Skip to player
Skip to main content
Skip to footer
Search
Connect
Watch fullscreen
Like
Comments
Bookmark
Share
Add to Playlist
Report
Russian Rights Defender On Trial
FRANCE 24 English
Follow
6/8/2023
Visit our website:
http://www.france24.com
Like us on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/FRANCE24.English
Follow us on Twitter:
https://twitter.com/France24_en
Category
🗞
News
Transcript
Display full video transcript
00:00
part of a team of former speechwriters for Russian President Vladimir Putin up until
00:07
2014, I believe. Thank you for being with us here on France 24.
00:11
Hello.
00:13
First of all, your reaction to that appearance by Oleg Orlov, the co-chair of Memorial
00:21
in a Russian court, and those cheers from his supporters this Thursday.
00:29
Well, people are still struggling. It's great. Definitely. I'm happy to hear this.
00:36
It's no longer news that repressions are heavy in Russia. In fact, it's no longer a metaphor to tell
00:48
that Russia is becoming a totalitarian society. No, it's actually now making this transformation
00:55
from a regular authoritarian state, which it used to be before the war started, into a
01:02
totalitarian society with elements of totalitarianism. It's not like 100 percent
01:09
Stalin type, but it's certainly movement in this direction. Now we can tell that the repressions
01:16
in Russia are done on the scale which we have not seen at least since 1953, the moment of Stalin's
01:26
death. Everything which was after Stalin under other communist leaders was lower and weaker
01:33
than what Putin is doing.
01:36
When was the tipping point?
01:41
Well, you know, it was a growing escalation since probably
01:45
2018, I would say, when the...
01:53
When Putin was reelected?
01:55
He was reelected and two months after his re-election, actually his ratings started
02:04
visibly falling down. It was his last time when he was really popular. And so the protest sentiment,
02:12
the protest mood started growing in the country, and Kremlin started becoming more and more
02:17
oppressive and started using this force and law enforcement more and more often instead of
02:28
propaganda. So actually, previously, the political tools were the main ones, while force was, you
02:38
know, just sometimes being switched on. But now it's vice versa. Propaganda is just, you know,
02:46
a kind of steam which is covering the battlefield. But actually, almost 100 percent of Russian
02:52
politics is done through law enforcement bodies like FSB, former KGB and others.
02:59
So let me ask you about this, Abbas Galanov, because there's a lot of pop psychology going on,
03:05
people guessing as to whether or not Vladimir Putin is crazy or whether or not he's a psychopath,
03:13
as his critics might argue. As somebody who frequented him for over years, was he somebody
03:21
who was sound of mind when he was running meetings or reviewing speeches?
03:26
He was absolutely sober back in those times. He was one of the, like, probably the most
03:35
rational person I've ever seen. I saw him many times, maybe hundreds of times, and
03:43
all the time he was absolutely, he could control himself well. He was extremely rational. He was,
03:48
you know, like a very non-emotional manager, this good managerial type. So back at those times,
03:56
you could never imagine that he would be doing those things which he is doing now. Actually,
04:01
he changed a lot. So you talked about 2018 as perhaps a tipping point. Was it that he went
04:10
off the rails or that he realized he needed a rally round the flag moment to keep Powell to power?
04:17
It's when he started growing. Well, that's the point when he started shifting the balance from
04:27
propaganda and campaigning, all these political tools towards this force, like putting,
04:36
like, previously critics could afford being critical, and Russian propaganda was trying to
04:42
outperform them, was arguing with them. After 2018, he started using more and more, like,
04:49
just putting people to prison, for example, ousting them out of the country, refusing to register
04:56
opposition politicians for elections, and so on and so on. So he started using this,
05:03
what we call in Russia, administrative resource. It's the official power of the state
05:09
to fulfill his political goals. So this change that you're describing, Abbas,
05:18
this predates COVID, because the standard narrative is that during COVID, Vladimir Putin
05:27
became more isolated, didn't listen to as many advisors, and that may have weighed on his
05:32
decision making in the run up to what he deems a special military operation in Ukraine.
05:37
It's everything is all right. Everything is right. But I'm trying to tell that it's not that before
05:44
COVID it was like one thing, and then after COVID, thanks to COVID, it changed. No,
05:49
COVID just added to what was happening already before. And COVID was actually the main problem
05:56
with COVID was that Putin failed to perform as efficiently as people expected him to perform,
06:03
and his ratings went down at that moment. And even more, like, they started falling down in 2018,
06:09
in 2020, 2021. This popular discontent was growing. So when we had presidential election,
06:17
sorry, Duma, it's our parliament elections, the last national elections in the country before the
06:23
war started, half a year before the war started, over three months of campaign, his approval rating
06:31
fell down, if I'm not mistaken, seven percentage points within three months. You understand,
06:38
it's the time of campaign when people should rally around him. So at that moment, probably he
06:43
understood that he can no longer rally people around him with the domestic agenda. It was no
06:49
longer working. He needed foreign policy. And it was the only issue where he could still garner
06:56
some kind of support, get back some of his supporters whom he was losing. That's why he
07:01
needed escalation with some foreign policy agenda. He needed escalation. Just a quick question,
07:08
because we're running short on time. You recently granted an interview to Radio Free Europe, where
07:13
you said that today his former president, his former prime minister, who briefly replaced him
07:22
as president, Dmitry Medvedev, seems completely discredited in the West with his bombastic
07:26
statements. You're saying he might be grooming him? Well, you mean as a successor? I can't rule
07:36
this out, but a few things indicate this now. Like half a year ago, he elevated Medvedev greatly. Half
07:43
a year ago, he really seemed to be on the rise again. At that moment, nobody could rule out
07:52
him coming back. But two months after this, in the middle of the spring, the process stopped,
07:59
and now Medvedev is no longer dealing with any serious issue, and Putin discarded him completely.
08:05
He's just writing his tweets on Twitter and nothing else. So you should understand,
08:10
Putin is becoming very erratic. He's turning quickly from one decision to the other. He's
08:14
canceling his previous decision and coming back to those old canceled ones and restarting them. So
08:20
it's always shifting. He's desperately looking for something, for some solution. He cannot find it.
08:27
Now he's absolutely unpredictable. So maybe in the future he'll bring back Medvedev,
08:35
and we will see this. But right now, at this particular moment, nothing indicates that it
08:40
can happen. Very briefly, one final question about Abbas Galimov. The palace intrigue that's playing
08:48
out in public with his defense minister, the head of the Wagner Group, is that just theater,
08:56
or is there really a problem? No, it's a serious problem. It's really the first...
09:03
You might... It's not a big exaggeration to tell that we're witnessing the first
09:07
stage of the new beginning Russian revolution, just like it was in 1917. The united front of
09:15
the elites around Putin there, it's collapsing, and it's actually the collapse of the institutions,
09:22
because keeping united front at war, this is the desperately needed thing. Even democracies cannot
09:28
afford democracy at war. And this is what is exactly happening in a non-democratic country.
09:36
So this is a real collapse of the system. Abbas Galimov, many thanks for speaking with us from
09:42
Tel Aviv. Thank you.
Recommended
1:14
|
Up next
METEO TEST EN
FRANCE 24 English
4/1/2025
0:32
Russia Lunar Mission
FRANCE 24 English
8/11/2023
12:39
Perspective
FRANCE 24 English
2/10/2025
7:28
Entre Nous
FRANCE 24 English
4/8/2025
3:21
Vaez 2
FRANCE 24 English
9/28/2024
6:55
Entre Nous US Ballot
FRANCE 24 English
10/23/2024
1:32
Russian-born Telegram founder Durov arrested in France
FRANCE 24 English
8/26/2024
1:44
Russian court sentences Navalny lawyers to years behind bars
FRANCE 24 English
1/18/2025
5:33
Russian-born Telegram founder ordered to French court to face possible charges
FRANCE 24 English
8/28/2024
1:26
Russia holds Frenchman accused of gathering military information
FRANCE 24 English
6/7/2024
1:00
French researcher's trial in Moscow court set to start
FRANCE 24 English
9/3/2024
9:25
ENTRE NOUS ADELE
FRANCE 24 English
10/17/2024
6:29
French Connections
FRANCE 24 English
12/21/2023
7:18
BUSINESS DAILY 07032024
FRANCE 24 English
3/7/2024
5:36
Entre Nous 12122024-1
FRANCE 24 English
12/12/2024
1:45
US accuses Russia's RT news outlet of election interference
FRANCE 24 English
9/5/2024
7:04
Russia likely to seek lifting of US sanctions, expert says
FRANCE 24 English
2/18/2025
1:00
Uganda detains opposition lawmakers, trial postponed for second time
FRANCE 24 English
8/27/2024
42:36
DEBATE 11022025
FRANCE 24 English
2/11/2025
2:07
V2 Syria
FRANCE 24 English
9/1/2024
1:26
Georgia: Russian exiles inspired by protests but scared
FRANCE 24 English
5/20/2024
1:29
Telegram's Durov announces new crackdown on illegal content
FRANCE 24 English
9/24/2024
11:23
People & Profit 05122024
FRANCE 24 English
12/6/2024
1:37
Police search European Parliament employee's home, offices over possible Russian interference
FRANCE 24 English
5/30/2024
2:51
Zimbabwe
FRANCE 24 English
1/30/2018