Before she picked up the Visionary Award at The Ivors 2025, Rebecca Lucy Taylor – aka Self Esteem – told NME about creating the 'world' of her new album 'A Complicated Woman', the pressures and doubts she faces as a female songwriter, surviving the industry, and what to expect from her tour
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00:00Rebecca, how are you doing today? I'm good, thank you, how are you? Alright, I'm fine. Welcome to the Ivers. What brings you here?
00:07I don't think I'm allowed to say it. I don't know, free dinner.
00:12They do a good pudding, I've been told. Oh yeah, a good pudding.
00:16But what does it mean to be here in that this is all about songwriting?
00:20Yeah, it means everything actually. That's the bit I care about loads and all the other bits.
00:24You sort of write a song and you create what you need to and then the industry, because it is an industry, you are a product, that song goes...
00:33You're like, oh no, the song's gone. That bit feels so pure and real and truthful and then all the other gobbins gets in the way and smashes your suite up every night of your life.
00:43So, with that being said, honouring the bit that is pure and true and I love and can't wait to do it again, I'm trying to think of what I mean.
00:53It's, it's, yeah, it's already, it's a compliment, complimenting something that I love. Hang on, I've asked it.
01:02The other day Guy Garvey was interviewing me, right, at the Ivers, and I thought, one of my favourite artists is just sat here telling me how good I am.
01:10Yeah. That was good.
01:11With his handsome bare face.
01:13Oh, I love myself.
01:14But have you felt more of a pressure to prove yourself as a songwriter as well as be a pop star as well as be everything else?
01:20Yeah, I think I can't, like, I think still I'm not to start being going on about women like I always do, but like, I do think people don't think women write songs.
01:29Like, I still get, you still get to question, people think about like writer's caps and all these things.
01:33Also, no judgement if you do do that, but like, I'm, I, it's really art. And I take ages over it. And it's sort of ruined my life. Like I have, but all I do is like, think about writing songs and try and, try and create their art I need to and then for it to be sort of assumed I haven't.
01:48The older I get, the more tired I am and the more I can't be arsed to whinge about it.
01:55To be, for someone to notice and care and tell me I'm good at it, it's like, yeah, it's like, oh, thank God for that.
02:03And how have you found the process of birthing a complicated woman? It's its own world. You had a theatre show, you had, it's everything, isn't it?
02:09Yes, it was all in there, unfortunately, so it had to come out. Yeah, brilliant, big risk, took a big risk.
02:15My life show is now very expensive. So, I was ashamed, I did that to myself, but no, legacy stuff really.
02:22I was like, you've done that now, you've, and I know what the next thing is and I know, you know, and the more I, the more I, the closer we get like what's in here out to exactly what it, what it looked like in there,
02:35is the, you know, every step of that is closer to me being like peaceful. So, yeah, I was very proud of it.
02:42And the tour dates that are coming, are they going to be full on theatre, everything?
02:46Yeah, to the best of my ability with touring venues down the country, yes.
02:51But you've talked about the need to diversify, I mean, what can you tell us about how difficult it is to survive as an artist, singer-songwriter at the moment?
02:58You know my answer. It's impossible. You've got to hope that they pay you to hold a bottle of shampoo, don't you?
03:05Which I hope someone will do. Come on.
03:08Nice hat.
03:09Yeah, like I said, it's like, it's, it's a different game, but I entered, you know, I came into an industry that was long gone in terms of being fair to an artist's workload.
03:18Like work versus what's in your bank account. Like, I never was in something plentiful, so.
03:24Yeah.
03:25Kind of have to go like tough shit, you've just got to do it. And also, I play, I don't compromise at all.
03:31I do what I can handle whilst trying to have a career. I want a roofer over my head, I want, you know, I want to buy my mum and dad a camera back.
03:37Nice mat.
03:38But at least you've got love from...
03:39It will seal me whole in full shape.
03:40But that doesn't mean I'm not a great...
03:42But at least you've got love from Madonna, right?
03:43Oh yeah.
03:44Hey, maybe she can give me a moment.
03:47Yeah, that was amazing.