this time, I'd like to recognize the distinguished vice chairman of this subcommittee, my good
05:34friend from the great state of Texas, Mr. Cloud, for five minutes.
05:38Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank you all for being here.
05:43The work you all do is extremely important.