Social media ban will hamper development of skills to deal with online risk, expert says

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00:00Now, he's called it a world-leading piece of legislation.

00:06Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese says the government is set to introduce a

00:10law that would ban all children under the age of 16 from using social media.

00:15The plans are set to be put forward to Parliament this year and could be enforced as early as

00:19next year.

00:21The bill involves an age verification process, which Albanese says will put the onus on the

00:26social media platforms to demonstrate they're taking reasonable steps to prevent access

00:30to their sites.

00:31Lizza Kamenow has the story.

00:35It's a historic legislation to protect young children from cyberbullying.

00:40If the proposed bill passes Parliament, platforms like Facebook, Instagram and TikTok will no

00:46longer be accessible for children under 16 in Australia.

00:50Prime Minister Anthony Albanese announced the new law on Thursday, calling to protect

00:54children online.

00:56Social media is doing harm to our kids and I'm calling time on it.

01:01I've spoken to thousands of parents, grandparents, aunties and uncles.

01:06They like me are worried sick about the safety of our kids online.

01:10And I want Australian parents and families to know that the government has your back.

01:17The government says the ban will not have exemptions for children who have consent from

01:20their parents, nor those who already have accounts.

01:24Social media companies are expected to enforce the new rule themselves or face penalties.

01:30Users, however, will not be fined.

01:32Websites like YouTube will still be accessible for schoolwork.

01:36According to Australia's e-safety commissioner, one in five Australians has been cyberbullied.

01:42This includes receiving threats or abuse online, sharing embarrassing photos and spreading

01:47online gossip.

01:49According to the Australian Council for Educational Research, in 2022 the country was ranked second

01:54in the world for child cyberbullying.

01:56The decision comes after parents increasingly called for their children to be protected

02:01online.

02:02The government proposed a social media age limit earlier this year, which gained support

02:07among lawmakers.

02:08The proposed legislation, if passed in the parliament, will come into force after 12

02:13months.

02:14Let's get more on this and speak to Dr Sara Rose, Associate Professor of Child Psychology

02:19and Education at Staffordshire University.

02:22It's great to have you on the programme, Sara.

02:24Thank you so much for joining us.

02:25I want to first of all just get your initial reaction to this potential piece of legislation.

02:30As a professor of child psychology, do you back it?

02:34I think it's really interesting.

02:35I think it comes from a place of well-meaning.

02:38We want to protect children.

02:40But I'm not sure that this legislation is necessarily going to be the answer.

02:44I worry that it will just move the problem because when a child becomes 16, they don't

02:50suddenly become able to protect themselves and keep themselves safe online.

02:56And I think allowing children to use social media from age 13, as we currently have, enables

03:04parents to support their children.

03:07It enables providers to put limits on accounts based on the fact that the child is under

03:1316.

03:15So I think that it comes from a place of good meaning, but I'm not sure it's going to be

03:20very easy to enforce.

03:22And I'm not sure that it's going to really have the effect that we want.

03:26It's just going to move the problem.

03:28Well, you're kind of hinting at what the head of safety at META has been saying.

03:34We've had some reaction from them.

03:36Of course, META owns Instagram, as well as Facebook.

03:40He says that a deeper discussion needs to be had on how to implement the protections.

03:45Give us a sense of how you think the social media platforms will actually enforce this

03:48piece of legislation.

03:49How will they comply?

03:51I think it's going to be incredibly difficult for them to comply.

03:55We know already, based on research evidence, that parents will help their child under the

04:01age of 13 to set up a social media account.

04:05I think we've got a similar thing happening in the UK at the moment with the online safety

04:09bill.

04:10And the onus is being put on the platform providers to make it more stringent so that

04:17they can be more confident that the users who say they're over the age of 13, or potentially,

04:22in this case, Australia, over the age of 16, are genuinely over that age.

04:27But I think, yeah, it's definitely a problem, a challenge for the platform providers.

04:33I don't know what the solution for them is, really.

04:36And Sarah, this is, of course, part of a wider push globally.

04:39You mentioned in the UK that they're also trying to supervise young people's use of

04:45social media more.

04:46Why is there so much of a focus on it right now?

04:50I think it's something that adults are concerned about.

04:54We recognise that children are more vulnerable, so we want to protect children.

05:00It's challenging for parents because technology moves so quickly that it's hard for parents

05:06to keep up.

05:07So you mentioned Meta, Instagram, Facebook.

05:10They have instilled within the last couple of years a great number of parental controls.

05:16But the problem is that many parents don't know those parental controls are there.

05:21We need to try and look for opportunities to support parents and to support teenagers

05:28online.

05:29While teenagers are at school, there's an opportunity there to provide education through

05:34the curriculum.

05:35And that's one of the reasons why I worry that banning it for children under 16 will

05:40remove that opportunity for them to develop those online safety, those digital resilience

05:46skills, that ability to recognise, to manage online risk and to recover from online risk.

05:53So it sounds like there needs to be a wider education for both parents as well as children

05:58as well, using those social media sites.

06:01I want to speak about the children and get their perspective on this, what you think

06:06their reaction would be to this.

06:09Of course, young people, they want to keep up with their friends.

06:13When they're outside of school, they're using social media to chat to their friends and

06:16doing other things.

06:18What do you think they're going to be thinking?

06:20How do you think they're going to be reacting to this piece of legislation?

06:23Do you think they're going to comply?

06:26Really good question.

06:27Probably not, is my honest answer.

06:30And I think the reason for that is there's two ways to approach this problem of online

06:35risk.

06:36One way is to restrict, to put a law in place such as this that just says you're not allowed

06:42to do it.

06:44The other way is to think about mediating and scaffolding and supporting their use.

06:49So having those conversations, engaging in discussion, asking children what they would

06:54like.

06:55Now, from research that we've carried out here at the University of Staffordshire with

06:59children and their parents, they recognise the risks.

07:04They also recognise some of the benefits of social media, that opportunity to feel

07:09connected to others, to connect with other people who have interests such as their own.

07:15And it's about how we can provide opportunity for children to get those benefits while trying

07:22to minimise risks by, for example, using teen accounts on Instagram and supporting them

07:30to develop their digital resilience, that ability to recognise, manage and recover from

07:35risk.

07:36Yeah, social media is a bit of a curse and a blessing at the same time.

07:41Do you think if this piece of legislation is effective, do you see other countries following

07:46suit and putting in place a legislation like it?

07:51I think certainly other countries will be watching and looking to see what happens.

07:57To what extent it's going to be a very popular piece of legislation, I'm a little bit unsure.

08:04I think it's a simple solution and some parents will definitely find that attractive and feel

08:11that it will protect their children.

08:13But I think that other parents may resent that feeling of being told what they're allowed

08:19to do, what they're not allowed to do, what they're allowing their children to do and

08:22not allowing their children to do.

08:24I think it's a bit of a curse and a blessing to use social media for keeping in touch with

08:29their children sometimes as well.

08:31So it's thinking about how it's going to be received as well, I think, will be interesting

08:35to see.

08:36Yeah, we'll be looking and watching to find out how it all plays out.

08:40Sarah, thank you so much for giving us your thoughts.

08:42We really appreciate getting your analysis and getting you on the programme.

08:45That's Dr Sarah Rose, who is an Associate Professor of Child Psychology and Education

08:50at Staffordshire University.

08:52Thanks so much for your time.

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