The Belarusian opposition leader in exile underscored Belarus' strategic importance for NATO and the EU security in an interview with DW. During a visit to Brussels, Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya said as long as the country's dictator Alexander Lukashenko remained in power, Belarus would form part of Russia's warfare efforts, potentially escalating the war in Ukraine.
06:08Because some sanctions can, of course, influence Belarusians themselves.
06:14And sanctions have to be smart, you know, to have exclusions for Belarusian people.
06:19So there is still a lot to do regarding sanctions.
06:23You know, we understand that, for example, North Korea is many, many, many years under sanctions.
06:28And somehow it's still living.
06:30But when sanctions are comprehensive and joined, just transatlantic sanctions, they are more effective and more useful for democracy.
06:41It has been almost five years that you and other members of the democratic movement in Belarus tried to achieve a peaceful change of the regime.
06:56In August, it will be the five year anniversary.
07:00However, what we're talking about clearly indicates that there has been no change, that the regime is still there.
07:09And the situation with human rights and also with the prisoners of the regime is just getting worse.
07:18So in case this goes on, how do you see the future of Belarus?
07:23Also geopolitically, is it going to get closer to Russia?
07:28Do you have your vision of this worst case scenario?
07:35Look, if you talk about worst case scenario, so Belarus under the rule of Lukashenko is becoming a satellite of Russia.
07:42And we can forget about independence and sovereignty of Belarus.
07:46But, you know, we as people, we have only two options, either to fight or to surrender.
07:54And our choice is evident.
07:56We don't know how long our fight will take time.
07:59But we can't say that situation is not changing in Belarus.
08:03Yes, Lukashenko is still there.
08:04And yes, repressions are increasing.
08:07But repressions are increasing because Lukashenko feels his weakness.
08:12He feels that, you know, for five years people didn't start to love him again or trust him again.
08:18You know, he feels absolutely weakness and fragility.
08:23And he's ready even, you know, to sell our country piece by piece to Russia, but only, you know, save himself.
08:29He doesn't care about Belarus.
08:30He cares only about his, like, personal survival, political survival.
08:34So we have to do all the possible to not to allow this worst scenario.
08:42And it's not only the task of Belarusian people.
08:45It's the task of the democratic world, you know, to widen the sphere of democracy, you know,
08:53and not to give up on fighting against dictators because dictators very fast, you know, feel this weakness of democracy
09:02and they will attack, you know, bolder.
09:05They will attack, you know, faster.
09:08And that's why we're encouraging our democratic allies, you know, not to stop as well.
09:15Not to say these words, look, sanctions are imposed, nothing is changing.
09:20Just find new instruments or use the instruments and institutions you have more effectively.
09:27Don't be, like, modest, you know, in working.
09:32Let's take such international institutions like UN.
09:36UN has many structures that are rather, you know, not working effectively, if I say mildly.
09:44Like UN Human Rights Council, you know, you structure that might demand, demand access to those who are held in a comunicado in the Belarusian prison.
09:56You have right here to demand from the regime answers.
09:59Not just, like, we don't have political prisons and that's it.
10:02Just loudly, publicly, you know, push, keep pressure.
10:06But, you know, sometimes it seems that, you know, democratic world and democratic institutions don't feel its strength, don't feel its power.
10:15What can we do against, you know, dictators?
10:17It's the same like Belarusian people, you know, told what we can do against dictators.
10:22But we managed, we showed that we are against, and for five years we are fighting against it.
10:27So, democracy, be bolder, you know, be stronger, show your teeth you have.
10:32So, I think it's a very logical but last question.
10:36Ukraine is fighting against a dictator that is trying to consume and invade their country.
10:43We have all been witnessing this horrible war for over three years now.
10:50And now there are some attempts, as you of course know, in establishing some or achieve some kind of a ceasefire.
10:58So, yes, taking into consideration everything that we have said about Belarus, here is an interesting question.
11:06What role can Belarus play in those ceasefire or peace talks in order to achieve at least a stable, a stable ceasefire in Ukraine?
11:19So, first of all, we have to understand that end of shooting is not the end of the war.
11:32End of the war should be just and should be long-lasting.
11:36It shouldn't be like a break for Russia to regroup and start attacking again.
11:42So, all these negotiations should bring, you know, clear understanding to Russia that, you know, they are not there, you know, to continue attacking Ukraine, you know, or absorbing Belarus or threatening European Union.
12:00So, it should be long-lasting peace on the conditions of Ukrainians.
12:04Ukraine is not like cake that can be cut into pieces and just be divided.
12:09The Ukrainians are very courageously, you know, defending their land.
12:12Second, Belarus should be part of these negotiations, not in Lukashenko's face.
12:19Lukashenko doesn't serve to the interests of Belarus.
12:22He is Putin's vassal.
12:24So, and I, like, understand that maybe Belarusian democratic forces cannot be part of these negotiations, but we are asking our democratic partners, first of all, Europeans, to put Belarusian issue on the table.
12:38You know, to discuss it, not to leave Belarus's consolation prize to Putin, to demand from Russia on this step of negotiation that they have to withdraw their troops from Belarus.
12:50They have to take away the nuclear weapon and not interfere into internal processes of our country.
12:56We are an independent nation that can choose or solve our future by ourselves.
13:01So, there should be such demands.
13:03Because Belarusians are really, you know, concerned that during these negotiations, Belarus might be overlooked, might be postponed for one day later.
13:13You know, we will return to Belarus later.
13:15We can lose our country.
13:16So, and so, as I hope the world understands strategic importance of Belarus for regional security, the question of Belarus independence and sovereignty will be on the table as well.
