Sharí Nycole catches up with gospel legend, Kirk Franklin, while he’s on his way to rehearsal for the BET Awards. While Franklin is “on the go,” he shares his excitement about his new single, “Do It Again,” his historic BET Awards honor and all that’s to come with his new YouTube show, “Den Of Kings.”
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00:00Where do I sit with that?
00:01Have you started the line?
00:03What's happening?
00:03No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
00:05I'm talking about the other times.
00:13What's going on, Essence family?
00:15It's your girl, Sheree Nicole here.
00:16And as always, I'm so excited when I get to have amazing conversations with amazing people.
00:21Today, I have the esteemed pleasure of chatting with the icon himself,
00:24a 20-time Grammy Award-winning artist, songwriter, producer, Kirk Franklin.
00:31Always a pleasure, Kirk.
00:32Thank you so much.
00:34So much you've done for the culture.
00:36So much you've done for gospel music and music in general.
00:38It is an honor to have you, and thank you for this time.
00:40Thank you for having me on your show.
00:42It's an honor to be here.
00:43It's great seeing you again.
00:45And, man, I'm excited to get into all the things.
00:49Absolutely.
00:50So before we get into your new single Do It Again,
00:52I do want to ask you, because you are in a moving vehicle,
00:55where in the world are you coming from, and where are you going?
00:58I just flew in from my home from Texas
01:03and just landed here in Los Angeles for the BET Awards.
01:08And we're here for the next few days just getting ready for rehearsals
01:11and just all the things.
01:14I mean, rehearsals, talking to press about the new song,
01:18talking about Den of Kings, talking about the merger.
01:22Talking about the BET event and talking about God, man.
01:27Talking about Jesus and talking about how dope he is
01:29and how, man, you know, there's not a human on this planet
01:35that he don't love.
01:37And that's my job, man, to just try to make sure, man,
01:40that there's always a place in culture for the conversation of Christ.
01:45I love that.
01:47And you talk about that even in your music,
01:49and you talk about that it should go beyond,
01:51as far as gospel is concerned, beyond the confinements
01:53and the spaces where it can challenge and inspire
01:56and connect the world in a real way.
01:58When we talk about these spaces and the connection
02:00and even thinking about the BET Awards as the backdrop in this,
02:04what are some spaces that you still hope and pray God allows you
02:07to infiltrate when it comes to your artistry?
02:10You know, that's very nuanced,
02:12and it's a very delicate space to kind of maneuver through
02:17because there, first of all, has to be an extreme gratitude
02:22that after all these years,
02:24God is kind enough to just still allow me,
02:27even a small place, if it be, or just whatever,
02:30to still try to be at the table,
02:33to, you know, just to curate and ideate on ideas
02:37that are even coming to life as of now.
02:39So it's like, you know, there's a delicate balance of gratitude
02:43and gratefulness that, you know,
02:46here I am now talking to you about three, you know,
02:49three or four beautiful pieces
02:51that allow me to have a relevant conversation.
02:56So I am grateful.
02:58And yeah, now, do I still dream?
03:01Do I still want more?
03:02Do I still want to have opportunities
03:04to still try to infiltrate?
03:06Yes, but man, you know,
03:08at this very moment,
03:11I have to be really thankful
03:13for this opportunity that I have
03:16to even sit on this phone with you
03:18and to talk about things,
03:23you know, tangible things.
03:25I mean, that in itself is such an incredible blessing.
03:28After 32 years in an industry, you know,
03:31I mean, my first album was at least 32 years ago.
03:35So, Kirk, I see we had to leave the car.
03:37The car service was a little shaky.
03:39So now you are walking around what we know as Beverly Hills
03:43and hopefully nobody tries to,
03:44no paparazzi comes and tries to swarm you.
03:47We're fine, we're fine, we're fine.
03:49We're fine, we're fine.
03:49We're fine, we're fine.
03:50But I do, I am curious,
03:53I'm curious with your storied, incredible career
03:56and your desire to, you know,
03:59be a part of the movement of gospel music
04:00that goes beyond the confinements
04:02and some of the limited spaces
04:03that we've seen in over the course of decades
04:07and kind of challenge and inspire
04:08and connect with the world in authentic ways
04:10as you move through
04:12and as you're beyond that 30-year mark
04:13in your own career,
04:14how do you hope your work
04:15and your ministry and your artistry
04:17really speaks to being able to do that?
04:19Wow, wow, wow, wow.
04:21That's a beautiful question.
04:24And there's so many layers.
04:26I think that I just really am striving,
04:29especially in this season of my life and career.
04:32I just want to really try to be-
04:33Bring your, bring your,
04:35so we can see your face.
04:36We lost your whole face.
04:37We were just getting the Kirk chest.
04:38There we go.
04:39Perfect.
04:40The Kirk chest is diabolical.
04:43Okay.
04:44All right.
04:45I just really want to move intentionally
04:47in this season of life
04:50is because I just want to make sure
04:54that the intent of the purpose
04:57of why I do what I do,
04:59that it is clear, you know,
05:01that I am here on the earth,
05:04you know, in the existence
05:06to do one important thing,
05:08to just make God's name great,
05:10to just tell the world how dope God is,
05:12to just really be super intentional
05:14that whatever we curate,
05:16whatever we ideate,
05:17that it leads people to this vertical journey.
05:21You know, even if the ideas start horizontally,
05:24that there's a platform,
05:26there's a moment,
05:27there's a space that we communicate
05:29that people think about
05:31the bigger things of life,
05:33why they're created,
05:34what about life after this life,
05:36what is the solution to real happiness,
05:39what is the need that we have
05:41for real fulfillment,
05:43the material things,
05:44and relationships,
05:45or sex,
05:46or money,
05:46or drugs,
05:47whatever,
05:48these things that,
05:50as our species continue,
05:52that seeks the purpose
05:53of the happiness
05:54that we all pursue,
05:56that I try to do my job
05:58with compassion,
05:59with humility,
06:01and with vulnerability,
06:02that I am telling people,
06:04not from the position of a physician,
06:08but from the position of a patient.
06:09And that's the goal of my life,
06:12whether it's music,
06:13whether it is any other thing
06:15that we curate,
06:16whatever medium it is,
06:17that the conversation
06:18is a relevant conversation
06:20with every human being
06:21about how dope God is.
06:23Interestingly enough,
06:25when I was asking you
06:26about where you were,
06:27where you were going,
06:28and you mentioned you're in LA,
06:29and you mentioned BET
06:30and all these other things,
06:32and one of the things
06:32you didn't really put emphasis on
06:34or mention at all
06:35is the fact that you're going to be honored
06:36with the BET Ultimate Icon Award.
06:40And I sit back
06:41and I think about
06:43just how humble you have to be
06:45to skip over that completely
06:47and tell me about everything else.
06:49And I know for someone like yourself
06:52who's so accomplished
06:53and who's worked so hard,
06:54it might be a little challenging
06:56to give yourself that pat on the back
06:57or that good job.
06:59But is there a way
07:00that you can bring to light to us
07:03just how it feels
07:04for BET to put that icon,
07:07that word, that term
07:08in front of your name,
07:10especially considering
07:11how much you've meant
07:11to not only the BET brand,
07:13but also the BET Awards.
07:16I'm going to pass with you.
07:17I'm so nervous
07:18about the performance.
07:19I'm so nervous
07:20about trying to,
07:20trying to, trying to,
07:22just, you know,
07:23you know, just like,
07:24that's the only thing on my mind.
07:25Only thing on my mind
07:26is just remembering
07:27all of the things
07:28I got to do musically
07:29and performance-wise.
07:31So it's like
07:32everything else,
07:33to be honest with you,
07:34secondary.
07:34It's because, you know,
07:35that, that, you know,
07:37that is who I am,
07:38you know,
07:39or, or, you know,
07:40that's, that's a major part
07:42of my calling in life,
07:43you know,
07:44is I like to get on stage
07:45and really strive
07:46out to be excellent,
07:48you know,
07:48and so, you know,
07:49as much as God's will
07:50is for me to do that.
07:51So that's really
07:52what's on my mind.
07:53I'm humbled.
07:54I'm humbled by the moment.
07:55I'm humbled by the opportunity.
07:57I just want to make sure
07:58that I don't get up there
08:00and mess up
08:01because I'm so nervous,
08:03you know,
08:03so that's kind of
08:04where my focus is right now.
08:06That mess,
08:07guys, ladies and gentlemen,
08:08first time hearing it first.
08:10Kirk Franklin gets nervous
08:11before performances.
08:12Definitely doesn't show
08:13when he's on the stage,
08:15but apparently.
08:16Every, every time.
08:18I don't care
08:18if it's at a high school gym.
08:20I don't care
08:21if it's at an AARP meeting.
08:23Wherever I am,
08:25I'm nervous
08:25when I pull up.
08:27Yes.
08:27So I know you,
08:28I know apples
08:29are a thing for you.
08:30Do you eat an apple
08:31to help you
08:31with your nervousness?
08:32What is your
08:32go away nervous routine?
08:35That, that is so funny.
08:36There's nothing you can do.
08:38There's nothing
08:38that I can do
08:39to take away the nerves.
08:40The nerves are always there
08:41and y'all gonna leave me alone
08:42with these apples.
08:43Y'all gonna, y'all gonna
08:44stop coming for me
08:45with my little apples.
08:47You know what's so funny?
08:51What is so funny
08:52is that I never would,
08:53I never would have thought
08:54that my apple thing
08:55would have ever become a thing.
08:57It is so cute and funny
08:58now that it's a thing.
09:01That's hilarious to me.
09:02Kirk, you come on the camera
09:03and you're literally
09:04chewing an apple
09:05and you expect us
09:06to not pay attention to that.
09:07And that's something
09:08you do all the time.
09:09I think it's very cool.
09:10I think it brings
09:11apple awareness.
09:12There's a lot of health
09:13to eating apples.
09:14I think you're saving lives.
09:16So I, I commend you.
09:18One, one apple at a time.
09:20One apple, one apple at a time.
09:23Saving lives one at a time.
09:24I got a couple more questions
09:25for you, Kirk.
09:25I'll let you get back
09:26in the vehicle.
09:27Okay.
09:27That way you can kind of focus
09:28and we get your head room
09:29because I know it's tough
09:30to walk and talk.
09:31There we go.
09:32I can see your face now.
09:33I'm ready.
09:34So, so beyond the apples,
09:36I have to get into
09:36your new single,
09:37Do It Again.
09:37It keeps going out
09:39on these beautiful people.
09:40Do they have Wi-Fi?
09:41Get out of the car.
09:43Okay, guys.
09:43So we're back now.
09:45This is, this is a documentary
09:46we're doing with Kirk Franklin.
09:49We're giving you
09:49the day in the life vibes.
09:51And I was asking him about
09:53before he had to get back
09:54in the car and out of it
09:55to get a good signal.
09:56I was saying to Kirk
09:57that I was listening
09:59to your new song,
10:00Do It Again.
10:01And I was listening
10:02with my sister.
10:03Her name is Deanna.
10:03And I'm listening.
10:04I said, Deanna,
10:05I said, do you hear,
10:07do you hear the genius
10:08in this record?
10:08I said, you could take,
10:09you could pull out segments
10:11in this song versus
10:12that sound like
10:14their own separate bridge.
10:16It literally sounds like
10:17you bridged together
10:19several bridges
10:20and made a record.
10:21It's unbelievable.
10:23Wow.
10:23I do want to ask you first,
10:25your, your intention
10:27as far as editorial,
10:28what did you want to ensure
10:30that people walked away with?
10:31And secondly,
10:32I wanted to ask you
10:33from a musical standpoint,
10:35where in the world
10:36was your brain?
10:37Because it had to be
10:38somewhere off of this planet
10:39and out of this world.
10:41You know, I'm going to be
10:42very honest with you.
10:43I wish I,
10:44so we can get your face.
10:44There we go.
10:45Yeah.
10:46So you don't get the Kirk chest.
10:48I'm going to be,
10:49I'm going to be very honest
10:50with you.
10:51Is that my process
10:52is not that thought out.
10:54It's, it's,
10:55it's not that,
10:56it's not that methodical.
10:57I'm not that good
10:58where, where, you know,
11:00I'm, I'm thinking
11:01deeply through that.
11:03Um, I'm going to be honest
11:04with you is I have emotion.
11:06I have a feeling.
11:07There's a divine inspiration
11:09that God gives.
11:10And when that happens,
11:11I just move with that.
11:12You know, like I don't have
11:14this, this,
11:15this creative genius
11:17that some people
11:19really think I have, man.
11:19Listen, the bottom line is,
11:21man, this is God
11:22giving me these ideas
11:23that I can sit around
11:25because I remember
11:25even working on this song.
11:27I sat around hours
11:29and hours
11:30and nothing was coming
11:31from heaven.
11:32There were no melodies
11:33from heaven.
11:34There was no melodies.
11:35Nothing was popping.
11:36Nothing was popping.
11:37And I got discouraged.
11:38I got frustrated
11:39and it just was not
11:40popping for me.
11:42And, and around about
11:43five o'clock
11:44Saturday evening,
11:45the idea of the song
11:47just kind of started
11:47to just come
11:48with the little piano riff.
11:50Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun.
11:56And, you know,
11:57and then after that,
11:57later on,
11:58you know,
11:59God's kind of given me the idea
12:00of the,
12:00I know,
12:01I know,
12:01and so,
12:03you know,
12:03it just,
12:04there's,
12:04there's,
12:05there's,
12:05there's no,
12:07there's no,
12:07I'm going to sit down
12:09and create five or six bridges
12:11and I'm going to flip people
12:14on their head
12:14and I'm going to make them think,
12:17I don't know what I'm doing.
12:19I've,
12:19I've never known what I'm doing.
12:21I'm not going to even cap.
12:22There's no,
12:23even no need to try to pressure.
12:24I,
12:24I can't even cap on y'all, man.
12:26I,
12:27I never know what I'm doing.
12:29Songwriting for me
12:30is the most divine moment.
12:33If I have ever had any moments
12:34of questioning the existence of God,
12:37it all goes away with songwriting
12:39because I see God take nothing
12:42and make something.
12:44It's very ex Nilo,
12:46very ex Nilo,
12:47something out of nothing.
12:48And I've seen in my entire career
12:50from take me to the King,
12:52to why we sing,
12:54all of these songs,
12:55don't,
12:56these songs just come out of nowhere.
12:58It's come out of nowhere.
13:00You know,
13:01you know,
13:01it's not like I'm sitting with the Bible,
13:04reading all the Old Testament
13:06and then a song come.
13:08No,
13:09no,
13:10you know,
13:10it just comes.
13:12And I'm so grateful
13:13that after all these years,
13:16man,
13:16God is so kind to my little behind,
13:18man,
13:18that he would still loan me some joints.
13:20It just blows my,
13:22it blows my mind.
13:25I think because he knows
13:26he can trust you with him.
13:29I do want to ask you about Den of Kings
13:31because I'm excited about this.
13:33Yeah.
13:33Dinner conversation series
13:34you're,
13:35you're hosting
13:36and you got your first episode.
13:37So it's dropping
13:39on the 15th Father's Day.
13:42Yeah.
13:42On fatherhood,
13:43you've got DC Young,
13:44Fly, Country Wayne,
13:46Lou Young,
13:46DeVell Ellis.
13:47Yes.
13:47This,
13:48this incredible group of men
13:50coming together.
13:51Some of them have experienced
13:52deep loss.
13:53all great fathers
13:54and they share their,
13:55they share their fatherhood journeys
13:57on their social medias.
13:58We've been able to experience
14:00them being transparent
14:01on camera
14:03and on radio
14:03and yourself
14:04for many years.
14:05Yes.
14:05So my first question is
14:07why this particular group,
14:08although I understand why
14:09I know you have specific intention.
14:10And then also
14:11from a heart posture perspective,
14:13what do you hope we draw
14:14from you all
14:15when it comes to
14:16black men
14:17and black fathers?
14:18Yes.
14:19And,
14:19and every episode
14:20is going to
14:22showcase another group of men.
14:24And so that's what
14:25we're excited about.
14:26And this just came
14:27from an idea
14:28of people have always enjoyed
14:32me at dinner tables.
14:34One,
14:34one,
14:35one,
14:35one thing is that
14:36all my whole life,
14:38whenever I'm traveling
14:39and,
14:39and,
14:40you know,
14:40it's one of my favorite things
14:42is I love to get people
14:43together and eat.
14:44As little as I am,
14:45I love getting together
14:47and just going somewhere
14:48and eating
14:49and having conversations
14:50like,
14:51like,
14:51like,
14:51like,
14:51you know,
14:52and,
14:52and I think some of it
14:53stems from me
14:54not having family
14:55and being raised
14:56without family
14:56and not having,
14:58you know,
14:58siblings and dinner tables
15:00and brothers and fathers
15:01that I love to sit
15:03and to just spark
15:05controversial conversations.
15:06I love to kind of,
15:08you know,
15:08kind of light the flame
15:10and then kind of hide my hand.
15:11You know what I'm saying?
15:12You know,
15:13yeah.
15:14It's,
15:15if you let me finish
15:16this interview,
15:17I'll take care of you.
15:18Thank you,
15:19sir.
15:19Yeah.
15:20Um,
15:21I'm sitting somewhere.
15:23Look,
15:23I told you the people,
15:25they're going to get you,
15:25Kirk.
15:25You're not going to be able
15:26to hide from these people.
15:27You got the Kirk chest.
15:28You're talking out loud.
15:30Everybody knows your voice.
15:31It's over with.
15:33The Kirk chest is crazy work.
15:36It is crazy work,
15:37my guy.
15:39That Kirk chest,
15:40that is so funny.
15:41Yeah.
15:42Yeah.
15:42So,
15:43Den of Kings
15:44grew from those conversations,
15:46grew from,
15:47um,
15:48I have all of my guy friends
15:51live in Atlanta.
15:52I live in Dallas
15:52and all of my guy friends
15:54live in Atlanta now.
15:56And I flew to Atlanta
15:57to have dinner
15:58with my guy friends.
16:00And,
16:00and after that,
16:01it was like,
16:01you know what,
16:01man,
16:02this should be,
16:03this should be a thing.
16:04You should do a thing.
16:05And so,
16:06uh,
16:07with the merger
16:07that I did with Insignia,
16:09one of the,
16:10uh,
16:10moments that I wanted to curate
16:12is I wanted to curate a show
16:14that,
16:15that,
16:16that,
16:16that,
16:16that we have a chef
16:18and we have food
16:18and we have dinner
16:19and we invite men
16:21around the table
16:22to eat
16:22and talk
16:23man conversations,
16:25uh,
16:26from suicide
16:27to depression
16:28to marriage
16:29to sex
16:30to money
16:31to power
16:32to influence
16:33fatherlessness.
16:34I mean,
16:34whatever the conversation,
16:35and it's fun
16:36and it's aging
16:37and it's so well produced.
16:40Like,
16:40wait till you see this show.
16:41This show looks like
16:42it's already
16:43on a major streaming network.
16:45I mean,
16:45it is,
16:46it is beautiful
16:47and the way
16:48that the conversations flow.
16:49Wait till you see
16:50the first episode.
16:51The first episode
16:52is going to blow
16:53and I know
16:54everybody says that
16:55about things
16:55that they curate.
16:56I promise you,
16:57you would not,
16:58this would never
16:59see the light of
17:00I'm not that kind of guy.
17:02You ain't never seen it.
17:04It ain't never been
17:04talked about it.
17:05It ain't good.
17:06So,
17:07trust me,
17:07there have been songs
17:08and projects
17:09that y'all ain't never seen
17:10that we were like,
17:11I know.
17:12I know.
17:13So,
17:14wait until you see this.
17:15It is,
17:16and so,
17:16you know,
17:17as I was thinking
17:18about a name
17:18for the show,
17:19I just really,
17:20you know,
17:20got inspired
17:21to think of an idea
17:22and just a title
17:24called The Den of Kings.
17:25You know,
17:26just kings getting together
17:29and getting it in.
17:31Amazing.
17:32I cannot wait.
17:32You've always been an open book
17:35and so I'm grateful
17:36to be able to experience
17:38the kings
17:40you're going to bring
17:40into the conversation.
17:42Before I let you go,
17:43Kirk,
17:43I do want to ask you,
17:44you don't remember this,
17:45but this was,
17:45this was maybe
17:46about three years ago.
17:47I did a radio interview
17:48with you
17:48and you told me
17:50that you were starting
17:50an underwear line
17:51for short men.
17:53Where do you sit with that?
17:54What was it?
17:56Where do I sit with that?
17:57Have you started the line?
17:59What's happening?
18:00No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
18:02I'm talking about the entendre.
18:04You're starting a men's underwear line.
18:07Where do you sit with that?
18:09I didn't even mean that.
18:10It's a bar.
18:10I didn't even mean that.
18:11That was a down low that I was seeing.
18:13But it is a bar.
18:15But that is a bar.
18:16That's not my job.
18:17You're starting an underwear line
18:19for little men.
18:20Where do you sit with that?
18:24That was a download
18:27that I received.
18:28I didn't even know
18:29that was coming.
18:31And the first thing
18:32I want to say is
18:33your mama.
18:34You ain't got to be funny.
18:36You ain't got to bring that back up.
18:38That was a joke.
18:39This is what you told me.
18:40I know that you typically
18:41follow through
18:41on your ambitions.
18:42So I would just like to know
18:44as you're launching these projects
18:45where that fits in.
18:48We just got the name
18:49copywritten
18:50for the new
18:51for the new
18:52underwear line
18:53for little men.
18:54and
18:55and
18:56we're going to call it
18:57LC
18:57Can I
19:01I can't
19:04Little Cheeks
19:08I'm so glad
19:16I'm so glad
19:17things are progressing
19:18with little cheeks
19:21I think it's going to be
19:22incredible.
19:24Kurt
19:24let me tell you something
19:25it is
19:26it is
19:26an honor
19:28I don't even know
19:29what's going to come up
19:30with this interview
19:30we have talked
19:31with you
19:32you have walked down
19:34the streets of Beverly Hills
19:35you've gone back
19:36in the car
19:36gone back out of the car
19:38it's been crazy
19:39it's been crazy
19:40it's been crazy right
19:40the Beverly Wilshire
19:41people are probably
19:43asking you for selfies
19:43I don't know
19:44but I do know
19:45that you
19:46you're talking about
19:47little draws
19:48talking about
19:48little draws
19:49for little men
19:49it's been amazing
19:51that you're coming out
19:52with
19:52I have been so
19:54so edified
19:55in this conversation
19:55I appreciate you
19:56you are a
19:57you are a shining
19:58example of excellence
20:00we love you
20:01we honor you
20:01and we're so happy
20:02that the BT Awards
20:03in particular
20:04are letting the folks
20:05know what time it is
20:06I cannot wait
20:07to see you get that award
20:08you are more than deserving
20:09and if you have not
20:10told yourself good job
20:11recently sir
20:12I pray
20:13that you do that
20:14because you certainly
20:14are deserving of it
20:15thank you
20:18I don't think
20:22you told yourself
20:23a good job
20:23in a while Kirk
20:24well I'm
20:28I'm grateful
20:29whenever I hear
20:31so I appreciate
20:32well thank you
20:34go ahead to your
20:35rehearsals
20:36get through your
20:36nervousness
20:37thank you
20:37and we'll chat again
20:38soon
20:38I hope to talk soon