Off The Record | Kashif Abbasi | ARY News | 3rd July 2024
#OffTheRecord #ShahidKhaqanAbbasi #MustafaNawazKhokhar #KashifAbbasi #MiftahIsmail #AwamPakistanParty #ElectricityBill #ElectricityPriceHike #PMLNGovt #PMShehbazSharif #MaryamNawaz #BilawalBhutto
(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Kashif Abbasi
Guests:
- Miftah Ismail (Former Minister of Finance)
- Shahid Khaqan Abbasi (Former PM)
Is Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar joins Awam Pakistan Party? - Shahid Khaqan Abbasi Told Inside Story
Inflation in Pakistan - Electricity Price Hikes - Kashif Abbasi Nay Aham Videos Chaladin - Report
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
Subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon for latest news updates: http://bit.ly/3e0SwKP
ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Kashif Abbasi
Guests:
- Miftah Ismail (Former Minister of Finance)
- Shahid Khaqan Abbasi (Former PM)
Is Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar joins Awam Pakistan Party? - Shahid Khaqan Abbasi Told Inside Story
Inflation in Pakistan - Electricity Price Hikes - Kashif Abbasi Nay Aham Videos Chaladin - Report
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
Subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon for latest news updates: http://bit.ly/3e0SwKP
ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Assalam-o-Alaikum, dear viewers, you are watching the program with Kashif Abbasi.
00:15We have with us Shahid Khan Abbasi, former Prime Minister.
00:18We have with us Mifta Ismail, former Minister of Treasury.
00:21A new party is about to be formed.
00:23But before that, let's go to a very good press conference.
00:25Before I come to the issues, there is a budget.
00:31There is a lot of criticism in the budget as to what is there for the common man.
00:36Taxes have been imposed everywhere.
00:39Mr. Shahbaz Sharif has spoken very openly.
00:42He has admitted that it is a good thing that the IMF has come together to make a budget.
00:46The IMF will have to make a budget.
00:48But the history of our country is such that when there is opposition,
00:52no one remembers the budget of the IMF.
00:54To tell you a little, when the budget of the IMF was made earlier in the last government,
00:59what did Mr. Shahbaz Sharif and the rest of the PDM say?
01:03This is because it is a fact that we have to make this budget together with the IMF.
01:09The conditions, the current conditions, this was the demand.
01:13For just one billion dollars, they are hiring the economy and freedom of Pakistan.
01:18A nation that asks for alms and becomes addicted to alms can never progress.
01:22You have made the IMF your slave.
01:24You are all traitors. You are selling the country.
01:27Kill the PTIMF. Bring the loyalty of the poor people.
01:31We don't want the PTIMF.
01:33The IMF has said that the prices of electricity will have to be increased by 25%.
01:40The state bank has become the local branch of the IMF.
01:45The rich and the poor have mortgaged the economy of Pakistan to the IMF.
01:51So, there was a lot of criticism of the IMF,
01:53and there was a lot of criticism of the IMF's facilitative political party, Tariq-e-Insaf.
01:57So, even now there is a budget of the IMF.
01:59Obviously, we have come to a place where this country has not survived without the IMF.
02:03Whenever we hear the mention of default,
02:05let's see if there is any deal left with the IMF.
02:09Whatever the deal is, the default ends.
02:12There was a lot of talk about the electricity bills.
02:14How many units will be free?
02:16This is a campaign before the elections.
02:18It's not a long story. What did Dasun say?
02:20The electricity bills will also be reduced.
02:22People below 200 units will get free electricity.
02:25I will get you 300 units of free electricity.
02:36If you want 300 units of free electricity,
02:41then call Pakistan People's Party.
02:45You will get a bill of up to 300 units of electricity.
02:49The government will bear all the expenses.
02:52The poor man will not pay a single rupee.
02:55So, a poor man did not have to pay a single rupee.
02:57He mortgaged the economy of Pakistan to the IMF.
02:59He made him a beggar.
03:00He broke the budget of the IMF.
03:02But now, obviously, the budget of the IMF has come.
03:04Mr. Shahid, if you allow me,
03:06let me start with you first.
03:07Where is Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar?
03:09There used to be three of them.
03:11Now, there are only two left.
03:12Where is Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar?
03:13Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar is with us.
03:16He wants to wait for some time.
03:19He has some issues with his circle.
03:21He wants to consult with his family.
03:23This is his right.
03:25But his thoughts are with us.
03:27Which family?
03:28I know his family.
03:29Who does he consult with?
03:30You know.
03:31You know his circle.
03:32I know.
03:33There are people in the circle.
03:34This is a very difficult task.
03:35What we have done,
03:36leaving the Jama'at,
03:37making another Jama'at,
03:39is not an easy task.
03:41We have to consult with many people.
03:43But sir, you went to London.
03:45I heard that you will meet Mr. Mian.
03:47This was before the elections.
03:48You will come back.
03:49After two days, there will be a press conference.
03:51Mufti Ismail will be sitting there.
03:53He was also ready that yes,
03:55I also want to do a press conference.
03:56Mr. Shahid, please come back once.
03:57He was ready at that time.
03:58Now, what consultation?
03:59No, I also wanted to consult with the people of my circle
04:02who have been with you for so long.
04:04You have talked to them about the Jama'at.
04:06You have to consult with them.
04:08They have a right.
04:09There is no disagreement.
04:10They have no disagreement with us.
04:12They do not agree with this thought.
04:15So, God willing, you will see them with us.
04:18Can they still come?
04:20Yes, yes.
04:21They need some time.
04:22They said, give me some time.
04:23Let me do all this work.
04:25Now, I will take a test,
04:26if you allow me.
04:27I will make a sound first.
04:28If you take an economic test,
04:30you will lose.
04:31No, no.
04:33I know this man.
04:35I was sitting in front of him once.
04:37I told him, I have taken so much tax.
04:39He took out the exact figure of my salary.
04:42I was sitting in front of him and talking to him.
04:45So, let me tell you the background of this.
04:48Our treasurer,
04:49who has visited 50, 60, 70, 100 countries abroad
04:52and says that
04:53I have visited all of them with my own expense.
04:56Your Prime Minister, Mr. Shahbaz Sharif,
04:57says, Mr. Prime Minister,
04:58for 10 years,
04:59and now I also go on my own expense.
05:00What did he say?
05:01Let me hear.
05:02The visit of Mr. Shahbaz Sharif to Saudi Arabia
05:05is on his own expense.
05:07People are going with the Prime Minister.
05:09All those people are going on their own expense.
05:11Just like that,
05:12for 10 years,
05:13as the Chief Minister,
05:14all the international tours,
05:16he did it on his own expense.
05:18The Prime Minister never took a salary,
05:20nor did he take a TADA.
05:21Even in Punjab,
05:22for 12 and a half years,
05:23he was the Prime Minister.
05:24So, he gave up millions of rupees.
05:26Pakistan's only Prime Minister,
05:28who buys his own tickets,
05:30pays for his own hotel,
05:31and does not burden the people of Pakistan.
05:34In 2019,
05:35everyone collected their tax returns.
05:39Bilawal Bhutto's tax was 5,35,243 rupees.
05:42Tell me,
05:43how much will be his annual income?
05:45Approximately, 35 lakh rupees.
05:47Can a 40-year international tourist
05:49in his business class,
05:51with a 5-star hotel in his pocket,
05:53earn this much?
05:54If his parents...
05:55His father gave a tax of 22 lakh rupees,
05:5723 lakh and 64 thousand rupees.
05:59Approximately, crores of rupees.
06:01So, his annual income is
06:031 crore and 35 lakh rupees.
06:05Because,
06:06yesterday,
06:07Mr. Shahid said in a press conference,
06:08that he doesn't pay the tax,
06:09the taxpayers don't pay the tax.
06:10These are the taxpayers,
06:11who live in houses worth billions of rupees,
06:13and spend billions of rupees.
06:14If a helicopter costs Rs. 250,
06:15and you go on it,
06:16then what is the cost?
06:17A helicopter for Rs. 55.
06:18A helicopter for Rs. 55.
06:19Rs. 55.
06:20That is domestic flight, sir.
06:21That is domestic flight,
06:22not international flight.
06:24Mr. Shahbaz Sharif,
06:25gave a tax of 82 lakh rupees,
06:2682 lakh and 42 thousand rupees.
06:28And you imposed a tax of 45%
06:30on all the taxpayers.
06:32Mr. Murtaza,
06:33you imposed a tax of 10%, 5%, 10%, 15%
06:35when you were the Minister of Treasury,
06:37when you were the Prime Minister.
06:38So, what kind of rocket science
06:39did you have,
06:40when you said,
06:41reduce the tax on the taxpayers?
06:42What compulsion do they have?
06:44Sir, first of all,
06:45the request is that
06:4610% surcharge should be imposed
06:47on a 45% tax.
06:48So, 49.5% tax.
06:50I didn't know this.
06:51Is it higher than this?
06:52Yes.
06:53If you have an income
06:54above a limit,
06:55then 49.5% tax will be imposed
06:56on you.
06:57But that will not be applied
06:58on these people.
06:59If you come under the category of
07:00taxpayers,
07:01then it will not be applied on you.
07:02You have 38.5%.
07:03Okay.
07:04So, this is one thing.
07:05Now, the second thing is that
07:06when Mr. Atta Tarar says
07:07that the Prime Minister
07:08does not take the salary,
07:09then my request is
07:10that he should take the salary,
07:11but correct the decisions
07:12because the loss of your decisions
07:13is more.
07:14The salary of the Prime Minister
07:15is not even 2 lakh rupees.
07:16So, it does not make any difference.
07:17These are all show-offs.
07:18In reality, when you…
07:19Do they correct the tax?
07:20Yes.
07:21With Mr. Shahbaz Sharif…
07:22Sir, look,
07:23I know this much
07:24that when I was the minister
07:25in 2018,
07:26Mr. Shahid Abbasi
07:27paid a tax of 25 crores.
07:28Something like this.
07:29Is that sales tax or income tax?
07:30Income tax.
07:31Personal income tax.
07:32Okay.
07:33So, the question is…
07:34So, you are saying
07:35that if there is a director
07:36of a company
07:37or you have a sugar mill,
07:38whatever personal income
07:39you get,
07:40you will have to pay
07:41income tax, right?
07:42Yes.
07:43Look,
07:44there is a tax of 15%
07:45on the dividend.
07:46There is a higher tax
07:47on your income.
07:48So, our companies…
07:49I have seen
07:50that there is a tax
07:51for your income.
07:52But,
07:53our companies…
07:54I…
07:55Mr. Shahid,
07:56thank God
07:57that we have some resources,
07:58but we have money
07:59trade resources.
08:00If we do not live
08:01in big palaces
08:02and if we live
08:03in a house
08:04where we can justify
08:05that we have given
08:06such and such tax
08:07and our taxable income
08:08is more than
08:09our expenses.
08:10And the fact that…
08:11Look,
08:12I do not know
08:13whether that tax is right
08:14or not,
08:15but it had
08:16a couple of
08:17loopholes.
08:18We had
08:19eliminated one loophole
08:20So, this is the first loophole that has been solved.
08:23The other loophole was that people used to say that there is a remittance,
08:26that someone has sent you money from abroad, which is not taxable.
08:29So, it is possible that someone has sent money from abroad to Mr. Bilawar Bhutto,
08:32his aunt, or whoever, I don't know that.
08:35I tell my aunt to send me money.
08:38My aunt has passed away, so may Allah grant her paradise.
08:41I don't have an aunt, who will I tell?
08:44May Allah grant her paradise. I am giving an example,
08:47that we have agriculture tax.
08:50People say, I had an income from agriculture.
08:53This is also a remittance.
08:56Thirdly, we don't tax inter-family gifts.
08:59If you have a husband and a wife, it is fine,
09:02it becomes a unit of children, but you can also give it to brothers and sisters.
09:05And then you distribute money to the whole family,
09:08and there is no tax on it.
09:11So, it becomes a little difficult to keep this trail.
09:14This is absolutely unjust.
09:17How unjust? How unjust do you think it is?
09:20Because your press conference repeatedly said that this is already a tax-paying class.
09:23Sir, my request is this.
09:26On the one hand, the Prime Minister said that the country is in danger,
09:29the economy is in danger, we will have to bend our back.
09:32We understand this. God forbid, if the country is in danger,
09:35then you take 40% tax from the salaried class.
09:38But when you are taking 40% tax from them,
09:41because the country is in danger,
09:44then you will increase your current expenditure by 24%.
09:47You will increase your PSDP by more than 30%.
09:50You will not tax any agriculture.
09:53It is not fair that you take tax from a person who has a salary of lakhs,
09:56but you do not take tax from someone who has a thousand acres of land.
09:59If the country is in danger, then the country belongs to all of us.
10:02If it is only the salaried class, then they have not taken a loan.
10:05If it is only the middle class, then they have not taken a loan
10:08that I should give tax on my child's milk, I should give tax on packaged milk,
10:11but the big properties where people live in the provinces,
10:14they should not pay tax.
10:17Now in Islamabad, the agricultural land, they should not pay tax.
10:20And then some parts of Ashrafia, they should not pay tax.
10:23They will have to reveal two things.
10:26One is horizontal equity,
10:29that the income of equal money, they should pay equal tax,
10:32no matter what their profession is.
10:35If I have a certain income,
10:38you do business, you have the same income, we should pay equal tax.
10:41Now if I have agriculture,
10:44whatever you do,
10:47and you work in ARY or in a government office in Pakistan,
10:50the tax should be equal.
10:53What do you think? I think it should be.
10:56So the tax exemption on the sale of the land of bureaucrats and soldiers,
10:59you also mentioned this, I will ask Mr. Shahid.
11:02This is a very serious anomaly.
11:05What will the people of this country think?
11:08Give it to the judges, give it to the politicians.
11:11What are they doing? What kind of thinking is this?
11:14Believe me, every person asks what is happening?
11:17All of you are citizens of this country.
11:20The law is equal for the citizens.
11:23It is not possible that you are not a citizen of the law.
11:26You are a traitor.
11:29The law is equal for everyone.
11:32You cannot give these exemptions.
11:35These things do not work in this era.
11:38But they are working, they are giving.
11:41This will be a loss for the country.
11:44It will be a loss for those institutions.
11:47What will the people of the army think about the army?
11:50What will the people of the bureaucrats think about them?
11:53Why are they doing this?
11:56Civilians are also martyred.
11:59If there is an employee of Wabda, for example,
12:02he is a lineman, he gets a current on duty,
12:05and he also gets martyred, he was also on duty,
12:08you give him an exemption too.
12:11Give it to the war-wounded too.
12:14Those who have been martyred, the police,
12:17they have the right.
12:20If he has given his life, then the country should at least do something for his widow.
12:23But when you are unlimited,
12:26even if you have 4 plots, you have a tax exemption,
12:29that's a bad thing. It doesn't look nice.
12:32But since when have we ever cared about optics?
12:35When was the last time optics came in this country?
12:38You live in a country where the UN working group is giving reports against you.
12:41The US Congress is saying that there is interference,
12:44I agree, but the whole world is affected by you.
12:47How does your system work?
12:50The treasurer has said that he will bring a resolution against you.
12:53He has brought it.
12:56I am not in favour of interference,
12:59what I am saying is that we don't even believe in optics,
13:02that we should make optics so that some sort of fairness can be achieved.
13:05People ask,
13:08there used to be a space, people used to accept it,
13:11now people ask questions.
13:14I am saying for the viewers that it is in your right that you cannot justify.
13:17The treasurer can justify why he has given exemptions.
13:20There should be a reason for everything.
13:23This is a matter of thought.
13:26In today's time,
13:29the electricity bill,
13:32compared to last year,
13:35the one that uses 300 units,
13:38has doubled.
13:41You use more.
13:44A person who uses only 10 units daily,
13:47fan, TV,
13:50last year the bill was around Rs 7000,
13:53now it is Rs 17000.
13:56What is the justification for this?
13:59What are you doing?
14:02When we don't charge you, you should definitely charge us.
14:05Don't talk about charging.
14:08How will you cover your expenses?
14:11Will you send us money?
14:14No, no.
14:17Will you send us money?
14:20No, no.
14:23Sir, wherever you get money from,
14:26the question is where it comes from.
14:29Let's talk about corruption, assets.
14:32Put the assets aside.
14:35You should ask people,
14:38if you don't collect from them,
14:41then their share will be paid by Kashmiri people.
14:44What you are doing today,
14:4740-50% of the taxes are in the country
14:50that has taken on the responsibility of your life
14:53from birth to death.
14:56They take 40-50% of the taxes.
14:59Because I don't want to spend anything.
15:02My children will go to school, hospitals,
15:05I will do everything myself.
15:08Because others are not giving, that's why you are giving.
15:11Before I go there,
15:14what is the biggest challenge for your political party?
15:17Talking about economy or reforming the system?
15:20Everything.
15:23If the system is correct, the economy will be correct.
15:26What do you mean by system?
15:29The hybrid system cannot work.
15:32Which system, which country in the world works without a system?
15:35Or does it work by breaking the system?
15:38We have a system, we can run it, we can't run it.
15:41What is our condition?
15:44So you have to understand that you have to run the country according to the system.
15:47If you don't run it, it doesn't work.
15:50And if there is something wrong with the system,
15:53remove it.
15:56It is not possible that my responsibility is somewhere else.
15:59I have done experiments from hybrid to martial law.
16:02Nothing worked?
16:05Nothing worked.
16:08But what should we do?
16:11You think the government should step back and hand over to the politicians and tell them to do their work?
16:14Don't step back at all.
16:17Everyone should do their own work so that the country can move forward.
16:20Sir, you said that I am paying more taxes because no one else is paying.
16:23I am paying more electricity bills because electricity is being stolen.
16:26When will this happen?
16:29It will start coming.
16:32The government is tolerating it.
16:35The government is putting it on the companies.
16:38The circular debt is that.
16:41Its impact has not yet come on your bill.
16:44But sir, the bills are coming.
16:47I remember your government.
16:5013-18.
16:53Your speeches against KP.
16:56Taxes are not being collected from different places.
16:59You had shut down the electricity of D.I. Khan and Bannu.
17:02Many areas were shut down from here.
17:05The road setting has increased a lot.
17:08There were protests because the tax is not coming.
17:11Bill is not coming.
17:14There is no recovery of the bill in Balochistan.
17:17The bill is not coming from the tribal areas.
17:20Why is there no solution?
17:23You have also talked about privatization of discos.
17:26You have only one solution for circular debt.
17:29You have to privatize these discos.
17:32There is no other solution.
17:35You have not even talked about it.
17:38So, this is the solution for distribution companies?
17:41This is the solution.
17:44Otherwise, it is not a solution to shut down the electricity of people.
17:47If there is a lot of theft in this area,
17:50we will supply less electricity and save money.
17:53So, you have only one solution.
17:56Privatize it.
17:59There is a disco in your country which is privatized.
18:02There is a modern one.
18:05It does not contribute to the circular debt.
18:08After this, you will have to deregulate it.
18:11You have to set the pricing of each disco.
18:14It is not possible to set the pricing of each disco.
18:17You will have to make a regulatory framework.
18:20You will have to bring in good regulators.
18:23They work in the public interest.
18:26So that they do not overprice.
18:29The reason for the government is that
18:32the natural monopolies of discos
18:35will monopolize the electricity provided in the area.
18:38If another person brings a wire, it will be very expensive.
18:41But even if it was a private sector,
18:44the government would not have sold so much electricity.
18:47Another thing is that you have competition with solar panels.
18:50You can make solar on your roof for Rs 10-15.
18:53So, the private sector will reduce the rate due to that competition
18:56until you privatize it.
18:59I will give you an example.
19:02There are feeders in every part of Pakistan
19:05where 90% of the electricity is not being recovered.
19:08You are sharing the load for 10-12 hours.
19:11That is a collective punishment.
19:14But you are not taking 90% of the bill
19:17because the people of Amla are also involved.
19:20Tax is not collected because you are the finance minister
19:23and the people of Amla are involved.
19:26There is corruption.
19:29I know many cases where someone was sent a bill
19:32worth Rs 1-2 crores.
19:35If you get Rs 2.5 crores settled,
19:38you get Rs 17.5 crores.
19:41So, you know that money is made there.
19:44You know that there is corruption.
19:47We have stopped the dollar, but why can't we fix this?
19:50Sir, I request you to privatize this thing.
19:53It will be easier.
19:56We have tried every way to reduce electricity in Pakistan.
19:59Now let's try to privatize it.
20:02We have imposed taxes on the middle class.
20:05We have imposed taxes on the middle class.
20:08We have imposed taxes on manufacturing.
20:11We have exempted agriculture.
20:14We can't impose taxes on shops.
20:17Mr. Mifta Bhai, please look into this.
20:20You were the one who was publicly asked to look into this.
20:23You did it.
20:26I request you to look into this
20:29You know what Mr. Mifta Bhai did?
20:32He said that 2.5% of the manufacturers
20:35will cut their taxes and give it to us.
20:38This means that either 2.5% of the manufacturers
20:41will increase the price and it will pass on.
20:44Because the manufacturers won't give it to us.
20:47I am telling you practically what the problem is.
20:50Right now, a soap seller goes to a shop
20:53and tells the shopkeeper that if you are registered
20:56then I will cut your taxes by 0.5% and if you are not
20:59then I will cut it by 0.5%.
21:02He says that he is registered.
21:05He says give me your NTA number and CNIC number.
21:08He will take both the numbers and go back to his office
21:11and send it to the headquarters in Lahore or Karachi.
21:14There he will be checked to see if he is on the active tax payer list or not.
21:17This is a company that sells soap.
21:20Then he will check and tell his son
21:23that you didn't pay this fixed tax
21:26and you have put this cost on manufacturing.
21:29Seriously, it is mind-bogglingly idiotic.
21:32Let me take a break.
21:35Everything is so mind-bogglingly idiotic in this country.
21:38It is mind-bogglingly idiotic.
21:41You are our new speaker.
21:44I apologize.
21:47I take the idiotic word back. I am sorry.
21:50Welcome back, viewers.
21:53I am speaking in simple words.
21:56You are technical people. I am speaking in simple words.
21:59Electricity is stolen. No one stops it.
22:02Tax is stolen. No one stops it.
22:05You mentioned another thing in your press conference
22:08that if you collect tax on diesel and LPG smuggling
22:11then there is no need to pay any tax.
22:14What is this?
22:17If there is smuggling of diesel
22:20then the government spends Rs. 70 on PDL
22:23which they have to collect.
22:26If there is smuggling of 1 Arab litre
22:29then it becomes Rs. 70 Arab.
22:32Apart from other taxes.
22:35What about LPG?
22:38There is more smuggling than 1 Arab litre.
22:41There is a drama going on.
22:44There is about 2.5 Arab litre.
22:47So, if I calculate this
22:50then there is a tax of Rs. 170 Arab.
22:53It is a big amount.
22:56If you collect that,
22:59it is far less than the additional tax.
23:02This is just like cigarettes.
23:05Cigarettes are going to become expensive every year.
23:08This year, I have smoked a lot of cigarettes.
23:11I am talking about 100 billion.
23:13No tax is paid.
23:15I think your tax collection is more than 100 billion.
23:19At least.
23:20At least 100 billion.
23:22Openly.
23:23Do you know which companies steal?
23:25Plus, all the expensive foreign cigarettes that are sold in Pakistan,
23:29are also taxed.
23:30The smuggled cigarettes.
23:31And the local tax, the cheap cigarettes, are also taxed.
23:34And both are being stolen and the government knows about it.
23:38Yes.
23:39Quota.
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24:13You're good at something.
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25:44Pinch where it hurts.
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