'You've Accepted $400,000!': Jake Auchincloss & RFK Jr. Trade Blows Over 'Conflicts Of Interest'

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During a House Energy Committee hearing last week, Rep. Jake Auchincloss (D-MA) asked Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. about conflicts of interest.

Transcript

00:00for five minutes of question. Good afternoon, Secretary. You've emphasized throughout your

00:06career concerns about corruption and conflicts of interest in health care, yes? About corruption

00:11in health care? Yes. Yeah. And you've pledged during your confirmation hearing and then again

00:16today, quote, radical transparency, yes? Yes. Yes. And you explained to my colleague from New York

00:23that you divested yourself, yes? Yes. And you fired the 17 members of ACIP because you think they have

00:30conflicts of interest, yes? Yes. And do you think that everybody within health and human services at

00:36a senior level should hold themselves to a standard of radical transparency and divestment? Well,

00:42I'm going to hold them to that standard, but... So not everybody should hold themselves to a

00:47standard of radical change? Yeah, everybody, and the OGE makes them all divest. So everybody should

00:52divest and everybody should be radically transparent. Who works for you? Yes. Yes. And does that include

00:58people who have involvement in health and human services policymaking, even if they're not in

01:02your department? Would you want them to be radically transparent as well? I don't have any control over

01:10anybody except those in my department. Well, I think you do. Let's talk, though, about how radically

01:16transparent you have been to date. So I want to ensure for the American public that they're getting what

01:19you pledged. Mr. Kelly Means is a special government employee. He's also a White House advisor.

01:26You know him well. He actually introduced you to Donald Trump. And he's the founder and the owner

01:30of TruMed. Now, TruMed is a company that sells saunas and supplements and maybe medical devices

01:36that you described to people using pre-tax dollars. And he has described his mission as routing federal

01:42funds away from health insurance programs towards these health savings accounts. Now, Mr. Means has

01:47tremendous influence over Medicare and Medicaid based on the executive order on making America

01:53healthy again and the one big, beautiful bill, which both call for the expansion of HSA usage

01:58for these wellness and supplement products. That's a direct revenue stream for his company

02:04while he's working in the government. So my question is, would you require Mr. Means to sign

02:11the financial disclosure forms that you're very familiar with?

02:14I have no power to do that. But I find it interesting that you bring that up.

02:17Would you interest that? I'm going to reclaim my time.

02:19Pharmaceutical companies have been in the White House for generations.

02:22This is my time, Secretary. My time. Would you require, in keeping with radical transparency,

02:28that this individual who you're very close with, who has a major role in shaping Maha agenda,

02:34and you have said so yourself publicly and many times, would you require him, before working

02:39on the Maha agenda, that he signed those disclosure forms? I have no power to require that. I can

02:43require people in my agency, and I've done that. Will you continue to work with him if he does not

02:48sign those forms? To who? With Mr. Means. Will you continue working with him if he does not sign

02:52those forms? I work with everybody, including all the pharmaceutical companies. Do you think that

02:56he should, do you think that he should respond to the letter that I wrote? And the insurance companies.

02:58Do you think that he should respond to the letter that I wrote requiring him, or asking him,

03:02I should say, to be transparent about potential conflicts of interest between TruMed and CMS and

03:09the Maha agenda? Is that something that he should do, in your opinion, in keeping with divestment?

03:13I mean, because you've said, sir. You're saying you wrote me a letter? He said, sir, you said before.

03:17You're saying you wrote me a letter? I wrote Mr. Means a letter, asking him to respond. Do you think

03:22he should respond? That's between you and him. As I said, there's been pharmaceutical companies for

03:26generations in the White House, and nobody complained about them. Secretary, you said that everybody who works on

03:30health policy should follow high standards of radical transparency and divestment. So I've

03:36asked him questions about whether he's done that. Should he, in keeping with what you just said at

03:40the top of this, should he be radically transparent? Let me ask you this. Have you accepted $400,000

03:45from pharmaceutical companies? And the reason you know that is because I have financial disclosure

03:49forms, and I'm asking him to submit the same thing. So should he do the same thing? Because when he

03:52doesn't, let's talk about what happened. Let's talk about Mr. Brad Smith. Would you be prevented from

03:57accepting money from pharmaceutical companies? Because it says here you've accepted...

04:00Mr. Kennedy, you asked Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, how did I do that when she talked about the higher rates

04:07given to the Medicare Advantage organizations? I actually have an answer for you. How did that

04:10happen? The answer is Mr. Brad Smith. So he was in charge of Doge Healthcare, and his biggest investors

04:15at his company, Main Street Health, are the Medicare Advantage organizations, the five biggest health

04:20insurance corporations in America. They're his investors. He owns this company. They own him. And while he

04:25was there, he set the rules and reimbursements for CMS to hook up his investors. So I'm going to answer

04:30the question that you asked Mr. Ocasio-Cortez. It is because of conflicts of interest. Do you think

04:35that CMS should continue to do business with Main Street Health under your watch? Is that radically

04:39transparent? Are you saying that we should cut Medicare Advantage? Do you think that Main Street

04:44Health should continue to do business with Medicare and Medicaid given the conflicts of interest?

04:47Are you saying we should cut Medicare Advantage? Mr. Kennedy, your dissembling and diversion

04:51distracts from the fact that you refuse to be radically transparent with either Mr.

04:54Means or Mr. Smith. I'm going to enter for the record now documents.

04:57You didn't give any money. He's united.

04:59Ockencloss oversight letters to Means and the Board of TruMed and Main Street.

05:04Without objection. Also bitted. The gentleman's time has expired. The chair now.

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