The big focus of this episode of Democratic Newsroom is the tragic stampede outside M Chinnaswamy Stadium in Bengaluru on Wednesday during Royal Challengers Bengaluru (RCB) team's victory parade after their maiden Indian Premier League (IPL) title win.
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00:00Good evening, you're watching the Democratic Newsroom, yet another edition, and we come
00:19to you for a very somber debate, because yesterday what was supposed to be massive celebrations
00:25for the RCB, Royal Challengers, Bengaluru, winning their first IPL trophy in 18 years, turned
00:32into a massive tragedy, with a stampede at the Chinnaswami Stadium, killing 11. The mean
00:38age of the 11, 23 viewers. Just let that sink in. Who is to blame? Where and who, at who,
00:45does the buck stop? That's what we're going to be discussing over the course of the next
00:4930 minutes. Allow me to cut across to our editors this evening. Joining me, Nikhil Naz, who
00:55was in Bengaluru at the Chinnaswami Stadium. He was actually there when the stampede took
01:00place. We'll also have from Bengaluru, Naga, my colleague, he'll be joining us with the
01:07very latest. We also have Akshita, Gaurav, Suesha, Anjali, and our consulting editor, Rajdeep
01:15Sardisai, Sahil Joshi, also will be joining us from Mumbai. But Rajdeep, first up, where
01:21does the buck stop? Who takes the blame for what happened yesterday?
01:24Before that, let me just say that it's terrible what happened, tragic, and hearts and thoughts
01:29and prayers with the families who've lost their near and dear ones. This is not a time
01:33for a usual angry debate that you have on Democratic Newsroom. The buck stops with the
01:38state administration and the state government. Law and order is a state subject. It is entirely
01:43their responsibility to ensure that the citizens are protected. So I think the buck stops with
01:48the Siddharamaya government in Karnataka and the local administration that includes the
01:52local police. I would also say in this particular instance, RCB and KSCA cannot escape some level
01:59of culpability. All of them were in a hurry to celebrate arguably a fantastic achievement
02:06by RCB, but they could have waited, pressed the pause button. What was the hurry? You win
02:10at midnight on Tuesday and by Wednesday, you're rushing to celebrate. I mean, that does, you
02:17give the police no time really to prepare. So I think all these three entities, but particularly
02:22the state government is where the buck stops. They cannot pass the buck anymore. India will
02:26win an Olympic medal one day in a sport called passing the buck.
02:30Well, you're right there. All right. I want to go, you know, first up to Nikhil Naz and I'll
02:34bring in my colleague Naga, who's also joining us from Bengaluru. But Nikhil, first up, you were
02:39right there where the tragedy occurred. I remember yesterday when you were speaking
02:43to us, you recounted the tragedy of a 15 year old child, that little girl who lost her
02:48life. But take us through in the aftermath of it all. What did you observe? Who should
02:54take responsibility? Because accountability must be fixed.
02:57A couple of things, Preeti. As Rajdeep said, I think the buck stops with the state administration.
03:02I hear many people saying that should RCB have even been celebrating? I think that's the basic
03:08ride of a franchise that's won a title after 18 years to celebrate it. People are saying
03:13that why did so many fans turn up? They're fans for a reason. They are the number one
03:16stakeholders. They needed to be there. And if you cannot provide security to the fans
03:21to celebrate or even to the franchise, something that Rajdeep said that they could have waited.
03:26Why should anyone be asked to wait? I mean, you've got European football clubs that win
03:31on the night. Next day in London, the streets are jam-packed and people are celebrating
03:35immediately after they won it. I think as a country, we keep talking about, you know,
03:39such and such trillion economy and all of that. We need to get our basic structures
03:43in place. There was no protocol. There was no intelligence. The fans have the right
03:47to celebrate. The franchise has the right to celebrate. You just need to get the system
03:52in place. And unfortunately, that is something...
03:56When Liverpool wins the EPL, there is planning. It's not some... You know, the problem is
04:02everyone wanted to do it the very next day. It befuddles me. If the police said, do it
04:06on a Sunday, who said no, do it the next day?
04:08We can make your point. Then I'd like to bring in Rajdeep.
04:10All right, Rajdeep, I'm going to bring in the others.
04:12Rajdeep, the buck stops with the police. Were the cops there or not? They were. So, if they
04:15didn't want it to happen, no parade or no event would have happened. They reached there.
04:20Whether reluctantly, whether pressurized, whether, you know, their arms were twisted. At the
04:25end of the day, the buck stops with them.
04:26Agreed.
04:27Sam Manakshar was asked, can you go to war at that time? He said, no, he can't.
04:31When I'm prepared, I will. The buck stops with the cops. You allowed that to happen.
04:34Now, it's a classical case of finger pointing. And I'll tell you, when it comes to the cops,
04:38I saw that because Preeti is asking what was happening. I was at gate 13, which is the
04:43VIP gate. There were 200 policemen there. And all they did was, the tragedy happened 50
04:48meter near gate 19. So, who is supposed to look after the streets? It's not just about
04:54the stadium. They were happy clearing the way for any VIP car to come in. 200 cops just
04:59doing that, 50 meter away. Nobody really cares what's happening. Crowds are there. And you
05:04have the stampede where I was. Nobody bothered about that. All they cared for, people getting
05:08the stampede.
05:08You know, that's the resonating there. You take the state from Karnataka, change it
05:12to Uttar Pradesh. At the Kumbh, the VIP entrance, exactly the same stories that were reported
05:17by our reporters on ground. I want to bring in Naga Arjun Dwarakannath, who's joining us
05:21from Bengaluru. We're going to teleport him here. Naga, you were very excited, Naga Arjun,
05:26yesterday. You know, Bangalore winning after 18 years and then the tragedy strikes. You've
05:34been reporting over the course of the last 18 to 20 hours. What is it that you have picked
05:38up? Because who takes responsibility for this Naga? Is it the RCB? Is it the state, you
05:44know, the government? Who takes responsibility?
05:47Well, that large blame has to go to the Cricket Association. Nikhil was talking about fans have
05:55all the rights to celebrate. Yes. But the fans have to be disciplined also. They were so
05:59large in number that half of them were drunk, half of them were pushing the buses, barricades.
06:04Is that the way to behave? It was just a mob there. It was not even a fan anymore. After
06:08a while, after 5pm, it was just direct mob. When you have to enter the stadium, there's a way
06:13to enter. Everyone's just rushing into the barricades, rushing into the gates. How much
06:17can the police also do? Usually, in one IPL match, there are around 1,000 or 800 police
06:24personnel deployed at the stadium because there is also 60,000 crowd or 70,000 crores around
06:28the stadium during the IPL matches. Considering the victory parade was not there and all the
06:32people would go to the stadium, they were expecting around 75,000 to 80,000. Hence, the police
06:37deployment was also increased by the department. But however, the fans were fans. They were
06:42half of them were drunk, half of them just wanted to barge in, half of them were doing
06:47pickpockets there. All kind of crime were happening at that point of time and it was just chaos
06:51everywhere. The police also were clearly outnumbered. But yes, the buck stops at the present dispensation.
06:58If Mumbai and Kolkata could do it with Mumbai Indians.
07:03I agree. I agree. I agree. Because you know, Naga, if you look at it, if you look at it, any football
07:07match, if you, you know, any of the leagues that one has gone for any football match, the fans are
07:13rowdier even then. You know, what at least I believe in, Gaurav, I want to bring you in is,
07:17because it does seem the RCB, the cricketers, they're nothing else but cricketing mercenaries.
07:23They will go next year with the highest bidder. It is the fans that will pay the highest price and they
07:29already have. But Gaurav, your views, quick. Whoever took the decision to hold this event
07:35the very next day after victory without preparations is the person to blame. No one else is to shoulder
07:42the blame, not the cricket board. They proposed. Now it's for the government to take a decision.
07:47And once you've taken a decision, you should make efforts to ensure that it's followed through.
07:54There was so much kabhi haan, kabhi naa from all the information that's coming in. The right-hand
07:59doesn't know what the left-hand is doing. And that's the tragedy. That's the crisis in command.
08:03Everyone wants a selfie with the cricketers. Everyone and their aunts and their nieces and
08:09nephews. They want a picture with the celebrities. None of them want to work. The police are going with
08:14the VIPs. Of course they are. But the police don't have clear instructions. Will there be a parade?
08:18Will there not be a parade? Who's to give that instruction? Who's to shoulder responsibility?
08:23Everyone wants the trophy and a picture with the trophy. No one wants responsibility. And that's
08:27the tragedy in Bangalore. Sahil, I want to bring you in because Sahil, you know, you're no stranger to
08:32victory parades. Mumbai hosted one, you know, a short while ago. And they did it quite successfully.
08:41Well, we had seen a massive parade in 2007 when for the first time the T20 World Cup was,
08:45you know, won by the Indian team. And it was a massive parade right from the Mumbai airport to the
08:51Wankhiri Stadium at Nariman Point. The point being here is that, you know, who loves the crowds?
08:58Basically, the politicians, the ruling class loves the crowds. And that's why such kind of big events
09:05are organized. What we are hearing at this point of time, I did a show at 5 o'clock on
09:10Ashtag and former police commissioner of Bangalore, Bangalore Bhaskar Rao was part of the panel. And he
09:17made a very important point. He said that the police tried to convince the government that, you know,
09:23let's try and do this on Sunday, because Sunday being a holiday, we will have a better scope of adjusting
09:30such a large crowd because they were expecting large crowds on the streets. This being a working day in
09:35a city like Bangalore, we should avoid having these events on a working day. But it looks like
09:43that the political leadership also wanted to extract their share of fame when the franchisee team of
09:52Royal Challengers, Bangalore, which actually has nothing to do with the state. But they also wanted
09:57to be seen with the team which had a victory after 18 years of time. And that's why this happened.
10:05It always happens when the politicians push for more crowd at the event. That's what we saw in
10:12Kumbh. There were multiple stampedes. And that's what people spoke about. We saw this in Hathras,
10:20when more than 100 people died. Most of the places, wherever the politicians are involved and they
10:26want to be associated with the crowd, such kind of stampede happens. And finally, I think the buck stops at
10:33the people who took the decision of having this event immediately the next day.
10:38No, you know, Akshat, I want to bring you in, but just, you know, I want to give my two pence in right
10:42here. I feel that life is too cheap and state governments need to step up and take the blame.
10:48Because what happened in Bangalore, in Karnataka is not the first incident. Last month, there were six
10:54lives which were lost in Goa. Nothing happened. If the chief minister come out other than say that,
10:58you know, we are so sorry for the loss, absolutely nothing. The same thing happened in Uttar Pradesh,
11:03Kumbh. Suraj Pal, who, that Hathras stampede, 130 people died. Bhole Baba doesn't even have his name on the
11:09FIR. And that's all because of political reasons. So, if Sidharamaya needed to resign, then yes, the
11:14chief minister of Goa needed to resign. The chief minister of UP needed to step down on multiple accounts.
11:19So, the buck stops with the state government and they need to take more responsibility then or the
11:26accountability that is being attached to them. No, I agree with you that the buck stops with
11:29the state government. I'm not going to go into name calling because that's the job of the political
11:33party is to say CM should resign and all of that. That's something with an inquiry we know who to
11:37really point the finger at. But I think very clearly the government was wrong in first going
11:42ahead and acting like a fan club of the RCBA in the sense that at a time when, you know, you had a
11:47stampede breaking out one hour later to go ahead with a felicitation ceremony and then back it up and
11:52defending it saying, look, we ensured it's a curtailed ceremony. Absolutely terrible messaging.
11:57And that's where that message comes across, Preeti, that life is cheap here in India, that we don't
12:01care. Politicians don't care. And then you have another such event taking place at the Chindaswamy
12:06Stadium right after meters away from where the stampede had occurred, where 11 lives were lost.
12:11It reeks of insensitivity. And that for me comes from a place of arrogance where the government
12:16believed that they will not be held accountable and so would get away with holding this kind of a bash,
12:22a celebration right after a stampede. Because successive governments before them have gotten
12:25away. Literally gotten away. The stampede in Delhi, the stampede in UP, the stampede in Goa. Rajdeep,
12:31before I go back to you, I want to bring in both Suyesha and Anjali. Suyesha, you want to come in
12:35first and then Anjali, you go. I just want to make two, three standalone points. Firstly, I mean,
12:40ever since this tragedy occurred, the Karnataka government is trying everything possible to shift
12:45the blame. I mean, if you're saying that it was the RCB that was responsible and they held the event
12:51and they should have decided otherwise. DKS also went to the airport to receive the players. So you
12:58were there. You can't constantly keep shifting the blame. That is one. Secondly, as far as the Congress
13:03is concerned, these were the similar statements that they were making when Mahakomba had happened.
13:09Exactly the same words. Mismanagement. There should have been this, that. So exactly what they're
13:15saying. In fact, Pramo Tiwari went all out after the UP government at that time. And even today,
13:20he said that, you know, as a compensation, you're giving only 10 lakh rupees. Why 10 lakh rupees? You
13:25made so much money in this event of the RCB. You should be giving at least two crore rupees to each
13:31victim. And lastly, I just want to say, because I was in the studio at the time that the situation was
13:36really turning around. And you know, that celebration, while we were out there celebrating,
13:41the news came and the three people have lost their lives. That is the point that where it started.
13:45And even before that, like all of us who were there in the studio, we were constantly putting
13:50out this message, people, please be careful, please be careful, you're putting your lives at risk.
13:55Point is that the cops were clearly outnumbered. My heart goes out to that constable who was trying to
14:01control such a huge crowd, that woman with the latte who was trying to pull the, I mean,
14:05push the crowds away. And in fact, those who were on the ground, Naga and even Sagairad said,
14:10that had they not done that, the situation would have been worse. So for the ones deployed,
14:15it was a tough situation for them. Anjali, for the ones deployed, it was tough situation,
14:20but not for their bosses. So firstly, the chief minister and the government has,
14:25has to accept the responsibility. Secondly, it's your job to anticipate. Crowd was more than we expected.
14:32What? You didn't see how many people were taking the metro. You didn't get the information over
14:36wireless that there are so many people rushing towards Chinnaswamy Stadium. We sitting in the
14:40studio could anticipate it. Or the sheer fact that the party ended at 6am in the morning.
14:45Yes. That there were people out on the roads of Bangalore till 6am. If news anchors sitting in
14:49Delhi could anticipate, and you worried a little bit, how could the government and the police not
14:55be worried? I'm sorry, you may have been tired, but you have to anticipate this. You have to worry
14:59about the people. You have to protect your citizens. And you know, cops will always be outnumbered.
15:05As I said, there's a lack of intelligence there. The metro station, there was not a single cop there.
15:10There to close it down. You know, the tragedy of this country is that we actually have to resort
15:15to lathe charge and we actually say that that's the right step. That makes things worse.
15:19Can I just tell you that lathe charge in any part of the world is for rioters. They weren't rioters.
15:25They were fans. The fact that you have to resort to lathe charge and we say it's okay because how
15:29else do you control the crowd? Because there is no process in place. There are no protocols in place
15:34to manage a situation like this. No, but the reason there was no protocol was also, Nikhil,
15:37because there was so much confusion. There were no details given to fans. How do you enter the
15:42Chinaswami Stadium? The fact is, Rajiv, I want to bring you into any event where there are too many
15:46people in this country, be it a concert, be it a, you know, cricketing match, you're on your own.
15:50You know, if you survive it, it's great. No, let's not damn the cops. We've got some, you know,
15:55it's very easy to say that that lower level constabulary, the way, you know, the entire narrative is as if the
16:01lower level constabulary should have anticipated the crowd. No, no, no, no. All of us are going to
16:06have to happen. No, no, no. Let me tell you this. Let's do some plain speaking. The fact is,
16:12many of you, Nikhil may not agree, many of the figures, many of the figures come from different
16:20parts of the world. One second, I'll have to finish. One second, nobody can hear anything about it.
16:23Why do you think this was not done on the Sunday and done on the Wednesday? I asked you a simple
16:27question. Answer the question. No, not the government. RCB. RCB's players. But who is RCB?
16:34One minute, one minute. So therefore we come to the point. Who is RCB? It is the, it is the,
16:38therefore we come to the point that unfortunately the IPL. The IPL is at the end of the day a private
16:45event. Yes, sure. RCB is a private team. Yes. Karnataka state government wants to identify with
16:51the private event which has succeeded. The brand they want to identify with the franchise. KSCA,
16:56which is where the Chinaswami stadium is, also wants to identify with RCB. My problem is,
17:01you see, if it was an India team, I could understand that you wanted to do this celebration
17:05on such a grand scale. This is a private franchise. It damn well is the responsibility of the state
17:11government, of the private franchise and of KSCA to get that act together. That's deflection.
17:16That's deflection. It's the responsibility of the government and government alone, not
17:21the cricket agents. We have reached the stage. We have reached the stage. We have reached the stage.
17:24If the private franchise and the government had any sense, they would have worked it out together
17:29and done it on a Sunday. But such is the threat. Everybody wants to. You may see it as a private
17:33franchise. There are, there are 300,000 fans that treat that team as their own. You may think of it as a
17:39private franchise. You may go chair for an Indian team, but there are other fans who want to chair for
17:43RCB. I am asking you a simple question. It's their right to celebrate. Sir, you are not asking my,
17:46answering my question. Why was it not held on a Sunday?
17:49One second, one second.
17:53Can RCB hold a function without permissions? Can RCB hold a function?
17:57My fear is that we, the point that somebody made, we have converted RCB also into an extension, as you
18:03said, of this larger fan, fandom. Once you do that, everybody there lost their head.
18:09The government lost their head.
18:11One second, one second, one second, only one second.
18:15Give it ten seconds. Make your point.
18:17It's a private franchise. It does not decide. A decision is taken by the government.
18:21Once the decision has been taken by the government, it's the government that has to fulfill its responsibility.
18:29I agree with you. Government, you know.
18:31Did we say that during Qum? Did we say that during the Qum?
18:33Of course it did. No, we didn't. No, we didn't.
18:35Who did? This is what about. No, it's not what about me.
18:39It should be what about me. It should be what about me.
18:42No, no, one minute.
18:43One minute. One minute. One minute.
18:45The point is, when you talk about this and you don't talk about that, that becomes problematic.
18:50One minute.
18:51That becomes problematic.
18:53The Qum is not a private event. The event where Baba Bhole was there was a private event.
18:58Even there.
18:59And that is where the problem comes. This is also a private event. I am very clear about it.
19:03The state government has to provide the support to them.
19:05But Suraj Pal doesn't.
19:06Two of them should have sat together and realized Sunday is better than Wednesday.
19:10But players want to leave, go across the world.
19:12Okay, Sahil and Nagar, Sahil and Nagar do want to make a point.
19:15It's a job of the government.
19:16Okay.
19:17Sahil wanted to come in.
19:18Sahil, make your point.
19:19One second.
19:20Allow me to bring in Sahil and Nagar do.
19:22Rajdeep, allow me to bring in Sahil and Nagar do.
19:24Sahil, make your point.
19:25I ask you, should people resign?
19:26Sahil, go ahead, make your point.
19:28Okay.
19:29Okay.
19:30Okay.
19:31I just want to add one thing.
19:32You know, here it is clearly we can see that at 11.56 in the morning, the Bangalore police
19:37says that we are not allowing any kind of a parade because it is not possible.
19:41We will not be able to handle it.
19:43Again at 3.14 in the evening, in the afternoon, the RCB announces that there is going to be a parade at 5 o'clock.
19:50How does that happen?
19:51How does that happen?
19:53As in, if the police has made it very clear that there is not going to be any parade, despite that the parade happens.
20:00Number one.
20:01Number two.
20:02Number two.
20:03Number two.
20:04At 3.30, the stampede happens.
20:05And at 4.30, the team is being felicitated in front of the Bangalore assembly by the chief minister and the deputy chief minister.
20:13And the government had no idea that there is a stampede which has happened.
20:16I want to go to Nagar Arjun.
20:18Allow me to go to Nagar Arjun.
20:19The request for the function the next day was given by the players and the franchise themselves.
20:24Okay.
20:25I would like to bring it Nagar Arjun Dwarakhanath into this conversation.
20:31Naga, you wanted to interject for a while.
20:33Nikhil, allow Nagar Arjun to come in and I'll come to you after that.
20:36Nikhil, allow Nagar Arjun to come in.
20:38Nagar Arjun, go ahead.
20:39Make your point.
20:40Naga, let that not go.
20:41Let me get Nagar Arjun.
20:42Let me get Nagar Arjun.
20:43Let me get Nagar Arjun.
20:44Say, say, let me get Nagar Arjun, say.
20:45Say, say one minute.
20:46One minute.
20:47Say.
20:48One minute.
20:49One minute, say one minute.
20:54The RCB franchise and the cricket association seem to be taking unanimous decision and putting
20:59more pressure on the government.
21:01Imagine RCB going out to Twitter and saying on social media and saying that we are not being given permission would look much bad than what happened today and hence the government also somewhere succumbed to the pressure from the franchisee and the Chinnaswamy association, cricket association that yes, in fact 7am is the time when RCB tweeted themselves saying that there is a victory parade without even consulting, in fact I woke up the traffic commissioner saying that boss there is a victory ceremony happening, do you know this? He said no we are not, I slept at 5am because I was clearing the crowd.
21:27He said who said this? I said RCB has tweeted. How do you know? That's the kind of communication that RCB has done and secondly the CM and DCM I think we are outnumbering each other in terms of PR.
21:39So Naga are you saying that the state government succumbed under the pressure of a franchisee, that's what you are saying?
21:47That is even worst.
21:48See, that is even worst.
21:51Seems like it.
21:51That's what happened.
21:52No, not just that but also the fandom because the fandom.
21:55That's very true and need to show you.
21:57That's very true and need to show you.
21:58That's just Akshita, allow Akshita to come to you.
22:00If that's the case, that's a sign of a weak government which is why I say that the buck stops with the government.
22:05Who can push back against the RCB Rajdeep?
22:07It's only the government.
22:08The government should have put their foot down and said nothing.
22:10But Akshita, you should also realize you should also.
22:13You should also.
22:15Out and out the politicians wanted to have their moments.
22:18They wanted this to happen.
22:20They wanted the pictures with the cricketers.
22:23And that is why they made it happen.
22:25It could not have happened had they not allowed it.
22:28Anjali, simple.
22:29Even after the incident, the Chief Minister Stone.
22:33Allow Anjali Sahil.
22:34Allow her to come in.
22:35He could have been a little more apologetic about it.
22:39I think only Priyam Khadgev was the one who actually accepted responsibility.
22:44I'm saying post the event also, you can have a responsible attitude.
22:48And one more, just one more thing.
22:50Two ambulances were there.
22:52True.
22:52Our Chief Minister's cavalcade has more ambulances.
22:55As bizarre.
22:56Two ambulances.
22:56Rajdeep, very quickly because Naga works.
22:58My limited point is, I want to know, should this lead to resignations?
23:021956, strange tragedy.
23:04150 people died.
23:05Lal Badun Shasthi resigned.
23:07Should people...
23:08No, no.
23:08One minute.
23:09At some stage, at some stage, are we going to reach a stage where if we are saying,
23:15broadly, I believe that both, in my view, the state government buck stops with them,
23:19the franchise cannot escape responsibility.
23:21I'm very clear.
23:22In this instance, they cannot.
23:23They push to have the function the very next day.
23:26Yes.
23:27But will anyone resign?
23:28Will anyone be a Lal Badun Shastri in today's India and take moral responsibility and resign?
23:33That's the question I ask.
23:34Because the others haven't, Rajdeep.
23:35That's the question I ask.
23:36No, because the others haven't, that's what it's not happening now.
23:39I don't want to resign in a train accident those days are long gone.
23:42No, forget about train accident.
23:43Because in the last three stampings, nobody's resigned.
23:45Siddhar Ramayya, then why should he?
23:47But yes, Siddhar Ramayya should resign.
23:49So should have Yogi Adityanath.
23:50So should have the Goa chief minister.
23:51I don't know why we keep raising past incidents.
23:53Because you've got to.
23:54You have to raise it.
23:55You cannot talk about the isolation.
23:57I'm not saying it.
23:57I'm not saying it.
23:57I'm not saying it.
23:57I'm not saying it.
23:57I'm saying it.
23:58I'm asking the question.
23:59Absolutely.
23:59I'm asking the question.
24:01I will only say this, Rajdeep.
24:01I will only say that I don't think we can expect.
24:03I don't have an answer.
24:04Okay, Sahih, we can expect any of them to resign, quite simply.
24:07But as we said that, I think it's political water boundary.
24:09One, to ask a CM to resign.
24:11And second, to raise past incidents.
24:12But should a FIR name somebody from the authorities or not?
24:16One second.
24:16And the names that are there are RCB.
24:20First, it's unknown.
24:21Then it's RCB.
24:22What sort of an FIR is this?
24:23And there has been an incident in Hathras where 130 people have died in Suraj Pal's name.
24:27The Baba's name.
24:28Bhozai Baba's name is still not on that FIR.
24:30Who's responsible for that?
24:31But Sahil and Naga wanted to come in 10 seconds each.
24:34Please go ahead and then I'm going to go into a break.
24:38No, I just wanted to add thing that...
24:40It is not about the government succumbing to the pressure of the franchisee.
24:44Sahil, go quickly.
24:47No, no.
24:47I'm saying if Allu Arjun can be arrested because what happened in Telangana,
24:51the Telangana government took action.
24:53There were questions raised on Telangana government for taking action against Allu Arjun.
24:57I think there has to be an action taken against whoever is responsible in the Bangalore incidents as well.
25:03And wherever such kind of incidents has happened, the action must be taken.
25:07You have to ensure as a government to...
25:10But Sahil, that could tantamount to Gandhi's arresting themselves.
25:12Raga, 20 seconds, Raja.
25:14No, let everybody define action.
25:16But Sahil...
25:17Should there be resignations or not?
25:17Okay, I will take...
25:18Okay, Naga, let's begin with you because we don't have time.
25:20Naga, you want to go with the question mooted by Rajdeep?
25:24Should there be resignations or not?
25:27Yes, there has to be a...
25:29There has to be a resignation.
25:31Whoever took the call of giving this permission and whoever deployed the police,
25:35whoever did the final arrangements of protocol has to reason.
25:38Heads have to roll.
25:3911 lives are too much.
25:40There still have to be value for some life.
25:43It can't just...
25:43People can't keep passing the buck.
25:45Okay, okay, fine.
25:46We don't have time.
25:47Naga, fine.
25:47Naga, fine.
25:48And heads have to roll.
25:49It's not for me to talk about whether there should be resignations or not.
25:52But what I saw was a complete mismanagement.
25:55And I think it also...
25:57You know, we've given past examples of various incidents.
26:00I thought we were one rumor away from an incident like this
26:03in past open bus parades as well.
26:05The number of people that turn up, the number of people that reach stadium.
26:09I think overall we need to get our systems right.
26:11And that is something that...
26:13It's not just for this particular parade,
26:15but overall, as I've seen in the past as well.
26:17Right. Akshita?
26:17I don't think there will be any resignations,
26:19but ideally speaking there should be.
26:20I think that it should be largely the Karnataka Home Minister
26:24for failing to ensure proper management of the situation.
26:27Varun?
26:27So I'm against this past instances of water boundary
26:30because it's almost like Amitabh Bachchan in Divaar saying,
26:33go first, take her signature,
26:35take my mother's name.
26:36Go first, take her signature.
26:38Go first, take her signature.
26:39That's what I mean.
26:40Okay, one second, one second.
26:41We don't have the time.
26:42You have one instance right now.
26:44Take action here.
26:45Whoever gave permission is the person who's responsible.
26:47Okay, why I think you need to bring up the past
26:49is the present resides on the inadequacies of the past.
26:52The reason why the Siddharamaya government
26:55thinks they can get away with it
26:56because every successive government
26:58in the last one year of stampede,
26:59and there have been, you know how many?
27:0118 stampedes.
27:02Each, every government has gotten away with it.
27:05That is the reason why you bring up the past
27:07because today resides on the inadequacies of the past.
27:10I want to bring,
27:11I quickly just want to say
27:14that the Karnataka government
27:15can't get away in the name of RCB.
27:17So even if there are resignations,
27:19it can't just be that RCB was at fault
27:21and so we are all clean.
27:23There have to be resignations
27:24within the Karnataka government.
27:25I'm not saying CM and Deputy CM,
27:27but I agree with you
27:28that should have been a precedent always
27:30if they are expected to put down their resignations.
27:32Anjali, the government has to take responsibility.
27:34They cannot talk like the way
27:35they are talking right now.
27:36Secondly, RCB,
27:38if you're making money off it,
27:39some sort of an accountability has to be there.
27:42They are making money,
27:43they have to pay for their mistakes.
27:44Alright, Sahil didn't come inside.
27:4710 seconds quickly.
27:51Of course the government
27:52will have to take the responsibility
27:53and the person who took the call
27:56despite police telling them repeatedly
27:59that do not have this event on the working day
28:01should be resigning from the government
28:03because of this incident.
28:05Alright, we're going to end it there
28:06because I think at least one thing
28:08that we all agree on the Democratic newsroom
28:09is that action needs to be taken.
28:11We might have different forms
28:12of whatever that action might mean,
28:14but accountability needs to be fixed.
28:16And as a channel,
28:16we're going to keep a keen eye
28:17on if accountability was fixed in this case.