Business Insider's chief video correspondent Graham Flanagan and senior producer Jake Gabbard take you behind the scenes of the latest "Boot Camp" story: covering the US Army Mountain Warfare School in the rugged mountains of Vermont.
Category
😹
FunTranscript
00:00I am harnessed in with just a tether and I'm dangling on the side of this cliff
00:07filming them above me and it's a really cool low-angle shot but you know as I
00:14was going down to get the shot I dropped the camera in four feet of snow so I
00:18have to pull it out and then these the guys are coming that's why I'm quickly
00:21trying to clean the lens so then I pull out the GoPro and I'm trying to film
00:24with the GoPro to at least get the shot.
00:27I'm Graham Flanagan, Chief Video Correspondent for Business Insider. I'm
00:31the creator and showrunner of Boot Camp which goes inside military and law
00:36enforcement training programs. I'm here with Jake Gabbard, senior producer for
00:42Boot Camp. You've worked on the show since what like 2021? Yeah it's been
00:46almost four years yeah. We're here to talk about Jake's new piece. It's a
00:51feature-length project that goes inside the US Army's Mountain Warfare School in
00:58Jericho, Vermont and it's it's a feature film. It's the third feature-length thing
01:03we've done for Business Insider for Boot Camp and it's got a really cool title to
01:08Gods of the Hills. So I want to say this before we continue talking about this
01:15film that if you have not watched it yet watch it first because we're gonna get
01:20into it and go behind the scenes and get into the nitty-gritty of what you're
01:25seeing. So spoilers ahead, watch the video, you won't be sorry and then pick up
01:32with us after. But Jake, congratulations on the piece. Thank you. It's awesome. This
01:38was a big, big undertaking. Tell us a little bit about the story. Give us like
01:45the elevator pitch and then we'll talk about how you made it. Yeah so I've been
01:51pushing this story for about three years now. I first reached out to them when I
01:55first joined the team and back then you know we were still focusing on kind of
02:00the basic training stories and just seeing people in obstacle courses and
02:04meeting these newly enlisted soldiers. But you know I personally really like
02:09the outdoors a lot and I'm like this is the kind of story I want to tell and at
02:13first you know we were trying to figure out you know what's the story here and
02:16it was a little ahead of where we were going and then as our show
02:20evolved like it's time to go and I was gonna go last year and do it and I
02:24reached out to them and they said there's no snow here you don't want to
02:27come it's just gray and gross. So I had to wait a whole year to come back and I
02:31called them up and they were ready to have me and I checked before I got there
02:34and they're like oh there's plenty of snow don't worry there's gonna be plenty
02:37of snow. So I you know drove up there and spent 14 days with them from start to
02:43finish of the school because often we will drop in on trainings we don't have
02:46the opportunity to really see as they arrive see the same people leave and
02:51everything in between. So this was just a great opportunity to just really see a
02:56full training and document it. So tell me what are they doing at the Army Mountain
03:02Warfare School what is the training what is it for? Well they are doing the same
03:06thing essentially that they have done since 1983 when the school opened. They
03:11are training soldiers and honestly service members from across the branches.
03:15They there were Air Force people there they have international students that
03:18come in and what they are doing is they are training basically trained military
03:23Mountaineers. There's also an advanced course where they go a step further but
03:28essentially what they are doing is they are teaching soldiers how how to
03:32traverse mountains safely survive in cold climates in the winter but
03:38essentially their their job is to teach soldiers how to escort platoons and
03:43troops through the mountains safely to get them to where the objective is.
03:47Fighting often doesn't happen in the mountains because logistically that's
03:52not the best it's more of a defensible area but you have to get through
03:56mountains even as recently as a like Afghanistan a lot of mountainous regions
04:00so these Mountaineers their job is to help escort troops on foot through these
04:05places safely and the idea is that no one they're escorting is trained they
04:09are the trained ones and they can they're the person from their unit that
04:13can do that. So this schoolhouse this training area tell me where it is
04:17located. So it's in a town called Jericho Vermont and it is a tiny town but it's
04:23out kind of in the middle of nowhere and it's just just absolutely beautiful. So
04:29like you said before oftentimes when we cover training programs that are like a
04:34lot longer like Marine boot camp is 13 weeks some schools we go to are like an
04:40amount of months or even like 21 days but we normally we can't invest that
04:47time and resources to like be there for you know 13 weeks or whatever six months
04:53so we'll often just like bounce around to the different companies and different
04:57stages of training and then try to like weave the story together telling you
05:01know those different with those different sort of chapters that we weave
05:04together but in this case like I did with jungle school in Hawaii sort of a
05:11similar concept where you were there for the full cycle so how long were you
05:16there for how long did this training cycle last because you're there from day
05:21one until graduation. Yeah so it is 14 days and I mean it's jam-packed but yeah
05:27I arrived I think the students also arrived around 1 p.m. on a Saturday and
05:31then graduation was 14 days later on a Friday afternoon and as soon as
05:38graduation is over within 10 minutes the students were in their civilian clothes
05:42on the bus heading to the airport the school wanted them out of there they
05:45wanted to go home it I've never seen it cleaned up that quick and it made it
05:49great for me because I got to go home that night too. So was this the longest
05:52shoot you've ever done like for one story? Yeah this is absolutely the
05:56longest shoot I've ever done I've done long trips but nothing quite like this
06:02where I was in it the whole time you're you know I'm checking my phone to make
06:07sure students didn't get dropped without me knowing and I'm texting the guys at
06:11the school about what is happening that night that I'm missing or what how to
06:15prepare for the next day so I was in it you know from the time I got there to
06:20the time I left which you know was exhausting but kind of exhilarating at
06:24the same time. I know that they run the mountain school in the winter and in
06:30the summer obviously you were there in the winter that you did this in like
06:34early February right so you watch the video if you've seen the video the
06:39conditions are very very difficult like you said there was a ton of snow it was
06:45very windy on top of just the terrain that you guys are dealing with I mean
06:49part of what they learn to do is just how to walk in the snow and walk up
06:54these steep grades like just getting around in this so the soldiers that are
06:59the students we're all learning this but you civilian Jake you had to go with
07:06them every step of the way to the extent that you could and you're also carrying
07:12a bunch of camera gear like take me I want to know like first of all like what
07:16gear did you have for this shoot camera gear wise I had like the normal rig I
07:21usually do for boot camp which is very mobile I have a mirrorless camera that's
07:26just essentially a DSLR and I put it on a monopod it's got a little microphone
07:31on top and that's pretty much it I just run around with it everywhere I go I
07:34also usually will carry some GoPros and I had to utilize some GoPros on this
07:38shoot I even had to utilize my iPhone a couple of times because my other my main
07:43camera was covered in snow or frozen so okay so yeah tell me about that because
07:47there's there's multiple scenes in this where the snow is just unrelenting so
07:52tell me about that impact on your gear during the shoot and how you sort of
07:56mitigated like full damage and failure one is I would check where the wind was
08:00blowing and I would stand against the wind and point the camera with the wind
08:05so that way the snow is not coming to the lens as best as possible yeah which
08:09obviously when you're out in the woods or whatever or on a cliffside it's hard
08:12to do but I was trying to be like very conscious of where the snow was gonna
08:16hit the camera but then a certain point like on day four when we were filming at
08:20Castle Rock it was a blizzard or the land navigation on day six it was a
08:25blizzard it was whiteout conditions there's only so much you can do and
08:28every probably 30 seconds there was a half inch of snow getting on my
08:31microphone which is messing up the audio and just covering the camera so I was
08:36doing what I could and then in any moments where I wasn't using the camera
08:40I learned this technique from the soldiers there I think they call it
08:44happy turtle sad turtle where they take their helmet in the snow and if their
08:49helmet is upside down face you know with the kind of the lining facing up they
08:54call that sad turtle because it's a turtle on its back and that you're
08:57getting snow in your helmet it's gonna get wet it's not good for survival so
09:00they teach the soldiers to put their helmet you know with the top going up
09:05right so I started doing that because I had helmet as well right and I would
09:07just put my helmet on top of the camera to protect it from the snow but you're
09:10camera survived right your microphone survived yeah I mean we've been filming
09:15boot camp for four years this is the only camera I use because it's it's
09:18tough it's been in airplanes it's been in the desert it's been in four feet of
09:22snow and you know I dropped this camera in the snow a lot because I was falling
09:28and tripping and there's nothing you can do and it held up great and what which
09:32camera and lens I use the Panasonic Lumix s1h it's it's smaller it's compact
09:39but it's it's it's it's a workhorse and I love it for these boot camp stories
09:42because it's light and we're filming for 12 hours in crazy conditions on the
09:47side of mountains so I had to be able to carry this or sometimes I'd have to
09:50throw it in a backpack because I was getting on a snowmobile that's the
09:52camera I use and then I just have a little Minfrotto monopod and I would
09:55just throw it on there and I think it you know it does the job and did you
09:58just stick with one lens or did you have like a series like multiple lenses I did
10:02have multiple lenses I mainly only ever used the 24 to 105 lens that's kind of
10:07that's the bread and butter for boot camp I think it gets a little depth of
10:11field but also it's versatile but then if the you know if the conditions allow
10:16I like to throw on the 75 to 200 millimeter kind of telephoto lens and
10:21the scene where they're doing the ice wall climbing yeah I threw that on there
10:25you can you can tell the the colors and everything are so much crisper it's it
10:29just really gets some great depth of field but often when you're running
10:32gunning and you're talking to someone one second about what they're eating in
10:35an MRE versus filming them rappelling down a mountain the 24 to 105 lens is
10:41is the is a good option because you can get a little bit everything with that so
10:44that's your gear and it's amazing that it survived these conditions I mean if
10:49you watch some of the footage where the wind is just blasting the snows coming
10:53down not even considering what you're having to navigate on your own two feet
10:58to stay upright and keep the gear under control I mean it's it's just amazing
11:04that you that you got everything out of there in one piece that at least that
11:07you've told me about but what about based on the the very cold and difficult
11:13conditions tell me about like what you were wearing like what clothes did you
11:18bring and then how did that evolve once like reality set in I'm guessing you
11:23know you had to kind of upgrade yeah I definitely had a certain amount of
11:27hubris when approaching this shoot I'm super outdoorsy I go hiking all the time
11:32and I made that very clear to my contacts at the school I'd like oh I
11:36have hiking boots and I bought a couple pair of long underwear and I had
11:41Chili's yeah I had that I bought a 30 pack of hand warmers and I had like a
11:46Patagonia coat and I show up and actually here's a picture of me wearing
11:51that on one of the first days and it you know I thought that that's what I was
11:54gonna wear the whole time and then very quickly they confronted me like hey this
11:58isn't gonna work you're not gonna be able to film this whole school if that's
12:01all you have and at first I was kind of offended cuz I know I got this and then
12:05I started going up hills a little bit not not mountains just hills that were
12:10just steep and I kept falling and it just wasn't working so they they hooked
12:14me up with the entire the same gear that all the soldiers get I got the full
12:18equic system the the extended cold weather clothing system and I had
12:22crampons I had trekking poles I had balaclavas I had the boots that the two
12:31the two-layer boots I had all of that there was no way that this shoot would
12:35have happened if I was wearing my civilian things because that those clothes
12:39got soaked within five minutes and then I would have gotten hypothermia and had
12:42to call it so the the military gear got me through that shoot which was cool too
12:48because you know like I you know playing soldier a little bit yeah I learned that
12:52the hard way on the jungle school shoot like I'm like oh I'm in Hawaii and I
12:57literally was wearing like khakis and Merrill's and like a polo and like a
13:03Patagonia shell and all of that got thrown away at the end of the shoot and
13:08you live and learn yeah now I've upgraded a little bit I've more tactical
13:11wardrobe for these shoots but you've got your gear set up you're very mobile it
13:16survived they upgrade you for the clothes you really need to survive out
13:21there which is what the soldiers have and but then there are some pictures
13:26that you that you have that we can show that you you had to repel down steep
13:34graded grades and and I guess you could say rock faces right to get to where you
13:40needed to be there wasn't like a staircase that you could just take
13:43around for the camera guy right like tell me a little bit about that
13:46experience when did you have to like actually repel and you know you had to
13:51secure your gear and just you know to make sure it didn't break while you were
13:53getting from one place to the other it's important to reiterate every shot
13:56you see throughout that training I had to get and I have filmed on some
14:02mountains before for other shows and things like that and typically there's
14:04like a little hiking trail that takes you to a viewpoint that's kind of what I
14:08had anticipated for this that the you know the people that were kind of
14:12escorting me around would take me to these you know these viewpoints that's
14:16not how this works and I learned that like on day two that if I wanted to get
14:20the shots that I was sent here to go get and tell the story I had to get I had to
14:23do the same thing that these guys were doing with the exception of like the
14:26ice the ice wall there was like a way around it but so yeah I had to learn how
14:30to repel I had to learn how to use an ascender on the fixed ropes and if not
14:36like I wouldn't have gotten the shots so yeah I it was after the students would
14:43learn something and they were kind of wrapped for the day and they're going
14:46back to the schoolhouse and rocking back which would take about an hour I would
14:49stay with the instructors and they would rig me up and teach me how to do
14:54it and they would practice like how comfortable I was walking to the edge of
14:59these cliffs and honestly the first time I did it it was freaky you know because
15:03I'm kind of just dangling there like a booger trying to like get these shots
15:07but at the same time I'm a little afraid of heights but then as it progressed I
15:10was learning more and more skills and then I got more confident and then yeah
15:13on like day 12 in order to get where I needed to get safely I had to ascend up
15:19using the ascender and then I had to go down with the repel and honestly that
15:22was maybe one of my favorite moments of the whole school was getting to repel
15:25that was fun it was genuinely fun it's you know it's a really cool feeling just
15:30to kind of slide down there really smooth I was doing oh I mean I was not
15:34doing the same stuff the soldiers were doing I but I had to do some of the
15:37skill set and you know I had escorts that were helping me do it safely and I
15:43had like security ropes that the soldiers weren't using in case something
15:47happened you know I mean you were definitely doing things that you didn't
15:51have to do on like your Air Force boot camp shoot or your Space Force shoot or
15:56some of your old food shoots that you used to do yeah I love adventure
16:02shooting that's my favorite thing to do here is to be out in the field and put
16:05myself in these scenarios but sometimes there are things that kind of push you
16:09and like you know if I'm gonna get this shot if I'm gonna tell this story I have
16:13to get in front of the soldiers I can't be behind them because then it's just a
16:16video of their butts so I'm I have to get up and like on day four when they're
16:20ascending Castle Rock and coming back down there's a pathway for them I can't
16:25stand in the pathway so I had to climb up into the middle of this cliffside and
16:29find and like dig a hole that I could stand in safely and move back and forth
16:33to get all the shots I needed the the the film is like so it's it's it's about
16:37an hour long and it spans 14 days but it moves at a really nice pace so it's just
16:44like shot after shot after shot shot you for kind of forget or don't even
16:48realize like what's going into the shot because you're just like watching the
16:51story every shot tells a story or as part of whatever scene we're watching
16:54progressing the story along but like can you name like any particular shots in
16:59the piece where like the audience I should know what was going into getting
17:05this shot in terms of like where you were position with the camera what you
17:09had to do to to make sure you were safe or the gear was safe yeah there's one in
17:14particular that I can think of that I actually have a behind-the-scenes video
17:18that one of the guys shot here I am harnessed in with just a tether and I'm
17:23dangling on the side of this cliff filming them above me and it's a really
17:28cool low angle shot but you know as I was going down to get the shot I dropped
17:33the camera in four feet of snow so I have to pull it out and then these the
17:37guys are coming and so I I'm quickly trying to clean the land so then I pull
17:40out the GoPro and I'm trying to film with the GoPro to at least get the shot
17:43but there are a lot of like on the culminating event at the notch there's
17:46so many shots like that that also I'd have to hold my breath a lot of the time
17:50because I was so exhausted and panting and like I get there just in time yeah
17:55and then here they come so I would hold my breath and try not to shake the
17:57camera because I'm exhausted and like I'm I got that you know the tunnel
18:00vision in my eyes but I'm like you know the camera knows what it's doing it's
18:03when you when you approach a story and you get the opportunity and the access
18:07to cover like a full cycle of training it affords us the opportunity that we
18:12don't often get in those other stories where we're kind of bouncing around to
18:15like really get to know people and it for in the context of your story like
18:21you get characters right that you can like follow all the way through you know
18:26when we're bouncing around like marine boot camp or something like we might
18:30only be at a site for a few hours covering like an obstacle course and
18:35like within that obstacle course it's like okay let's stick with this one
18:38person hear their story have a little like mini character arc within that
18:41little chapter and then that's it but in this case like you get to meet these
18:46people on day one and I you know that is one of my favorite parts of this this
18:52film is that we get to know these people and individually and sort of get attached
18:59to them and develop like you know certain feelings or opinions about them
19:03I want to ask you about one specific one that I think many will agree is like the
19:07standout character in this piece and that's Honeycutt who is Honeycutt so
19:14Staff Sergeant Nicholas Honeycutt he's one of those guys and like you mentioned
19:17a big part of our job is finding these people finding these characters so day
19:21one they're checking in none of them know each other and they're you know
19:24going up to their barracks and they're nervous it's first day of school they're
19:28nervous I'm up there in the barracks with them and I'm kind of filming asking
19:32some questions but really I'm kind of scoping out who are the people I'm gonna
19:35spend the next 14 days covering for this story who's captivating who's
19:39interesting who do I want to follow because sometimes people are you know a
19:42little bit quieter and don't make good characters I'm there and within five
19:46seconds in the barracks I hear him cracking jokes about how cold it is
19:49there's a shot a little scene in that day one where he's joking around about
19:54being from Texas and you know it gets cold there but not you know not as cold
19:59as it is here and you know I could he was already talking about how cold it
20:03was and I was like this guy I want to I want to talk to more so I just started
20:14asking him questions and then every single day I would kind of check in with
20:17him he's always right here in my face and you know got to know him really well
20:22and I just you know I love getting to follow him around as he experienced
20:26because he was very vocal about how cold it was and how you know hard it was but
20:32you know he had a big heart and great guy to follow when I got there I you
20:36know I you know when I worked with the school I said you know I want to be able
20:39to follow characters so there are three different squads and they every single
20:44person that was placed in the second squad had been asked if they were
20:47comfortable being featured in this documentary which is great that's a
20:51dream for me so there were a couple of people who were special ops that I don't
20:58even think we're going by their actual names I wasn't allowed to film them
21:00understandably so everyone that was placed in the second squad they were
21:04totally comfortable being on camera and there were there were many times and
21:07we'll get to this in a little bit with you know the test taking where it gets
21:11intense and they're having moments of real you know stress and real you know
21:18worry and I would ask I'm like hey is it okay if I keep filming you like I I
21:22need this for the story like I want to film this but I also don't want to
21:27influence your time here and and honeycutt especially was super gracious
21:32the whole time in schools like this like at jungle school if you get accepted and
21:39you start the course like you're not guaranteed to graduate like obviously
21:43there's always the risk of like illness or injury that can get you out of the
21:45course but along the way in between day one and graduation they're like these
21:50critical tests where if you fail the test even if you're only like halfway
21:56through the course they're like gotta you gotta go so in my experience at
22:00jungle school it's like there are all these tests in the first few days and
22:03you're following characters around it you know you you're hoping they'll make
22:08it all the way through to the end and you'll have that postgame interview like
22:11hey aren't you excited but the reality is anybody can fail at any given time so
22:16honeycutt I mean you're with him he's this lovable guy very dynamic funny you
22:23know he's picked to be the squad leader he's a staff sergeant so very capable guy
22:28but then they have this critical test that they say at the beginning of the
22:32video and I love when you do that because I've watched the piece a lot but
22:35they say the knot test is what gets people the knot test is about one week
22:39in on the course we see that there's generally a 15% attrition rate and of
22:44the 15% the vast majority are from the knot test so tell me what happened with
22:49honeycutt and that knot test yeah well first to jump into it you know failure
22:54is necessary because there's a standard here and as a civilian as a citizen you
22:59know of the u.s. I want the guys they're graduating to be ready to go so like
23:05they weren't messing around with that standard and that's why this knot test
23:08is so crucial because that knot test determines right in the halfway point it
23:13determines who can carry on and finish this training and who's not safe or you
23:19know who can we not put on these cliff faces so it's really important and you
23:24don't know who's gonna you know do well you can't kind of an I have an idea but
23:28honeycutt was so confident the whole time I was there he just carried himself
23:31with this confidence but you could see it at the beginning of the scene and I
23:35think there's a shot that we can yeah there's a shot here you can see like
23:39honeycutt is fiddling his fingers right here he's got this like little zip tie
23:43that he's running through his fingers and he's noticeably nervous and you could
23:48really just feel it and something changed he was not shabby that morning
23:51to me he was in his head and then he approaches the instructor at the front
23:56of the line and he's just like I'm as ready as I'll ever fucking be yeah he
23:59says that in like a sarcastic way yeah and it's you get a sense something's a
24:04little off and I feel like he's already he's already given up I'm gonna follow
24:08him through the test and just kind of see what happens he'll pass and then I'll
24:11go cover some other people just to kind of give some context here with the knot
24:15test they take it once if they fail they go to 20 minutes of retraining and then
24:18they get another opportunity to take the test again and if they feel that second
24:22time then they're done and they're kicked out of the school and we go and
24:24I'm noticing real quick he's not getting a lot of the knots there are certain
24:29purposes which they have to name the purpose of each knot purpose of the
24:32butterfly hole is to prepare rope for carry there are certain purposes that
24:38he's just not even saying he's he's so in his head it's not working and then he
24:42gets that score and he had I think 172 out of 240 he was way off he was way off
24:48and that was happening a lot there were a lot of students that on that first
24:51time we're getting around that range yeah honey cut yeah he and they went to
24:55retraining and you know he was making jokes because you could tell he was
24:58nervous and I think that that's how he was handling it he was training and
25:02trained next to a Sierra who was another character that you know was great to
25:06cover and then he went back and did it again and it was kind of a euphoric
25:11second test he was just killing it and I think that comes across like he's just
25:16hitting all these knots all these purposes and I you know I take a sigh
25:19of relief you know he's got this he's he's clearing it up and then with like
25:22the last four knots he just completely got in his head again and just choked
25:27and he ended up failing by four points and and that's it like there's no if
25:32stands or but so he packed his stuff up and within an hour was driven to the
25:36airport and was done with the school when you're filming honey cut taking the
25:41knot test even though he was like totally cool with you filming him and
25:45like open and gracious and like you described do you think that you being
25:51focused on him and like right up in his face like in any way negatively impacted
25:55his performance in the knot test that was my fear definitely was my fear so
26:00there was a moment in retraining when we were in that little side room where
26:05the instructor doing the retraining asked me like hey will you not film him
26:08during the second test and I understood the request but I'm like I kind of have
26:14to I need to see it and then honey cut jumped in and he's like no Jake's got it
26:18and he's took up for me and he's like he's like I'm bad at these knots that's
26:23not Jake's problem Jake you can film whatever there's a moment where you
26:26follow him he like goes into the weight room to sort of decompress and you know
26:32he he's just a different person than he was with all of his swagger and good
26:39humor and he still has a sense of humor to an extent but I mean I wanted to ask
26:47you what that's like for you because I mean he left Texas to go on this trip
26:51and everybody knows and is everybody in his unit knows he's going to mountain
26:54school and it's like you got to come back you know having graduated and you
26:58don't want to go back having been kicked out on you know at the knot test like
27:03what was it like for you to be with him one-on-one clearly he's upset but you're
27:12doing your job to show what happened how it all played out and you you're
27:17obviously invested in you've gotten to know him and what's that like for you in
27:23terms of like balancing what's what you're feeling with like doing your job
27:26and how did how did that work it was kind of devastating I you know I was
27:34imagining every you know night when I go back to the hotel and I was writing
27:37kind of the script in the outline I was imagining him at the graduation and you
27:41know seeing the change from him on day one to day 14 that was in my head I was
27:45already writing it and you know I knew I knew he was going to graduate so all the
27:48sudden when that instructors like you know that's 236 out of 240 unfortunately
27:54that's not enough the look on Honeycutt's face in that scene where you
27:58can just see the you know his stomach just drops mine did too I'm sitting
28:03there holding the camera and like my stomach dropped I'm like oh no like one
28:07I don't say goodbye to him because I've been hanging out with him every day but
28:09to like I wanted to see him succeed so bad and I just really understood how
28:14brutal this you know these schools can be and like it's it's important but also
28:19I was there to do a job and I had to tell a story so I made sure I continued
28:23filming and I kind of I gave him a couple of minutes to gather himself and
28:28then I kind of started to hunting around to see where he was and I caught him
28:31turning his gear in and he was still kind of shaken up from it so I didn't
28:35push him too hard and then he went to kind of where where he liked to spend a
28:39lot of time which was the gym and he was in there just kind of blowing off some
28:41steam and I was like hey do you mind if I just chat with you a little bit and
28:45he's sure and then he was feeling much better already he says he's gonna go
28:49home and cook a steak and or a chicken thigh and drink a beer just for you have
28:55you checked in with honeycutt since you filmed did he drink that beer I I spoke
29:00to him yesterday actually just to kind of follow up and see how he's been doing
29:04I assume he drank the beer I didn't get that answer from him I had a beer for
29:08him that like that night I remember I went to a brewery and had one just for
29:12him but yeah no I he's doing great he said that he's been taking what he you
29:17know what he was able to learn in that first week and he brought it back to his
29:20unit and Ford Bliss and has been teaching them some of the knots and
29:23stuff and I think he plans on coming back and doing the summer course where
29:28it's not cold there's a moment later in the piece well after the knot test where
29:32they're being tested on like lowering techniques and the rope systems that you
29:38have to employ successfully to make those safe and there's an instance where
29:43a student named Garuri is being tested in time don't getting this ropes us rope
29:49system ready five four three two one time stop what you're doing
30:09so your mule isn't cinched down either so you can see that there's there would
30:15be a lot of play in that okay so we were told yesterday by sergeant George that
30:23we would have those tied in so I think that if I had a little bit more time I
30:31wouldn't have freaked out as much because I messed up on my meal or not on
30:35the mule but tying that initial for sick and lost time and then free and
30:42then as you were counting down rush through according to sergeant George
30:46yesterday during the study hall he told everybody those would be pre tied for us
30:49we wouldn't be timed on them so you think that this thing the green yes all
30:53that fucking cause master now I think that the time on that I mean like I
30:57wouldn't have fumble fuck my way through it because I literally heard you going I
31:02don't know what I'm doing I did say that because I was frustrated trying to
31:06get that initial person not tied the 12 minutes is designed I understand for
31:14that so whether you were told that or not it's kind of irregardless okay
31:19business just falling apart or what it's okay man well pack it up all right it's
31:27like I'm out tell me a little bit about that moment what that was like I mean
31:31you could cut the tension with a knife it's had to be awkward it was extremely
31:36awkward and the story about that is pretty crazy in itself I was filming our
31:40loadout episode which is our sister series where we do like a gear thing I
31:45was filming it that morning and then I had to race to where they were doing
31:49that test and they just dropped me off in a suspect they just dropped me off at
31:53the bottom of this hill and all the other soldiers are just kind of hanging
31:57out eating MREs and I'm like hey where's the test happening and they so it's up
32:01there so I'm sprinting with all my gear is like I have to cover this I have to
32:05see this and because you know if there's tests where people are getting sent home
32:07I have to see it and I get up there and there's only like six students taking
32:10the test and one of them happened to be Greary who I had talked to a lot he's
32:15one of my main characters and honestly after honeycut I saw him being kind of a
32:19main character so I wanted to you know like really feature him and I get up
32:22there I start filming and he is freaking out and you hear him just cussing under
32:26his breath and I have to film this but I feel horrible so I did stand further
32:30back than I did for the not test but I don't want to mess up his chances he's
32:34clearly struggling here and actually there's a shot from the not test where I
32:40filmed Dan and he said not right now so I could tell he doesn't want to be
32:47filmed in that totally get it cuz it'll get in his head but I needed this moment
32:50so I'm filming it and he the time ran out and the instructors came over and it
32:56was just nowhere near done he knew that and you know he kind of I think did a
33:02Hail Mary he didn't want to get kicked out of the school understandably he was
33:05so close to being done that was their last day of the test taking and after
33:09that it was just smooth sailing just having fun essentially and so he went
33:14they have the option at the school that you can protest dismissal and they bring
33:19another instructor over there to like hear the case well that's part of the
33:22story yeah no so there's one instructor that was reviewing Gary's work is okay
33:27isn't it pack it up and then the other instructor saw that I was filming it and
33:31he goes he's Jake on Jake just take a step aside and asked me to step aside so
33:36I did I got out of the way he went in there cuz I could tell that he was kind
33:40of concerned about the confrontation that was happening so then he gets into
33:43it he handled it really well but of course I you know immediately turned
33:47back and keep filming it and then you know Gary brought up a point that they
33:51were told that you know certain knots would be tied that they wouldn't have
33:54to waste their time on he was the only student that had failed the test every
34:00other student was fine tying those knots I think he was just trying to do what he
34:03had to do to stay in the school and get his rams head but you know as soon as he
34:08got kicked out I ran over and I was like hey what happened and he's fine he he
34:12understood he's like yeah I tried protesting it I don't think it's gonna
34:14work going home that's a wild scene like you think I felt watching it like
34:21oh we're out of the woods right like everybody's good and then but then you
34:26have this moment it's like whoa it's not over yet like and and there's this
34:31tension and this back-and-forth and it was like a visceral moment I was just
34:36like it's so awkward like I'm getting kind of like butterflies just thinking
34:39about it but that that is such a cool scene another part of this is the fact
34:45that they there were only in the squad you were covering two women yeah in the
34:51whole school they're only two in the whole school not even there were in not
34:55even in the other squads that you didn't follow correct so there were two women
34:58you you follow them one of them is a is a lieutenant lieutenant Eiler right and
35:04the other one is Norton I forget her rank she's a sergeant sergeant Norton
35:09okay so you're following the two of them and you're with Eiler one night in their
35:15camping section right and she's just you're filming her just kind of doing a
35:20light-hearted check-in interview and everything seems fine and then you know
35:26in your awesome awesome editing like like things change and then the voice
35:32over comes in and it's like shortly after we filmed with her Eiler was seen
35:36curled up on the ground what happened well yeah that's exactly what's going
35:41through my mind because I literally had filmed her and she was just checking in
35:44just kind of like you know checking because they were about to go do the ice
35:48wall and and then I turned around because they were cooking the breakfasts
35:51over there by the different stoves I was filming a little bit of that and then
35:55you know just kind of Spidey senses I look over my shoulder and there's kind
35:58of a group of people gathering around a person on the ground so I immediately
36:04whip my camera around and film it and I realized like that's Eiler I just talked
36:08to her and she was fine seemingly fine when I talked to her so you know I go
36:14over and film it and pretty quickly they escorted her to the susv and she was in
36:19the back of there's like a back area that they keep heated for emergencies
36:22and for medical things so I'm kind of asking around like what you know what
36:25was going on and nobody really knew and then one of the instructors came over
36:29and kind of filled me in but essentially the full story there is that they took
36:34her into the susv and you know warmed her up and then they brought her back
36:39outside of the susv to see if she could regulate regulate her own body
36:43temperature and from what I was told she was having a hard time maintaining her
36:47body temperature on her own she was just kind of chilled to the core and just
36:52exhausted because again they are rucking it's this is a physical school
36:56it's hard to tell because they're covered in all that gear and it's snowy
37:00and she you know just I think her body was just kind of done they think it was
37:05dehydrated so yeah she wasn't able to continue on with the course and the
37:10amount of time that she was going to need medically to recover she was gonna
37:15miss too much of the school to be able to continue training so she was dismissed
37:19and when she felt better taken to the airport Wow have you checked in I did I
37:25checked in with her she's okay she's back at Walter Reed and she's doing
37:30doing fine and made a full recovery so when Eiler left the course the only
37:37woman left in the course was sergeant Norton right and I love this part of the
37:42story and you know you ask her like what's it like being the only woman left
37:46and she sort of says that and she you can tell she's like disappointed that
37:52Eiler isn't there anymore because they were like the only two women in the
37:56course and they sort of had that that bond and you know she said that Eiler
38:00seemed to be a little bit more comfortable around this type of a group
38:04because she's a lieutenant has that like leadership experience after Eiler left
38:09what were your observations about Norton in the context of like that dynamic of
38:15her being the only woman left actually is really interesting so Norton is
38:19interesting the fact that she was one of the oldest people there she was 38 but
38:22she had some of the least experience she enlisted at 34 which is pretty wild so
38:28she's still kind of like figuring this all out and like and she was very clear
38:32about that and would talk to the other students she's like I you know I'm new
38:35to this like there's a lot of lingo I don't understand right whereas Eiler has
38:39been around for a long time and you know she has you know done a lot of training
38:45she's been stationed places and is very used to this kind of setup so I think
38:50that you know Norton although she was one of the older students was really
38:54kind of learning a lot from Eiler and connecting over that so I loved getting
38:58to watch the two of them and then eventually watch Norton cross the finish
39:02line watching this video there's all these shocking moments where people get
39:06cut and tension and all these things and scary moments like with lieutenant Eiler
39:10collapsing but one thing that sort of permeates this this documentary is humor
39:16it's a high-pressure environment they want to they want to pass they want to
39:19succeed they don't want to come back with their tail between their legs
39:22saying yeah I failed this test and got sent home early but there's like always
39:28this humor from day one all the way through the end what what can you say
39:34about that and especially in in the context of such a high-pressure serious
39:39environment I think that humor comes when the stakes are real there is real
39:45pressure from these soldiers to like not die they are dangling and they're taught
39:52this like even like on day four when they're going up the Castle Hill and the
39:57rappelling especially if they slip from that repel I mean the snow is kind of
40:01cushiony so they might have been okay but there's a chance they could be
40:03really harmed and then as the school goes on it's guaranteed if you fall
40:07you're dead so there is like a very real stakes to this but at the same time
40:12it's fun like they all chose to be here they want to learn mountain training so
40:19I think that there's there's kind of this dichotomy between the stakes and
40:23just enjoying the adventure of it that kind of you see these moments of humor
40:28where I mean these are just a bunch of guys who are just out in the snow like
40:34kids playing in the snow all day and that's essentially what the vibe was for
40:37most of these days there were other days or a little more stressful but they're
40:40just having fun the ranks were quickly kind of put to the side it's just a good
40:45group of people to they were just kind of fun well that's one of my favorite
40:48and funniest moments is when they like hit that obstacle that they weren't
40:52expecting and they're like send the major up there he's expendable and they
40:56start making cracks about oh your power your fonts in your PowerPoint
41:00presentation weren't up to snuff I just love that that's one of my favorite
41:04parts of working on this show is that humor that camaraderie you know busting
41:10each other's chops to sort of cut the tension because like they obviously have
41:13to take it seriously all the time but they can't like take themselves too
41:17seriously and I just I love seeing that I see it in most of the shoots that I do
41:22that's just sort of underlying like sense of humor that like makes it fun
41:27because it has to be right yeah there's like a culminating exercise called the
41:33mountain walk that was all it was all building to this but then the weather
41:38got so bad that that they didn't do it right and I've been at schools where
41:43stuff like this happens you know like you've got this big training event but
41:46then for one reason or another it just gets canceled this in this case it was
41:50like the culminating event of the school smugglers notch like that just sounds
41:55really cool describe like the level of disappointment that the students might
42:01have had to not have that experience and for you to not have your like big main
42:04event culminating exercise or were they relieved that they didn't have to do it
42:10well it depends on who you ask I think I think that you know I was pretty
42:16relieved and the reason for that is I was exhausted already I showed up there
42:20and my body was just beat and I and I show up and those first shots in that
42:25scene were the first things I filmed I just because I got there before anyone
42:29was there I pull up into the parking lot at the notch and no one's there so I
42:34film a little bit and then time goes on and I'm starting to wonder like did they
42:37cancel this and just not tell me and then I'm stuck because the roads are bad
42:41out there I'm like what am I gonna do this is like getting a little dangerous
42:44and I'm kind of like getting a little excited like maybe they canceled it
42:48maybe like we'll just do something back at the school and I'll just film that
42:51and we'll go from there and then all the sudden school bus shows up and I'm like
42:55oh all right this is this is happening this is for real and you know I have
42:59shots of them all walking up to the the base of the you know this big gully
43:05they're gonna go up and the snow is just sideways and blinding them yeah and
43:11honestly I was pumped I was like this is gonna look so cool yeah I don't know how
43:15I'm gonna do it but as long as I can get up to the top I'll be okay and like
43:20they were they were coming up with plans on how to make sure I got you know I was
43:24gonna go behind one squad to get like the underneath of them and then get
43:28there before my squad they had second squad go last so I'd be able to get in
43:31front of them to get all of them coming up so we're all ready to go and then we
43:36went in and did the avalanche transceivers yeah that is where shit got
43:41real that's what I want to ask you there's a scene in the piece where you
43:44turn the camera on yourself because avalanches are a real concern especially
43:49in this area and especially on a day like this with weather like this where
43:52at this point they think they're still gonna do it and they come up to you and
43:56they're like yeah Jake you're gonna need one of these devices also where this
44:00avalanche transceiver that essentially will tell people where you are if you
44:04get buried in an avalanche yeah that's like one of those moments in the movies
44:08where they're like you know you're probably wondering how I ended up here
44:11and that's one of those like well I got to do this I'm here this is the last
44:14thing as the guy says in the video this is the last thing we got to do and you
44:18know we've been here two weeks so I was pumped but then with that that came out
44:21I'm like oh this is real and a little like behind-the-scenes thing there was
44:24an avalanche there in that goalie in 2018 and I think it was the advanced
44:30course like four students and two instructors got swept up and including
44:34one of the instructors I filmed it's a very real thing and then on the news
44:37every day in like Colorado there were avalanches happening people were dying
44:40in avalanches and they put this on me and I'm seeing this wind and I'm seeing
44:44the snow come in but this is getting really real but I I trust these guys if
44:49there's anybody I'm gonna be with yeah during an avalanche I honestly feel
44:52pretty safe with this school yeah so I just kind of you know put my faith in
44:56them that it'd be okay so then I go back out and I'm filming all my second squad
45:01guys getting ready to go and they say hey we just heard the bad news we're not
45:03doing it what I was I was kind of bummed kind of relieved they were all pretty
45:10disappointed yeah because the hard stuff is over this is just physical stuff now
45:15for them yeah that's that's there that's what they do and now like you know how
45:20people they they like bust each other's chops and stuff like now they're gonna
45:24be people that graduate from mountain school and they're gonna be like oh how
45:27was your mountain walk and they're gonna be like oh we didn't do it the weather
45:30was too bad and they're gonna be like oh well then you didn't really graduate
45:33yeah yeah but again like that culminating event is not pass-fail it's
45:38yeah it's really just to show them what they can do with their new skills and
45:42it's it is going to be really strenuous yeah that argument can be made and but
45:46the instructors were telling me off-camera that that was one of the
45:49first times in the ten years they've been there that that walks been canceled
45:53there's only like a couple of times it's been canceled ever and that that's how
45:56serious it was and they want they wanted me to go film it because the visuals and
46:00that's how dangerous it was and you can see the footage that one of the
46:03instructors sent me from his phone like there were slaps and that you could like
46:07it looked like it could have gotten really bad so I'm so thankful that they
46:11called it and they still did some really cool stuff and just a much safer way
46:14after this whole process to two weeks in this environment doing everything that
46:21we've talked about that you had to do to make it happen get the shots tell the
46:26story what like physical emotional spiritual impacts did it have on you
46:33your body your soul your mind honestly there were pretty profound impacts I
46:38felt really accomplished because you know I had gone through all this and
46:43like from where I started on day one wearing my hiking boots and Patagonia
46:48coat to where I was day 14 where you know army fatigues and all of that
46:53spiritually I was really proud and I knew I had gotten something really good
46:57I had captured a really good story met some really great people and I got to
47:00tell their story physically there's a pretty drastic change too I had trained
47:05for a couple of months to get ready for this just to get in better shape but even
47:10then when I was there I ended up losing eight pounds why I was there and I was
47:15not cutting back on food it's just it was so physical that I couldn't keep up
47:20with the calories I was burning and right before graduation they have a like
47:25a scale in their gym and I decided to step on it cuz I could tell I had gone
47:30down a belt not or a belt yeah no no yeah I'd gone down and stepped on the
47:35scale and I was eight pounds lighter from just 14 days ago and again you know
47:40nothing well I mean sometimes you know you eat cliff bars out in the field but
47:44I was going to breweries at night and like I was eating pretty good and it's
47:47just the impact of how hard that training was really stuck out and there's
47:54like one of those were like I got to do the story right yeah cuz I put a lot on
47:58the line to tell the story I lost weight I got stronger and like I don't
48:04know I just it felt really good to get home that night it was Valentine's Day
48:08I see my wife and daughter and I was a good feeling well it's another thing
48:12about you you touch on it in the piece is that even though it's really cold
48:16you're moving a lot and you're you're moving up grades and there's a lot of
48:22sweat involved that you that you have to take into account in in terms of your
48:26clothes this the sweat can freeze freezing your hair I mean you how did
48:31that impact you it was so sweaty it which you don't think you don't think it
48:36would be when you're talking about being in the snowy mountains of Vermont and
48:39that's one of the big problems that I think you know like Isla ran into and
48:42other people run into is it's really hard to stay hydrated in the winter you
48:46know as opposed to the summer you're drinking water you know you need to yeah
48:49but you like when you're wearing that equic system you're wearing those layers
48:53it's pulling moisture out of your body you're climbing they're carrying 50
48:57pound packs on their back they need to be drinking a lot of water and it's
49:00really hard also because the water freezes there's a shot from day 8 where
49:07the sergeant majors water bottle was frozen he had to punch it to try to like
49:10be able to drink out of it my water bottle was freezing up so I was
49:13learning some tricks about how to wrap sweatshirts around my water bottle just
49:16so I could get a sip we're all wearing rented gear for the most part so by day
49:2014 it smelled like a football locker room after like a game it was stinky and
49:25grimy and a way that you wouldn't imagine in the winter because people are
49:29really you know sweating a lot yeah well Jake it's an awesome story an awesome
49:35piece and I mean the story behind the story like what it took to make it
49:39happen to get those shots to get up and down that terrain and get where you
49:45needed to be you know just dealing with all that plus being focused on telling
49:51the stories of these people and following along in this fast-paced
49:55training environment and adjusting and adapting being where you need to be
49:59making those like quick decisions it's just a it is a great achievement just
50:04from a production standpoint but the story itself I think it speaks for
50:08itself it's compelling it's there's action there's humor high stakes
50:14awkwardness tension I mean it's just got it all and I really think that I
50:18learned a lot watching it you learn about like the broader implications of
50:23like why they're training for it I would highly recommend hopefully you've
50:27watched it if you're watching this but I I'm really excited to have it out and
50:33proud of it and I'm just so glad you came back in one piece I'm glad the gear
50:38came back in one piece but Jake Jake Gabbard senior producer here at Business
50:43Insider on the boot camp team congrats and great job thank you