Well, can't blame "society" for this one. Welcome to WatchMojo, and today we’re examining why critics and audiences aren’t exactly singing “Joker: Folie à Deux” praises. We can’t dissect everything wrong without going into some spoilers. Our countdown includes Singing Off-Key, Removing the First Fil
Category
🎥
Short filmTranscript
00:00-"Let's give the people what they want."
00:02Welcome to WatchMojo, and today we're examining why critics and audiences
00:06aren't exactly singing Joker Folliette's praises.
00:09-"Hey Fleck, you got a joke for us today?"
00:11We can't dissect everything wrong without going into some spoilers.
00:15Number 10. Joker worked better as a standalone story.
00:19With most comic book adaptations setting up cinematic universes,
00:22the first Joker felt refreshingly self-contained.
00:25-"You wouldn't get it."
00:27At the same time, many were interested in seeing Joaquin Phoenix reprise his role as Arthur Fleck.
00:32WatchMojo even made a video entitled Why We Need a Joker Sequel.
00:36Careful what you wish for, huh?
00:38While we still think there was potential for a Joker follow-up,
00:41Folliette 2 does little to advance Arthur's story.
00:44He spends most of the film in cells and courtrooms,
00:47recounting what happened in the previous movie.
00:49-"Look around! Look at all these people!"
00:51Phoenix and director Todd Phillips went into Joker with a one-movie mindset.
00:55The successful outcome opened them up to doing a sequel,
00:58but Folliette 2 plays more like a 138-minute epilogue that we didn't really need.
01:03-"Let's get out of here."
01:05Number 9. The most memorable shot scene isn't in the movie.
01:09Tell us if this sounds familiar.
01:11A high-profile trailer drops, one moment goes viral,
01:14and then it isn't even in the finished product.
01:17Joker Folliette 2 is the latest movie guilty of mismarketing.
01:20Lady Gaga fans in particular were disappointed that some of her most
01:24heavily advertised scenes were omitted.
01:26Namely, the clip where Arthur and Lee storm down a flight of stairs,
01:30recreating the first film's iconic moment, is nowhere to be found.
01:34-"What's changed, Arthur?"
01:36It sounds like a nitpick, but this scene's absence highlights a larger problem.
01:40The shot epitomized the trailer's promise of Gotham's most chaotic couple
01:44raising hell together.
01:46Yet for a title that translates to madness for two,
01:49Lee feels underutilized, with moments like this left on the cutting room floor.
01:54Number 8. Removing the first film's ambiguity.
01:58Part of what made Joker such a fascinating character study
02:00is that it didn't spell everything out for us.
02:03-"That's very funny, Murray.
02:06You know, I'm also a comedian.
02:08Would you like to hear a joke?"
02:10It inspired numerous think pieces,
02:12with some wondering if the whole movie was Arthur's delusion.
02:15There's arguably still merit to that theory,
02:17but Folliette 2 seems more conclusive in what's real and what isn't.
02:21Not enough about Arthur's psyche is left open to interpretation.
02:24The fates of several characters are also revealed.
02:27Although it's interesting seeing things from Sophie's point of view,
02:30knowing that she survived makes the previous film a little less chilling.
02:34-"Can I call someone? Is your mother home?"
02:36Folliette 2 isn't completely devoid of ambiguity,
02:39with a few plot points going unresolved.
02:41Unlike the first film though,
02:43these unanswered questions won't be leaving us up at night.
02:46-"That's what we should be talking about!"
02:49We were confused yet intrigued when it was announced
02:52that this sequel would be a musical.
02:54We were even more confused when Gaga said,
02:56quote,
02:56"...I wouldn't necessarily say that this is actually a musical."
03:00Herein lies the issue.
03:02For Folliette 2 to work,
03:03it needed to go all in on the musical angle.
03:06Think Chicago or La La Land,
03:08which embraced fantasy while staying grounded in reality.
03:12The fantasy element is largely missing here,
03:14restricting most numbers to gritty locales
03:16with limited spacing that aren't visually interesting.
03:19Occasionally, there's a colorful set piece
03:21like the Hotel Arkham rooftop dance,
03:23but not enough time spent in Arthur's dream days.
03:26Musicals have the power to transport characters,
03:29yet Arthur rarely leaves the confines of his prison.
03:31Consequently, there's a lack of depth to the story.
03:34In Folliette 2,
03:35we're given the chance to explore the world of Arthur
03:38yet Arthur rarely leaves the confines of his prison.
03:50With Arthur Fleck standing out from past versions of the Joker,
03:53we were curious what other prominent Gotham residents
03:55might be like in this universe.
03:57Folliette 2 introduces a couple of recognizable names
04:00only to do nothing with them.
04:04Harvey Dent leads the prosecution,
04:06but the character receives no development.
04:08The most we get is a hint
04:10that he'll become Two-Face following an explosion.
04:17Even then, the damage doesn't look bad enough
04:19to constitute a villain origin story.
04:21While Gaga is given more material as Harleen Lee Quinzel,
04:25she also gets sidelined.
04:26Turning Lee into an obsessed fan
04:28who idolizes the Joker had promise.
04:31Since we rarely see things from Lee's perspective though,
04:34she never becomes much more than the object of Arthur's affection.
04:46Delivering his closing argument,
04:48Arthur claims the Joker was never real,
04:51in turn alienating his followers.
04:53We also started to lose interest in Arthur around this point.
04:56This is primarily because Arthur's sudden turn doesn't feel earned.
05:00Ricky's death in the previous scene prompted this decision,
05:03but the film didn't spend much time developing his friendship with Arthur.
05:06When Ricky dies,
05:07it doesn't leave much of an impression on the audience,
05:10and we don't believe it would profoundly influence Arthur either.
05:13It might have made more sense
05:14if Arthur's turning point was his revelation
05:16that Lee is in love with Joker,
05:18not the man behind the makeup.
05:19This would put Arthur at odds with his alter ego,
05:22making his ultimate choice in court more impactful.
05:25You can do anything you want.
05:28The sun comes...
05:30You're Joker.
05:35Arthur Fleck represents what happens to a person
05:37when society pushes them too far
05:39and their mental health goes unchecked.
05:41At least that was the intent.
05:43Some audiences walked away from Joker idolizing Arthur,
05:46dressing up as him at protests.
05:55Commenting on the audience's response to the first film
05:58is a compelling idea,
05:59but folie a deux doesn't add much to the conversation.
06:02Part of that is because we don't get to know
06:04Arthur's supporters other than Lee.
06:06Rather than analyze why people relate it to Arthur,
06:09Todd Phillips seems more interested in shaming fans
06:11who view Joker as a symbol.
06:13They believe Arthur Fleck to be some kind of martyr.
06:18Well, he's not.
06:20If this sequel isn't for the first film's admirers
06:23and isn't likely to win over newcomers,
06:25who is it for?
06:26Todd Phillips, we guess.
06:34We could forgive the dull settings and lack of choreography
06:37if the musical numbers delivered in the vocal department.
06:40Since Joaquin Phoenix previously played Johnny Cash
06:43and Lady Gaga is, well, Lady Gaga,
06:45this is one area where the film should spring to life.
06:48Phillips went out of his way to make actors sing off-key, however.
06:53This is not who Arthur is.
06:56It might be who Joker wants to be.
06:58The film aims for a, quote,
07:00rar, more unstable sound.
07:02This might be faithful to the characters,
07:04but there's only so much bad karaoke
07:06the audience can endure.
07:07It would have said more about Arthur's mental state
07:10if he sounded phenomenal in his head.
07:12Even in his wildest fantasies, though,
07:14he makes Gerard Butler sound like Michael Crawford.
07:20If characters are gonna burst into song,
07:23fully commit to being a musical.
07:28Phoenix is unlikely to return for a third film,
07:31as Folie a Deux ends with another inmate stabbing Arthur,
07:34presumably to death.
07:36As Arthur puts on a happy face,
07:38the inmate gives himself a pair of scars,
07:40suggesting he'll take up the Joker mantle.
07:45On the one hand,
07:45this cleverly conveys how Arthur created something beyond his control,
07:49with madness transmitting to another person.
07:52At the same time,
07:53this ending left us feeling nothing.
07:55Maybe that was the intent,
07:56but the ending plays like the Mandarin twist
07:58in Iron Man 3 on a grander scale.
08:00I never thought people had been hurt.
08:03They lied to me.
08:04This is the Mandarin?
08:05No, no, it's, it's, it's embarrassing.
08:08We don't care about this new Joker.
08:10We spent two movies getting invested in Arthur Fleck,
08:13and this ending seems anticlimactically hostile
08:15towards anyone who saw something in the character.
08:17How about you, Arthur?
08:20Do you still think you're a star?
08:22Before we continue,
08:23be sure to subscribe to our channel
08:25and ring the bell to get notified about our latest videos.
08:28You have the option to be notified for occasional videos or all of them.
08:31If you're on your phone,
08:33make sure you go into your settings and switch on notifications.
08:41Say what you will about the Joker movies,
08:43but nobody can deny they took big swings.
08:46The first film's risks paid off,
08:48resulting in the studio granting Phillips unchecked creative control with the sequel.
08:52When you bring me out, can you introduce me as Joker?
08:56Although this backfired,
08:57we appreciate that Warner Brothers and DC took a chance.
09:00It'll probably be their last for a while.
09:03With Folie a Deux being a disappointment,
09:05the studios are inclined to lean on what's worked in the past,
09:08guaranteeing more input from executives and superfan focus groups.
09:12I'll tell you what's changed.
09:14We aren't alone anymore.
09:15Even if Folie a Deux didn't entirely work,
09:18we want to see movies experiment and push boundaries.
09:21For the foreseeable future,
09:23we can expect Hollywood to play it safe with movies that seek to please everyone,
09:27yet don't leave a lasting legacy.
09:29Well, guess what?
09:30That's life!
09:32Do you think Joker Folie a Deux is actually an unsung misunderstood masterpiece?
09:36Or are you in the hate-it camp?
09:38Let us know in the comments.
09:42Did you enjoy this video?
09:44Check out these other clips from WatchMojo.
09:46And be sure to subscribe and ring the bell to be notified about our latest videos.