- 2 days ago
In this exclusive edition of World Today, former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert states that a large part of the Israeli population now believes the war in Gaza must end. He asserts that Israel has achieved all it can through military operations and continuing the war risks the lives of Israeli soldiers and hostages.
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00:00you're watching world today and this is a major exclusive I'm being joined by
00:16the former Prime Minister of Israel Prime Minister Ehud Olmod who served
00:22between 2006 and 2009 a very critical period now in Israel mr. Olmod thank you
00:29so much for joining us it seems like you're a minority voice would you agree
00:34when it comes to Netanyahu's actions in Gaza what's the standpoint house Israel
00:40looking at it how are you looking at it and Israelis well I'm afraid that my
00:49voice is not a minority anymore it may have been a minority a while ago but over
00:56last few weeks a large part of the Israeli population has made it clear that the
01:05war has to stop this is what I think we have achieved everything that can be
01:11achieved in the military operation at this point now continuing the war and
01:17expanding the war may cause the death of Israeli soldiers as it does already you
01:24will also risk the lives of the hostages which are still kept by Hamas and it
01:30will kill innocent non-involved Palestinians living in Gaza without any
01:37objective which is worth this cost there is so much that we did already in the war
01:43in the last 22 months we eliminated most of the important leaders of Hamas including
01:51if you sinwar in the muhammad def and the chairman of Hamas israel ania in the high
02:00command and lower commands we destroyed most of the tunnels most of the launchers of
02:07rockets most of the rockets uh command positions uh almost everything at this point now after 22
02:16months my voice is not uh isolated it reflects a growing majority of Israelis that think that we have
02:26to stop the war now and release all the hostages and make an agreement that will end the war and allow
02:33Israel to pull out from Gaza and an interim security force made of Palestinians and Arab soldiers will
02:42take over Gaza in order to make sure that Hamas will not return again into a position of influence and
02:51power in Gaza right mr. Olmuth you are you are talking about how you are not a minority voice but then the intent of
02:59Prime Minister Netanyahu doesn't seem like it was just to eliminate uh the Hamas it does seem like there's a plan for Gaza look at the
03:09the announcement of a humanitarian city in Rafa that will have to house two million Gazans look at the announcement that he made where he's showing an entire plan of Gazans can leave if they wish to uh with with the uh with Donald Trump and then President Trump's own idea of a Riviera what do you have to say about that
03:29well is this not ethnic cleansing well as I said before I think I represent the majority of the public opinion
03:38but it's true that the Prime Minister is Netanyahu and presently he still enjoys majority in Parliament perhaps not uh too long because uh just now I heard that his political partners in the uh uh
03:53uh cabinet uh decided to uh withdraw and uh therefore he's going to lose even the majority in Parliament but he is still the Prime Minister and it's true that uh the uh Prime Minister and the Minister of Defense say that they uh intend to build a humanitarian city this is totally unacceptable this humanitarian city uh is by definition uh uh a crime
04:23uh which can't uh which can't uh we Israel will not be able to uh accept the responsibility for such a crime and uh I think that even the Israeli army and the chief of staff are reluctant to uh do it because they think that it has no practical uh dimension uh into it uh but it's true that there are cabinet ministers and uh we all know
04:51Harvard people would have umwanza here but even most prosecutions and uh I think that there are Burns saying that there are several reasons later uh what's of today
04:54um by the time Hindus in Israel during the course of the world
04:56so if you have a country please talk to anybody else to
05:16but it's true that for the time being this announcement of the Minister of
05:23Defense and Prime Minister in favor of such a humanitarian city is something
05:30that is on the agenda and I hope as I say that it will not take place.
05:36How would you describe it? In one of the interviews you actually called it a
05:40concentration camp. Well I said it might unfortunately be interpreted as such
05:49particularly I think interpreted as an ethnic cleansing because if you report
05:55hundreds of thousands of people and you force them into a small corner
06:01completely segregated without freedom of movement with a fence
06:08surrounding this area then it can be interpreted as an ethnic cleansing and
06:16this is not something that can be tolerated and as I said again I think
06:21it's illegal and it may constitute a crime against humanity so I don't think that
06:28it will take place and I hope that the international community will express its
06:32opposition to this idea but I can't ignore the fact that there are ministers in the
06:38Israeli cabinet that favors it because they they are aiming at clearing part of
06:48at least part of Gaza in order to be able to resettle them.
06:51Well sir the international community has done precious little when it comes to the
06:56situation today in Gaza look at the humanitarian aid people in Gaza are
07:01actually dying of starvation that there's malnutrition that children are
07:05being killed and it is all being normalized look the situation is very
07:12complex there okay with the humanitarian aid as well and we have to recognize the
07:22fact that the Hamas fighters are trying to capture the many of the humanitarian
07:31supplies because they need it for their own their own squadrons and soldiers and
07:41and they try to separate the citizens from from the areas where these humanitarian aid
07:52is provided in order to take control but by and large this is something that is incumbent
08:00about Israel to do so it's not so simple people are not starving and dying but there is a danger
08:08there is a danger and we have to be aware of it and what I think and I say is that in as long as
08:17Israel is in Gaza in as long as Israel is in the military control of Gaza it is incumbent upon us to
08:24make sure that the humanitarian supplies will be provided to the people that live there in order to avoid
08:32unnecessary consequences such as starvation but even if we agree and I accept the argument that the Hamas is
08:42taking control of humanitarian aid for their forces but precious little is going in the fact
08:49that there is food outside of the gates but not being allowed to enter in itself is a travesty sir
08:54again food is allowed in perhaps not sufficient not sufficient at all no no well you know we are here I'm in Tel Aviv here in India and the realities in Gaza are a lot more complex and sensitive and volatile and fragile and the supply is not simple and they need to break the
09:24through the barriers and the fences and the shooting and the Hamas provocations
09:32is not so simple. I think that there is an attempt, a serious attempt made by
09:39Israel to provide this. But as I said again, in the final analysis it is the
09:44responsibility of the Israeli army and the Israeli government to make sure that
09:49the people there will get the humanitarian supplies that they need in
09:54order to survive. As simple as that. Right. Coming back to the Netanyahu government
10:01and what he's doing on the ground, is this personal ambition flubbed with what
10:06they're calling geopolitics and the need to secure Israel, but is this
10:10Netanyahu's political ambitions that we are seeing over here as also
10:15him trying to save himself and stay in power? Is that one of the
10:20elements of the actions that you see? What is his ambition? Only he can say. I
10:27can say what is understood by what we see, by what he does. You know this is open for
10:35objective interpretation and it's obvious that Netanyahu and he's accused by the way
10:41by a lot of people in Israel that what he is doing is the only possible way to explain it is that he is
10:51prepared to sacrifice what are considered to be the real national security interest of the state of Israel for his political
11:00responsibility. Right. There was a time when you were Prime Minister Sir and during the
11:07Lebanon or war with Hezbollah to be precise, a lot of them questioned you and
11:13spoke about intelligence failure. How would you describe October 7th attacks? Was that
11:19also intelligence failure under Netanyahu's leadership? In the Second
11:24Levanties war there was no intelligence failure. There was a total undoubted
11:31victory for Israel that lasted 33 days. You know we are talking about the war which
11:36is lasting almost two years now. That's true. In 33 years we have devastated the
11:43Hezbollah counterattacking after they have started attacking Israel. And since then for 17 years from
11:552006 to 2023 there was not one bullet shot from Lebanon to Israel. So then there was not a failure of
12:04intelligence. Unfortunately in October of 23 the failure was not of intelligence. The failure was of
12:13arrogance of complacency and of overconfidence. We had all the information. The failure is greater because we had all the
12:24information. We had all the intelligence. We had all the cyber products which we needed in order to understand what they
12:31want to do. We just were arrogant enough and complacent enough not to believe that they can do what they were
12:39preparing doing. And therefore the Israeli army was not on the alert. The Israeli army was not stationed in the command
12:47position along the border at a time when they were attacking us. They just broke through the fence and
12:53walked through into the Israeli settlements not because of the failure of intelligence but because of the failure of the security
13:01the security services and the army and the government to understand that Hamas is there and that they want to fight and that
13:09we have to get ready in order to face them. We didn't. We didn't. We just failed.
13:15Would you see the government and how the government has reacted or acted with West Bank and Gaza even before October 7th?
13:29And I'm not saying we're not condoning what happened. It's a terrorist attack and nobody should be condoning it.
13:35But is the far right wing government of Netanyahu, Ben Gavir, what happened at the Temple Mount, all of that.
13:45Does anybody look at and analyze those incidents that took place even before Sheikh Jarrah even before October 7th?
13:54Is there an analysis and understanding in Israel that this government did far too much for far too long?
14:01Well, sure. I mean, as I said, there is a growing discontent in all the polls which are run now in Israel almost on a daily basis,
14:11certainly on a weekly basis. For the last two years, there wasn't one time that the present coalition parties
14:21had altogether even 50 seats out of 120, which means that the public opinion is shifting,
14:31recognizing the failure of this government.
14:35Now, we talked about the failure of arrogance and the failure of complacency and the overconfidence and so on.
14:43I want to add one thing, which I think is very significant, one they mentioned.
14:48Throughout this period, from the 7th, okay, the war started, as you say it correctly,
14:54we had to counterattack the Hamas and the whole international community,
14:59recognized the need to counterattack the Hamas leaders and to reach out for the fighters
15:06and to destroy this terrorist organization. But at no time throughout these two years,
15:12the government of Israel proposed a political horizon for Gaza
15:18after the end of the violence and the hostility of the military operations.
15:23And what we were asking our government, as so many did from the outside was,
15:29okay, let's, we understand, we have to fight Hamas, we will have to destroy Hamas.
15:34And then what? After we destroy Hamas, what is your plan? What is your end game?
15:40Okay, there will not be one Hamas alive, but there will still be 2.2 million people living there.
15:46What do we want to do with them? Do we want to occupy them forever?
15:50Do we want to squeeze them forever? Do we want to have a military control over Gaza
15:57and daily, almost daily confrontations between us and them forever?
16:04Or do we have any political premise government of Netanyahu, which is the greatest failure?
16:11Because so many in the international community recognize the right of Israel to counterattack.
16:19And they said, okay, go ahead. Joe Biden said it. Rishi Sunak, the former Prime Minister of Great Britain,
16:26said it. President Macron said it. The former Chancellor of Germany, Schultz, said it.
16:31Prime Minister Melanie said it. The new Prime Minister or Chancellor of Germany, Mertz, said it.
16:37They all said it. Okay, go ahead. Kill them, destroy them. But then what? What is your plan?
16:44The failure of the Israeli government to provide any plan for the next day, for the day after, is the greatest failure.
16:53Because it has somehow diluted the essence of the Israeli military achievement.
17:02And it has created an atmosphere of discontent and of impatience towards the state of Israel across the world.
17:10And this is very damaging.
17:12Mr. Olmert, such a sane voice. Why isn't anybody listening to you?
17:17No. There are many that listen to me, but not this government.
17:22And so we are trying to overthrow this government.
17:24So in order to have another government of much greater responsibility and political vision,
17:30because the time has come for us to make peace with the Palestinians.
17:38Now, one thing has to be emphasized, okay, before we say goodbye.
17:45In 2008 and 2009, the ISY minister proposed to Palestinians.
17:51And the then Palestinian president, who still is Palestinian president, Dr. Mahmoud Abbas,
17:57planned for a comprehensive peace between Israel and Palestine on the basis of two states,
18:04on the basis of the 67 borders, on the basis of dividing the city of Jerusalem
18:10so that the east side of Jerusalem will be the capital of the Palestinian state
18:15and that the other parts of Jerusalem will remain, of course, the Israeli capital.
18:20All these we proposed to them.
18:22This was really the realization of all the greatest dreams of the Palestinians.
18:27And what happened?
18:28They failed to sign.
18:30They didn't have the leadership and the courage and the vision and the inspiration to sign.
18:36So I still think that this is our interest and we have to do everything in order to achieve peace.
18:42But we can't just put all the blame on one side without recognizing the failure of the Palestinians
18:49when the opportunity arose to sign peace which may have changed entirely the region
18:56and the lives of millions of people at that time.
18:59Before I let you go, just a couple of questions.
19:01One, there's immense international pressure.
19:04Should you or should the opposition overthrow the Netanyahu government?
19:09Yet there will be a lot of damage control and image building that you'd have to do.
19:14Has Israel lost its image?
19:17Because many are looking at what's happening in Gaza as genocide.
19:22Well, no, there is no genocide.
19:24Don't stretch it beyond the reasonable limits.
19:28There is no genocide.
19:30There are many bad things that happened there.
19:33Now, it's true.
19:34We have to get rid of this government.
19:36But we are a democracy.
19:37And we are not going to get rid of this government in any other way but in a democratic manner.
19:43There will be elections.
19:45Now that the government lost its majority in parliament, I believe that after the Knesset recess,
19:51at the end of October, a date will be set for elections.
19:54Sometimes at the beginning of 2026, perhaps in March 2026.
20:00And I hope that in those elections, a new government will take over
20:04and will change the direction, the policies and the strategy of Israel.
20:10But do you see any future government looking at image building again?
20:15Has Israel lost its image?
20:19Certainly, the image of Israel has been damaged dramatically.
20:23Yet, I hope so.
20:26I can't guarantee you because I am not in the government and I am not presently running any particular party.
20:33But I will do everything in my power to the extent that my voice is heard in Israel.
20:38And I think it's heard.
20:40I will make sure that the new government will adopt the strategy that I propose
20:48towards comprehensive peace settlement between us and the Palestinians on the basis of two states.
20:55Do you see a future where there can be normalcy, normalizing of ties and relations between Israel and the Arab world?
21:03Because I think that also has taken a hit.
21:06Will Abram Accord really work?
21:09And will the areas that now are strife torn see investments?
21:15The chances for such ventrality are so great and are so promising.
21:22One has to be completely insane not to recognize it and to work towards achieving it.
21:28We know that once we will start negotiations with the Palestinian Authority on a two-state solution,
21:34the Saudis will join in the Arab Accords.
21:39And subsequently there will be many Muslim countries that will do it, including, I believe, Indonesia,
21:45which is the biggest Muslim country in the world, 300 million people, and many North African countries.
21:51So this is the vision. This is the strategy. This is the dream. This is my dream.
21:59This is, I believe, a dream of many millions in Israel that will do everything in our power.
22:05And it's very important for me that people in India will know that the voice of Israel, the voice of reason, the voice of compromise, the voice of peace, is the voice that I represent.
22:19And I believe that, as I said before, I represent the majority of the Israelis.
22:24Right. And my final question to you before I let you go. There has been massive attack on Syria by Israel.
22:30How important is the Druze community for Israel and the reason why you're taking on an administration that now seems to be pro-Israel rather than anti-Israel?
22:41Well, I'd love Israel to come to some accommodation with the new Syrian government and the new Syrian regime by Ashara and Julani.
22:55But it can't be at the expense of the Druze community in Syria.
23:01We can't see an attempt to annihilate a minority in Syria and just sit still and do nothing.
23:10It's not even a political interest. It's a moral obligation that we have. We can't afford to do it.
23:16And let's not forget, I hope that we can make some accommodation and create a rapport between us and the Syrians.
23:24But the leader of Syria has been, until very recently, ISIS.
23:29And we can't afford to have ISIS in control of Syria. So they have to understand that if they want to be safe and secure in the new regime, they have to make the necessary accommodations and treat the minorities in Syria in a proper manner.
23:47Otherwise, we will not be able to sit still. We'll do everything that we can do in order to prevent any massacres in the Druze community.
23:56I hope not just the people in Israel, but the region and the world listen to what you have to say, Mr. Olmod, because these are really wise words.
24:03Thank you so much for joining us.
24:06That was an exclusive conversation with the former Prime Minister of Israel.
24:11With that, it's a wrap on this edition of World Today.
24:14Goodbye and take care.
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