- 5/24/2025
The All-American Rejects take Billboard’s Tetris Kelly to Lil Dom’s in Los Feliz to talk about making new music again after 13 years and what brought them back, going on their first stadium tour with the Jonas Brothers, their craziest tour stories and things thrown on stage. They also get into AI and music and how they think the rock genre will accept it, the resurgence in popularity of rock music, and music’s ability to distract us from the stresses of life. They wrap up the conversation with a little Billboard story time about their single “Dirty Little Secret.”
Are you excited for The All-American Rejects new music? Let us know in the comments below!
Are you excited for The All-American Rejects new music? Let us know in the comments below!
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MusicTranscript
00:00It's easy to feel like an All-American reject in your late teens.
00:04At the time we were like, yeah that's cool, and then like two years later we're like, what a fucking terrible band name.
00:08Twenty-some years later, I'm like, I wear it as a badge of courage.
00:12They said they were fans, and we're the kind of people who are like, they don't like us, they don't even know who we are.
00:17Pop music is probably geared toward accepting AI way more than rock and roll.
00:22Concert atmosphere is a non-denominational church.
00:26Come worship with us because the fucking shit's going down in flames anyways.
00:40So what brought us here, Why Little Domes?
00:42It's a neighborhood staple for me. I lived in Los Feliz for like about a decade before I moved away from LA.
00:47The staff here are like, kind of like, you know, they know my name.
00:52I almost got a plaque.
00:53These are cheers, basically.
00:54I almost got a plaque. They do plaques in booths.
00:57During COVID, my wife and I would get this sandwich here that was, anyway, I won't go into details about it.
01:02But they were like, we're going to put you a plaque up.
01:05And then all of a sudden, like, we went away for like two years.
01:08And you lost your plaque?
01:09I lost the punch card, like, just disappeared.
01:13Well, now you got to start back coming again so you can earn that trust again.
01:16This gets us big stripes.
01:18Listen, you brought Billboard here, so you're doing a good job.
01:21Putting them on the map.
01:22And I feel like you said that, you know, Little Domes is a place you love for Sunday brunch.
01:26So what is your go-to menu item on the Sunday brunch menu?
01:30Oh, before I became gluten-free, they have this pizza that has, it's got salmon.
01:41This is like, it's kind of blasphemous, right?
01:43It's like cheese and fish, but it's salmon and capers, smoked salmon.
01:49Yeah, sorry.
01:49So like, yeah, lox and capers and onions.
01:53And then I make it even more bizarre and I have them crack two eggs on top of it.
01:58Oh.
02:00So yeah, it's like this sexy, brekkie.
02:02That is a breakfast pizza right there.
02:04Yeah, that's right.
02:05Awesome.
02:05Yeah, it's great.
02:06I've really grown to love the salmon thing at breakfast.
02:10Who develops an egg allergy at 39?
02:14Oh my goodness.
02:16An egg allergy?
02:18Yikes.
02:19You got to do that thing where they poke you with eggs until you aren't allergic anymore.
02:23I wouldn't be able to do that.
02:25Sometimes they don't need to poke you.
02:26Sometimes your body just gives you a reckoning.
02:30And if All-American Rejects was a Little Domes dessert, what would it be?
02:35Tiramisu.
02:36I may have developed an egg allergy, but I did just start liking tiramisu at the age of 42.
02:41So it's an exciting time in my life.
02:43Speaking of hanging with Billboard, I do want to start this interview by asking,
02:45what's your Billboard moment?
02:46When you think about us, what do you think about?
02:48The moment you hit the chart, it could be past, present, future.
02:51What's your Billboard moment?
02:53I do remember when Gives You Hell was number one on Billboard.
03:02We had just gone around the world supporting that album,
03:05and we landed in Hawaii for the last show and to celebrate and take a break with a week off.
03:10But I was so freaking sick.
03:14And so when the plane landed and I saw on my phone, it was like a sidekick or something,
03:17it was in 2008, that the song was finally number one.
03:21I was like, awesome.
03:22I just want to sleep.
03:24On your week off in Hawaii, and you're sick, and you find out your song's number one.
03:28Yep.
03:28Well, that was a hell of a song, if I could say so myself.
03:31What about you?
03:31I remember we did four shows with Bon Jovi, opening the Prudential Center in Jersey.
03:38The one time he sat down with us at catering, he's like a very calculated businessman.
03:44He let us open because he had done some sort of analytics on us.
03:48Oh, Bon Jovi.
03:49And he said, hey man, Big Ear, four top tens.
03:53And I knew he was referring to the Billboard charts.
03:55So for me, that was a really cool moment where I was like, oh, wow, this guy's super calculated,
04:04but also, yeah, he knows that our shit doesn't stink.
04:07So, it was cool.
04:15New music's here.
04:16You just dropped a video for Sandbox.
04:18When you were creating the Sandbox video, the song, how do you feel about your fans,
04:23even, that are wanting old sound, but maybe wanting to try something new?
04:26How did you take that approach?
04:27We put out four records in the first decade of our career.
04:30And each time, we took our time to push ourselves and challenge ourselves,
04:35and in turn, challenging our fans to kind of grow up with us.
04:39And then, we didn't release much music for the next decade.
04:43So now, we're in a much different place than we were had we just put out a record a couple years ago.
04:48So, I think naturally, we're going to present differently.
04:53And if we were just going to make more songs that sounded like they could go on Move Along
04:58or next to It Gives You Hell, like...
05:00That would just be weird.
05:02That would be more of a corporate machine kind of move.
05:06We've never gone about it that way.
05:07So, I think whatever we're offering right now is us right now.
05:11And hopefully, some people have been waiting for that.
05:16I mean, it's been 13 years since you guys dropped a record.
05:20This is your fifth studio album.
05:21I mean, they definitely had to wait a little while.
05:24I think a lot of them didn't even think that maybe you guys would make music again.
05:27We didn't think we would either.
05:28We weren't waiting.
05:30I think it's more just like, this is a pleasant surprise for people who might not have ever expected anything else.
05:36It was not the time.
05:37You know, there was a moment where we played a festival in Vegas.
05:42And it was one of these sort of heritage festivals with the whole scene.
05:47We were just kind of taking a piss on the whole thing because we thought it was just going to be a big shit show.
05:51And we're like, yeah, we're the Rejects.
05:53That's sort of like a brand that has followed us into our philosophy of the expectations of what this band accomplishes.
06:01That's just a clever name.
06:02We were never the culture.
06:04We were never the black eyeliner and the uniform of emo.
06:09We were four kids from Oklahoma in like vintage tees and low-rise skinny jeans.
06:14And when we played shows, people didn't look like us.
06:17The music was the only thing that ever did anything for us.
06:21Having such a distance between our last record, it was like, oh yeah, man, maybe some kids will be out there to sing the songs that they know.
06:28And we were playing up against Paramore and like Death Cab for Cutie.
06:31And there was fucking 30,000 people in front of us singing.
06:35And that was the biggest thing.
06:36It was so jarring after all these years to play that show.
06:40And I remember just going, holy shit, I can hear this crowd through my in-ears.
06:44Not just singing the hits, they were singing like every song we played.
06:48Being on the stage, you think about being in the crowd as a music listener.
06:50You're like, oh, I can't wait to see this band.
06:52I was like, I can't believe I got to see this crowd.
06:54That's so awesome.
06:55Yeah.
06:56And that sort of like was a juggernaut moment that was like jarring and kind of put a little lead in our pencils again.
07:03I mean, it's a testament to your career and what you guys have created that the fans want to come and see you guys sing.
07:08And I mean, you're going to be singing with the Jonas Brothers, which I think is awesome.
07:12So tell me, how the heck did that come together?
07:14They were fans is what we kind of heard internally when we moved to agencies.
07:18It was like, oh, the JoBros are really big fans and they were toying with the idea.
07:25Those guys, that's a big machine over there, the JoBros camp.
07:28So I think they, you know, when they put out a lot of feelers, they're just like, hey, would this be a thing?
07:33And it was like two years ago, I think, when we first started.
07:36We've been hearing of the idea for a long time.
07:38I know our manager, Megan, has been working really hard to like make it a real thing.
07:43But yeah, you know, I mean, they said they were fans and, you know, we're the kind of people who are like, they don't like us.
07:48Like, they don't even know who we are.
07:49But then, you know, we met them and they're their sweethearts.
07:52And it's going to be a really fun tour.
07:54And it'll be our first stadium shows, which is a while to think about.
08:00I mean, I was telling you I'm a pop music guy.
08:01So I have to ask you, do you have a favorite JoBros song?
08:05I wasn't really aware of them much until like the more recent stuff.
08:09The new stuff, like Sucker and everything.
08:11Yeah, I dig it.
08:12I really like their solo stuff.
08:13Like, I love the Nick Jonas stuff.
08:15Oh, that was good.
08:16And I love the, I think it's Joe.
08:19Joe has the DNCE.
08:26That shit's great, dude.
08:27Like, they played it at this activation we did in Jersey with them for the announcement.
08:32And I was just like, this song fucking slaps.
08:35Like, yeah, their solo shit's dope.
08:37But they have a congregation that they play to.
08:40It's very, there is a praise and worship of that.
08:43A praise and worship of the JoBros.
08:45Of the brothers Jonas.
08:46Yes.
08:47You guys have toured a lot.
08:49And I know you got some stories in there.
08:50So like, what's one of the craziest things that has happened, like, on tour with the fans?
08:54Something somebody threw at you on stage?
08:55Or it's just a weird moment you think back to?
08:57Like, billboard appropriate.
09:00Who said we're not rated G here, you know?
09:03Oh, man, there was some raw shit that happened.
09:06Like, I remember somebody, like, you know, would leave feminine products that were probably used
09:11hanging on the fucking...
09:12And maybe that's very tribal.
09:14That's something.
09:15It's like, it's like marking your, it's very alpha female.
09:18Like, kind of...
09:19Wasn't expecting that over a meal.
09:21Is that a thing?
09:22It always weirded me out when one shoe would land on the stage.
09:26And you're just like, somebody's going home with one shoe.
09:28Going home, calling their Uber.
09:29Well, it wasn't an Uber back then.
09:30No Uber back then.
09:32But going home with one shoe.
09:33It's funny, like, that the thing you remember, you're like,
09:35remember that show in Philly, The Shoe?
09:38You're like, yeah, I always wonder what happened to that other shoe.
09:43Oh my goodness.
09:44You were talking about the pressing of your first album.
09:46Like, do you remember Swing Swing and that moment that it was for you guys?
09:50Like, the first time you heard it on the radio?
09:52You know, when that was a thing.
09:54Yeah, I'm the one with the good first time on the radio story.
09:56It's, uh...
09:57But actually, I always tell it.
09:59What's your first time you heard Swing Swing?
10:01I don't know.
10:01On the radio?
10:03No?
10:03I don't know.
10:04Angel Palmer.
10:05I can't beat yours.
10:07Angel Palmer was like this, uh, was this high school cheerleader.
10:11Uh, you know, like, look, I'm...
10:14Let me just be frank.
10:16You can always be frank.
10:17Any band that makes it out of high school was not cool.
10:21Like, the reason they had time to go in the garage was because
10:25nobody was really their friends except for the other people in their band.
10:28They didn't play sports, so they weren't like,
10:31varsity bros in the hallway.
10:33These are the people that probably had collections of D&D
10:37and trading cards and, you know, rolled the 20-sided die.
10:41So, Angel Palmer was this senior beauty cheerleader.
10:47And so, the summer after we graduated, I graduated,
10:50Angel Palmer was at a party.
10:52And, uh, and we were kind of popping off very slightly.
10:56I was like, there's Angel Palmer.
10:58And she comes up to me.
11:00And she starts talking to me.
11:01Oh, you're feeling yourself now.
11:03And this is...
11:03I've had one girlfriend in my life up to this point.
11:06And I was like, whoa.
11:08Like, it was like very, uh, can't hardly wait for me.
11:11I was like, up, up, up.
11:12And she's like, just get in the car, honey.
11:14And I was like, oh, my God, this is like a madam.
11:17Like, she was, she, she was, she was, she was practiced.
11:24So, she took me home.
11:25As we get into the garage, shit you not, you couldn't, it's like poetry.
11:30The song comes on.
11:31No.
11:32And it was the first time I heard it.
11:33It was like, literally, DJ Bumper,
11:36here's the All-American Rejects with their hot new song.
11:39She's like, and I looked over at her and I just saw her melt.
11:43And I was like, this is happening.
11:47And I remember I walked into her house and her sister was a migrant.
11:50And she was sitting there.
11:51I was like, what's up, Ashley?
11:56Iconic.
11:57And that's Amore.
11:58That's amazing, man.
12:00I mean, you guys have been on such a journey since then.
12:02You were with Interscope.
12:03So, how has everything changed?
12:04Got a great team around us.
12:06Great distribution and, you know, stuff like that.
12:09But as far as, like, what we had become used to, you know,
12:14that first decade of our career, like, those resources are no longer there.
12:18You know, so we're recording everything ourselves.
12:21We're paying for everything ourselves.
12:23I think, in turn, that makes us all a lot more focused and motivated, of course.
12:30But just, like, there's a lot more pride in it now, I think,
12:33when we're involved in every aspect of it.
12:36As opposed to just, you know, showing up and, you know,
12:38the label made some fucking sign or something.
12:41And we're like, oh, that's...
12:42And we didn't approve it.
12:43Yeah, I know.
12:43That picture's terrible.
12:45Why did you guys do this?
12:45Why are we at a sunglasses hut today?
12:48Yeah.
12:50Like, really whack shit.
12:51Don't do sunglasses hut like that.
12:52No, no, no.
12:53Hey, wear the sunglasses.
12:56Don't do signings at sunglasses huts.
12:58Did we ever do that?
12:59Come on.
12:59That didn't come from nowhere.
13:00Yeah, no.
13:01That's a lived experience right there.
13:03That was a memory right there.
13:05You've picked a good time because I feel like,
13:07obviously, there has been kind of a resurgence
13:10of the love of pop, punk music, rock music.
13:13Have you guys noticed that and seen, like,
13:14how the public has been reacting?
13:16Yeah, I think, you know, now that Spotify is, like,
13:2020 years old, I think we're seeing, like,
13:24this correlation where music is evergreen
13:27more than it used to be because now the radio
13:30you and I used to go through was, like,
13:33current pop hits, hits of yesterday, country.
13:37And, like, that was it, right?
13:38Like, but Spotify is this just blanket landscape
13:43where a kid can be listening to some current,
13:47I don't know, heavy metal song,
13:49and then Ozzy, Crazy Train comes on.
13:52I'm going after it, baby, crazy train.
13:56And it's digested as if it's in the same
13:59relevant time period because they don't go,
14:02here's a song from 1976.
14:04Right.
14:04Or you're not listening to the oldies station or something.
14:06And kids go, holy fuck, have you heard of this band,
14:09this guy, Black Sabbath?
14:11And it's new to them.
14:14So I think just for our music to be showcased
14:18in that format, I think, you know,
14:20yeah, they don't pay for shit,
14:21but the beautiful thing is it keeps it alive.
14:25And, you know, everybody likens it to,
14:28oh, well, everybody is comforted by nostalgia.
14:30I think it's just authenticity in music right now.
14:34You're really kind of watching this juggernaut
14:38of how pop music is funneled into the masses.
14:42And it's so much, it's so refined with social media
14:47and just the way they can analyze
14:48and monetize every aspect of it
14:50that I think there's a large portion of people now
14:53that are gravitating to just wanting something
14:56that feels like it wasn't force fucked in their face.
15:00By the man, and I think the next 10 years
15:05for rock music is going to be so definitive
15:08of what people in 50 years will look back as,
15:12I mean, you know, I think we're gonna have another Beatles
15:15come out of our, this next decade,
15:17because I just think rock and roll is pure,
15:22it's authentic, and it's visceral,
15:24and it's often correlating with the disparity
15:29of our culture, and we are in a very,
15:32we are in dark times, but the music is always the light
15:37that takes us out of it, so I think, yeah,
15:39we're happy to be a flicker of a nice, low-wattage LED.
15:43Well, I mean, you said it's not nostalgia,
15:45and I wanna agree with that,
15:46because I feel like a lot of the people
15:48discovering your music, like you said, are younger fans,
15:50and you see Green Day having a resurgence, you guys,
15:52and I think what was a funny meme to me,
15:55you kind of brought it up
15:55when you were talking about the garage,
15:57is somebody tweeted something like,
15:59what happened to white guys in their garage?
16:01They're not making music like that anymore.
16:03And it's like, where are the people that,
16:05where are the white guys in the garage
16:06making the good jams, you know what I mean?
16:08They don't exist, so people are looking back
16:10to artists like you that have that sound.
16:12Why do you feel like that sound
16:13hasn't necessarily pushed through?
16:16I don't think it hasn't necessarily pushed through.
16:18I think it's been, like, dissolved into a fucking,
16:23I know some of these kids that are those creators,
16:26but the fucking TikTok world has, like,
16:28kids that are TikTok stars that go,
16:31yo, check this out, bro, I'm making music now.
16:34And it's like, well, they see it
16:36as just a division of their content.
16:39We did a show in Clemson last weekend,
16:41and I was like, hey, man,
16:42rock and roll was not born on TikTok.
16:46You know, it was born in the basements,
16:48it was born on the budgets of parents, you know,
16:51cursing their children for making the noise.
16:54I think rock and roll, like I said,
16:56pop is waiting for rock and roll to be embraced again.
16:59And I think there are great artists out there
17:00that are starting to bleed through.
17:02I just know that something's gonna bust open in 2025.
17:04Dude, people are really pushing the sound,
17:07even the look, what do you think of the style,
17:08like the way people dress?
17:09Like, even people are bringing back that look,
17:11like a bit more of that, like, emo look.
17:13Grungy emo.
17:14Yeah, grungy emo look.
17:15I saw, like, a meme about, like,
17:16one of the BTS guys is doing a rock album,
17:19and everybody was like, I can't believe he's knocking on 40,
17:22but having an emo phase.
17:24It's like, no, an emo phase is in all of us.
17:27I think all of us went through it,
17:28and that style is coming back again.
17:30Yeah, it's always interesting.
17:32I hear bootcut pants are back again, too.
17:34Which I was excited about.
17:35Yeah.
17:38But yeah, I mean, I think seeing kids exploring,
17:43you know, whether it's that era of dressing
17:45or just playing instruments again,
17:46like, I think why we haven't heard rock music,
17:51good rock music in a long time,
17:52is because kids aren't playing together
17:54in their garages anymore.
17:56But now, you know, you're starting to see that,
17:58even if it's on TikTok sometimes,
18:00you're starting to see that again.
18:02And it's kids just, you know, having fun together
18:05and exploring that, and not just sitting
18:07in front of a computer at a coffee shop
18:09thinking they're making music.
18:10Pushing a space bar, being like,
18:11I'm a DJ, this is time.
18:13Space.
18:17Speaking of, you know, technology, TikTok, all that stuff,
18:19let's talk about current events a little bit.
18:21AI.
18:23How are you guys feeling?
18:24I've had a lot of fun with it.
18:25I made an action figure version of myself the other day.
18:28Like, everybody else in the world did.
18:29The action figure thing is such a thing.
18:31I didn't even know where that came from.
18:32Thank you, Italian waitress.
18:33But yeah, now it's like, I didn't even,
18:38I'm now the old guy, because I was like,
18:39why did we start making action figures of ourselves?
18:42But everybody's doing that.
18:42It's like the fad of the week.
18:44Actually, I just downloaded ChatGPT
18:45because it's a great mixologist.
18:48I'm just like, make me a cocktail
18:50with rye whiskey and Campari.
18:53I never thought of this.
18:54You know, whatever.
18:55And it spits it out immediately, and it's always fantastic.
18:59Okay, doing that this afternoon.
19:00As far as the creative side of shit,
19:02I haven't really thought about it that much.
19:04I just don't want to scare myself.
19:05But as far as the, you know,
19:07making action figures and cocktails.
19:08So you guys haven't seen anybody
19:10like remix one of your songs,
19:12or use your voices in AI?
19:15Oh, no, no, I haven't.
19:18I think in, yeah, 10 years,
19:20it'll probably be a super viable source of pop music.
19:24I think pop music is probably geared
19:26toward accepting AI way more than rock and roll.
19:30Remember when everybody was doing the holograms?
19:32That was a thing.
19:33It did not jump off.
19:33Like the posthumous holograms.
19:35Whitney Houston, Michael Jackson.
19:36Yeah, I mean, AI's here to stay.
19:38I'm sure it's not going anywhere.
19:39We'll get a new ABBA record for their hologram tour.
19:41Right, for the hologram tour.
19:43Yeah, I mean, Queen just sold their likenesses
19:46and catalogs, so I imagine there's gonna be
19:49more Queen music and probably a Queen tour
19:53with their new music and their old hits.
19:56Let's all fucking jump in the dumpster fire.
19:58I mean, you were talking about TikTok.
20:01How do you feel like social media has changed music?
20:03Is it helping?
20:04Because artists are getting a direct connection
20:06to their fans, right?
20:07You're able to constantly talk to them,
20:09share information with them.
20:11But also, I mean, it's opened the world up
20:12to everybody's a musician.
20:14I think it's incredible.
20:15I think it's the world.
20:16The world is beautiful.
20:17The world is terrible.
20:18The world is frightening.
20:21And the world is ultimately, will be,
20:25no matter what you wanna do about it.
20:27Social media is and will be forever.
20:31I think social media has made dynasties out of artists
20:34where instead of, it was just about like this,
20:38it was just as simple as go to the show,
20:41wanna be who's on stage,
20:44wanna not know any of their human experience
20:46because that humanizes somebody that I've seized.
20:51All the music I love, they were gods, you know?
20:54I don't like the humanizing aspect of social media.
20:56Yeah, you have to learn how to like
20:58set your own boundaries with that
20:59because now it is something,
21:01it's a great tool to connect with your fans
21:04and get feedback from your fans.
21:05But also, it's a double-edged sword
21:10because in the end of the day,
21:11we've always done this for us.
21:13Love our fans to come along and grow with us,
21:16but you don't want to let down the velvet rope too much
21:19or be influenced too much by too many cooks, I guess.
21:23Opinions, a lot of cooks.
21:24I mean, the fans are definitely cooks now,
21:26I think, with every artist.
21:28They wanna be A&R, they're telling you.
21:29Yeah, I mean, that being said,
21:30I definitely did like a thirst trap TikTok video
21:33like two days ago.
21:34And it was like the most successful TikTok we ever had.
21:37Fuck my life, right?
21:38Like, oh my God.
21:39Well, you still got it, man.
21:40You're putting a thirst trap out and it's working,
21:42so be proud of yourself for that.
21:43Gotta get them titties out, girl.
21:44Gotta get them titties out.
21:46And I mean, I wanna talk to you too
21:48about like how social media has also made everybody,
21:50you said, you know, humanization,
21:52have to kind of share their opinions a lot.
21:54And this is a crazy political atmosphere
21:56and you guys make rock music,
21:57which is obviously a lot of times
21:59been a voice of political activation.
22:01So how do you feel like in a year like this
22:03and what we're experiencing
22:04having to make music and put music out?
22:07I said this last night, I was like,
22:08I feel like we're the band that played on
22:11at the dinner on the Titanic.
22:13No, not those guys.
22:14So like, what the fuck does it matter what we think, man?
22:17We're just here to go down with the ship.
22:19And we're honestly, if anything,
22:20we're just a look at the birdie
22:21for the rest of everybody else.
22:23I'm like, you know, everybody's bagged
22:25on everybody going to space already.
22:26They really did.
22:27It's a big giant.
22:29I think we live in distraction.
22:30We, as Americans, we have rested so much
22:35on needing the comfort of distraction
22:38to keep our anxieties at bay.
22:42And like, I'm not going to fix the world.
22:45So if we can be there to be your respite
22:47from the anxieties of the world,
22:51a concert atmosphere is a non-denominational church.
22:55And, you know, come worship with us
22:57because the fucking shit's going down in flames anyway.
23:01So that's a little gallows.
23:04Yeah, actually, I swear to God
23:07in a year and a half sunshine,
23:08the sun will peek through the clouds
23:11and everything's going to be okay.
23:12It is, it's going to be perfect.
23:14After we finish this meal,
23:15there's probably going to be some beautiful bill of change
23:17that makes everybody happy.
23:19I can't wait.
23:20I can't wait for it too, man.
23:25And then I want to talk to you guys
23:26a little bit about your personal life
23:27before we get out of here.
23:28Like, what's the one of the biggest sacrifices
23:29you ever made for music?
23:30My 20s.
23:31Oh, wow.
23:32That is an answer.
23:34That's good.
23:36But I mean, but being in a band during your 20s
23:39is like something I feel like a lot of people
23:40in their 20s wish they had.
23:41Oh, it was fantastic.
23:42Sure, sure.
23:43In doing that, it's very hard to leave your 20s.
23:46You live in them for quite a while after that.
23:47Also true, also true.
23:49But no, you know, yes, it was, you know,
23:51the first decade of our career,
23:53there were a lot of sacrifices, like personally.
23:55That's certainly what I chose, you know,
23:58and I'm extremely happy with all of my choices
24:01and where it's led me and where it's led us,
24:03you know, now entering our 40s.
24:06So I wouldn't change it.
24:08Don't regret nothing.
24:09And what's one of the most un-rockstar things
24:11you do on tour?
24:12I'm a big proponent of creature comforts.
24:16When I'm on the road, I bring my own pillow.
24:19Keep going.
24:20I make, I have a pour-over coffee rig.
24:23Yeah, that lives in a road case.
24:24It does have a road case.
24:26I don't trust venue coffee or catering coffee
24:29or, this was good coffee, though, like this.
24:32Um, it's a mean cup of coffee.
24:34Yeah, and oftentimes, if you're playing, like,
24:36an amphitheater or something like that,
24:38like, you're nowhere near anything, period.
24:41So you're kind of left to your own devices.
24:43And now I'm at the age where I have to move.
24:46I can't just be a slob and sleep till three
24:48in the afternoon every day, you know, until soundcheck.
24:50Like, wake up early, get the workout kit out,
24:53swing the kettlebells around and that shit.
24:55Okay.
24:56I just like to sit down to a nice meal after a show.
25:00Well, as we are doing now.
25:01I love that.
25:02And I mean, what are some of the things
25:03you guys are passionate about outside of music?
25:05Like, what's a cause that you support?
25:07I do these little paper plate portraits
25:13for Action Against Hunger that I donate my money to.
25:16I just draw, like, doodles on paper plates.
25:20I was selling prints of my art.
25:21I'm a painter as well.
25:23And my prints, I was donating all my money
25:27to this woman who was creating an autism school program
25:32for autistic children when they become mature enough
25:37to be involved in the workforce.
25:39And there's really no programs to teach them how to,
25:42like, you know, I think she built a simulated coffee shop
25:46so they could practice serving.
25:48Oh, wow.
25:49I support whatever causes I can that I care about.
25:52I'm a, yeah, that's my, that's my, that floats my boat.
25:58Nice.
25:59I mean, you, oh, and look what we have.
26:01Look at that.
26:02Shut the front door.
26:03Oh, no.
26:04Oh, my goodness.
26:07You guys are amazing.
26:09Well, now, I actually want to ask this question.
26:11I'm sure you've been asked this before,
26:13but what is an all-American region?
26:16We're boys from Oklahoma that were in their,
26:19actually, you know what?
26:20We started as a two-piece.
26:22And when Nick and I were 14 and 15,
26:26we started playing in the college bar.
26:28We only got to do that
26:29because nobody else in town played cover songs.
26:33Like, I was thinking about that.
26:34I was like, how the fuck did we get to do that?
26:36There weren't any really kids, other kids in bands,
26:39or at least motivated enough to be in a band serious enough
26:43to practice and play shows either.
26:44So, like, it was kind of just us.
26:47And Oklahoma is this beautiful, confused South
26:50in that it's very Midwestern.
26:52We have biscuits and gravy,
26:54but we don't have grits and collard greens.
26:57Like, we're not-
26:58Oh, we gotta fix that.
26:59We're not, I know, right?
27:00We're not, like, Southern in that aspect.
27:02And also, you know, not to get heavy,
27:04but, like, the Trail of Tears ended in Native America.
27:08You know, that was where a large group
27:10of very spiritual people were sequestered to be.
27:16And I think bigotry and all these assumptions
27:18about the South sometimes that trickle into,
27:21especially the coasts of assuming,
27:22oh, you're from Alabama, hmm.
27:25But Oklahoma bucks a lot of those,
27:28and the hospitality there is incredible.
27:30And it's also where everything kind of funnels
27:33to the middle of the toilet, you know?
27:38And so it's easy to feel like an all-American reject
27:42in your late teens.
27:44And I think, at the time, we were like, yeah, that's cool.
27:49And then, like, two years later, we were like,
27:50what a fucking terrible band name.
27:52And then now, like, 20-some years later,
27:55I'm like, I wear it as a badge of courage.
27:58And yeah, I think we wouldn't have stayed together
28:01if we were from fucking Chicago or some big city.
28:03We would've been like, bro, I just died of,
28:07I don't know, heroin overdose.
28:09Like, big cities would've corrupted this band.
28:11So yeah, Oklahoma is the all-American reject
28:14of, I think, the United States,
28:17because I met Pete Rose once, and he's like,
28:22he's that criminal baseball player
28:23who bet on his own games, if you don't know.
28:30And I was like, I was so excited
28:32because I was getting him a baseball sign.
28:33I was like, Pete Rose.
28:34And he's like, hey, where are you from, kid?
28:37And I go, Oklahoma.
28:37He goes, ah, you know, a bird don't even shit in Oklahoma.
28:42And I was like, I was like,
28:43everybody just bags on Oklahoma.
28:45Like, still to this day, I'm like, I'm from Oklahoma.
28:47He goes, oh, wow, covered wagons still, huh?
28:51Indoor plumbing?
28:51I mean, I'm not gonna lie to you.
28:52My head went, lowest rated in the country in education.
28:56You know, two out of four marriages will fail.
29:00We have our stigmas, but man, it's a decent place.
29:06Great for a family.
29:07It's a place.
29:09Nothing you haven't been thinking about.
29:11It's a state, isn't it?
29:12I don't know how close you were to this place.
29:13I've only driven through Oklahoma one time.
29:15That's what everybody says.
29:16Everybody says they've driven through it.
29:17Henrietta?
29:18I drove through a city called Henrietta
29:20and we stopped at a restaurant
29:21called Henrietta's Pig Out Palace.
29:23And it was literally pigs in the front yard.
29:25Oh, great.
29:26Did you meet it before it was butchered?
29:29This is bacon.
29:30He will be your bacon.
29:32Amazing.
29:35Guys, we got dessert to dig into here.
29:37I do want to play a little game with our dessert.
29:40All right, guys.
29:41So, he's in Tiramisu, my friend.
29:44He's in Tiramisu.
29:45You have to spit it out if you get the question.
29:47That's the game.
29:48It's called Baby Bird.
29:50Now, you guys' song, Dirty Little Secret,
29:53ranked at number 24 on our staff's best songs of 2005 list.
29:57And it peaked at number nine on the Hot 100.
29:59How many is on the list, if I may ask?
30:01Did you have 100 for that?
30:02Probably 100.
30:04You were in 24.
30:05I was gonna say, if it was top 50,
30:07I'd be like, cool, that feels right.
30:09You know, like a good C plus.
30:10I think we do 50 on those lists.
30:12I'd have to double check.
30:13Yeah, okay, cool.
30:1350 or 100.
30:14That feels right, very mid.
30:16But I want you to actually read this blurb.
30:19He called himself mid.
30:21Can you read this blurb?
30:22Since its release in June 2005,
30:25Dirty Little Secret has become a pop-punk anthem
30:27celebrated for its musical energy and urgent lyrics
30:30about the thrill of a secret romance.
30:32Bouncing mystery with excitement,
30:34the song captures the personal and rebellious rush
30:37of a hidden connection.
30:38It's more about the fun and intensity
30:40rather than the deep guilt or deception of two individuals.
30:43Was this written by AI?
30:44And it remains relatable across generations,
30:46offering a glimpse into the personal experiences
30:49artists often keep hidden.
30:51This was written by AI.
30:52No, that was the blurb in the article.
30:54Oh, yeah, but you guys are now sourcing out, right?
30:56No, this was in 2005.
30:58No, that's crazy.
31:00Who wrote that deep, lyrical dissection
31:04of a song that was written on my floor?
31:08Well, you wrote...
31:09Stoned, for sure.
31:10Well, I mean, obviously it affected a lot of people
31:12in a great way. That's so cool.
31:13So now I want to know a little story time
31:15about the track, about the video, about the album.
31:18Yeah, the track started as sort of a joke
31:20that I was chasing my girlfriend around
31:22singing the chorus with at the time.
31:23Nick turned it into a rendition
31:26that literally had like a country bounce.
31:28It was like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
31:31It was like the 20th or 30th song we wrote for that album.
31:35Wow, really?
31:36At that point, we were just like churning out
31:39these little acoustic versions of demos.
31:41I was like, please be good.
31:41I don't want to fucking work at Blockbuster.
31:43Yeah.
31:45So, I mean, at that point, it was just another track
31:47that we'll probably never see the light of day.
31:49When we all got together for pre-production
31:52to kind of work up songs as a full band,
31:54that was like at the bottom of the list.
31:56And we just kept not approaching it, not approaching it.
31:59And then I think it was Howard Benson, the producer,
32:02who was like, why don't you guys just play it like a band?
32:04Like straighten it out and play it.
32:06So, yeah, that's pretty much what we did.
32:09Just played it like a four-piece rock band.
32:11But then Marco Siega, this incredible director
32:15who went on to do Dexter,
32:17and he's done a lot of incredible stuff.
32:19Like the video directors we worked with historically
32:23have just been like the greatest gift to our band.
32:26Well, he did Swing Swing.
32:27And he did Swing Swing.
32:28And I remember we got all these treatments
32:30for the Dirty Little Secret video that were just garbage.
32:33And then he was like one of the last ones they went.
32:35They went back to Marco.
32:36It's like, well, he did Swing Swing.
32:37Let's try this guy again.
32:38And he just wrote one sentence.
32:40He said, look at this website.
32:42And he found postsecret.com,
32:44which was this website where people would anonymously
32:47send in their just confessions on a postcard.
32:52And the music video was born out of that.
32:55I think, yeah, the sentence was like,
32:57I don't know what this is yet, but this.
33:01And the depth it gave the song, that juxtaposition visually,
33:04was like, you know, the song is just candy and, you know,
33:09just cotton candy, like pop.
33:11Like as far as just like, it's Dirty Little Secrets.
33:14It's not, that dissection was really,
33:18really, it was really beautiful.
33:20At Billboard, they write good stuff.
33:21I'm just saying, I'm just saying.
33:22You guys, there's a reason you're still at Billboard.
33:25That blew the song up, along with, you know,
33:28Jimmy Iovine loving the song and, you know,
33:32drilling it into radio for 46 weeks
33:35before we cracked the top 20.
33:38That was the wildest thing
33:40because we had no idea what to expect.
33:42Swing, Swing happened.
33:44We did Move Along.
33:45We're like, is this gonna happen again?
33:46Statistically, probably not.
33:49Oh, that was the other thing.
33:50We were like, we knew Move Along was important for us
33:55and an important song that we, you know,
33:57we named the fucking record after it
33:59and that was gonna be the first single.
34:01And we were already, we were getting back in a van,
34:03going on tour.
34:04It was like the Move Along tour.
34:06And the last minute, Jimmy Iovine was like, nah.
34:09Hey, you guys.
34:10Dirty Little Secrets, that's the one.
34:11Dirty Little Secrets.
34:12Wow.
34:12That's the one, man.
34:13That's the one.
34:14Now you guys gotta make those decisions.
34:16Yeah.
34:16Right?
34:17Yeah.
34:18Yeah, it's a lot easier.
34:19It is.
34:20That's right.
34:21Well, thank you guys for hanging out.
34:22This cookie is staring at me.
34:23So let's enjoy some dessert.
34:25Oh, and guess what?
34:26It is somebody's birthday today.
34:28Oh, you guys.
34:29Aw.
34:30You did, you did.
34:32Oh, this is what you get
34:34at the gluten-free Italian restaurant.
34:37But dude, look at the blood orange.
34:39Look at that blood orange.
34:40I am going to eat the shit out of that.
34:42Thank you very much.
34:44And the last refrain.
34:45Happy birthday to you.
34:51Hey.