Director of Case Management at the Free Speech Union [FSU] Ben Jones has hit out at the "grossly disproportionate" sentencing for Lucy Connolly, following the dismissal of her appeal.Connolly was jailed last October after posting on social media that hotels housing asylum seekers should be "set on fire".FULL STORY HERE.
00:00Ben, this is, I must say I was somewhat surprised, who knows about these things, because I thought the original sentence 31 months was draconian, and bearing in mind her circumstance, she's a young mother, I thought that, particularly after the representations by others, including your own organisation, they would have at least reduced her sentence.
00:21It's basically disappointing. It's hard to know what else to say. Other than that, we've supported Lucy for a long time. This is not the result that we were hoping for. It remains the case that the sentence, in our view, is grossly disproportionate. I think I'd also like to say, at this point, that the Free Speech Union is contacted by hundreds of people in any month, many of whom are absolutely terrified about what they can and cannot say in this country. They just do not know what the rules are.
00:50J.D. Vance, the American Vice President, actually did talk, didn't he, Ben, recently, about how, in his view, free speech was under attack in Great Britain. I think this verdict will feed into that view.
01:05I'm afraid he's absolutely right to say that freedom of speech is under attack in Britain, and it's a sustained attack that's been going on for a long time. It's an attack that is not relenting in any way.
01:17And unfortunately, we see that comments around immigration, the scale of immigration, the failure to integrate discussion of the tensions which are undeniable and inescapable in modern Britain, is a topic that is being reacted to by the authorities in an increasingly heavy-handed way.
01:42That is what we can read from this result today. It's what we're seeing at the Free Speech Union constantly, that people who want to express their criticism, their concern, their very grave concerns about what's happening in this country, feel that they're not able to.
01:57And those that do find that if it's not the police knocking on their door, it will be their employer dismissing them from their employment because they do not share the company's values because they have objected, usually in very moderate terms, to mass immigration or to these sorts of issues.
02:15Do you suspect in any way, I mean, I appreciate this is going to be a subjective view, Ben, but that the judiciary are taking their lead from the top?
02:23We have a very prominent human rights lawyer in number 10 who made his views quite clear after the Southport riots.
02:31I think we're in a dangerous situation as a country where that will be the perception of millions of people in this country reacting to this verdict, that trust in the police, in the authorities generally, in the courts and the judiciary, I think is in a free fall.
02:49This is a terrible situation for any country to be in.
02:53And I think that many, many people watching this will agree entirely with what you have just said.
02:59Hmm. She, her own son, Lucy Connolly, had a son that died 14 years earlier.
03:07Her argument was the news of the murders of those Southport children had, was very triggering for her.
03:14She, she'd stood in the shoes of those grieving parents.
03:17And when she was asked why she deleted the post, she told the court, I calmed myself down.
03:23And I know that wasn't an acceptable thing to say.
03:26It wasn't the right thing to say.
03:27It wasn't what I wanted to actually happen.
03:33It's very difficult to see any sort of other factors other than just cruelty and making a political point that have resulted in this woman being taken away from her daughter for two and a half years.
03:47Is this the end for her now in terms of appeals, Ben?
03:50Does she have anywhere else that she can go?
03:52It's difficult to say at this point.
03:56We're reviewing it.
03:57And the judgment has only just come out a few minutes ago.
04:01I think the point I would, I would make at this stage, the risk of laboring the point, is that I think this ruling, and when you look at the wording she used, for all I care, I think is the crucial phrase.
04:20For all I care, for all I care, I think, in my view, clearly, this is not a form of words that she should have used.
04:26She realized that very quickly within a few hours afterwards.
04:29And as you say, she deleted this post.
04:31But this is not somebody who set out to incite violence or racial hatred.
04:38This is somebody who, for entirely understandable human reasons, had a reaction to that horrifying, horrifying news that she later regretted and very immediately recanted.
04:53And I think people watching this overwhelmingly are going to see that this is a grossly disproportionate sentence, and the decision today is the wrong one.
05:03I think one of the things, Ben, that I find really chilling about this as well is the fact that when she was arrested and the police confiscated her phone,
05:10they found other things that she had said in private on WhatsApp exchanges with friends, which were also deemed to be racist.
05:21And she was grilled about this in the court, and they said, do you think we're being invaded by immigrants?
05:27And she said, I believe that we have a massive number of people in the country that are unchecked coming into the country,
05:34and I believe that is a national security risk.
05:36It's almost like what she said in the court they deem is irrelevant compared to private conversations she'd had with friends about immigration,
05:47particularly illegal immigration, on the private WhatsApp messages.
05:52Is that relatively a new phenomenon for courts to look at your private correspondence?
05:57Well, I think what I'd say to that point, I'd actually point you to the example of the Scottish Hate Crime Act,
06:03which came into effect a little over a year ago.
06:06Which removed the private dwelling defence.
06:11And so I think what we are seeing increasingly, whether it's from the police or whether it's from employers looking at what people are saying in private, in WhatsApp chats,
06:20we are seeing a disregard for people's privacy and for their right to express views, even unpalatable views, in private, in the home or in a WhatsApp conversation.
06:31Yeah. Fascinating, Ben. Thank you. And deeply disturbing?
06:34It is. That's Ben Jones, who's from the Free Speech Union, which is backing Lucy Connolly.
