City of Portsmouth College - Portsmouth South Hustings on 19th June 2024
Confirmed panellists are:
Stephen Morgan MP - Labour
Signe Biddle – Conservative
Charlie Murphy – Liberal Democrats
Elliott Lee – Green Party
Mark Zimmer – Reform
Jacob Short – Portsmouth Independent Party
Stephen Morgan MP - Labour
Signe Biddle – Conservative
Charlie Murphy – Liberal Democrats
Elliott Lee – Green Party
Mark Zimmer – Reform
Jacob Short – Portsmouth Independent Party
Category
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NewsTranscript
00:00Do you think the plan for national service will work?
00:02Do you think the plan for national service will work?
00:06Let's start with the incumbent MP, Stephen Morgan.
00:08No.
00:09And I think if this is the sum of the Conservative government's
00:13parts, then I think that shows you the sorry state
00:16that our country is in.
00:18If the best they can offer is national service, which,
00:21frankly, is a teenage Daz Army, I
00:24think that is a real shame for our country.
00:26I have huge ambitions for Britain.
00:29I have huge ambitions for every young person.
00:31That's why I'm committed to seeing votes at 16
00:34if we deliver a Labour government in two weeks' time.
00:37And I think if this is all the Tories can offer, what a shame
00:40and what a state we're in.
00:41Thank you.
00:42I wouldn't like to do it, and I don't think
00:44anybody should have to do it.
00:46I think it's a desperate act from the Conservative Party.
00:49I think they see reform coming up behind them,
00:52and they're petrified.
00:54They're pulling every lever they can,
00:56and I don't think that's fitting for a governing
00:58party or a party that deserves to be in government.
01:01The army can't handle it.
01:02They've cut it so far that there are now just 70,000 people
01:04left in the army.
01:06If you send all 18-year-olds their way
01:08in national service, they're not going to handle it at all,
01:10and they're certainly not going to function as an army.
01:13There are far more valuable things
01:15that we can do with young people's time,
01:17and I think the government's let us down, really,
01:20our generation, and I think national service writes that.
01:23OK.
01:23Thank you.
01:24Thank you.
01:28Well, no, I think it's a plea.
01:32Where did they get that idea from?
01:34Really?
01:36That is scraping the bottom of the barrel,
01:38and if that's just supposed to make reform UK supporters go,
01:45that's a good idea.
01:46I think they've completely lost it.
01:48So no, I will not be sending you off to conscription camps
01:53and things like that.
01:54So you can relax on that one.
01:56So you're not that bad, are you?
02:02How will you tackle the issue of illegal immigration?
02:06Mark Zimmer, Reform, how will you tackle illegal immigration?
02:12Well, it's basically you've just got to take
02:18control of your own borders.
02:21Everybody's too scared to talk about it.
02:23Great, actually, you brought that one up, Carla.
02:25Thank you.
02:27But everybody's too scared.
02:28All the other parties are too scared to talk about it,
02:32and they sideline it every time.
02:35What I would do, coming back to that question you asked me,
02:38is once they're on the soil, they
02:43need to be detained until you know who they are.
02:46There's people coming over.
02:49You don't know who they are from Adam.
02:51You can't take their fingerprints,
02:52because otherwise that's an invasion of their human rights.
02:57And then when you do get them on board,
03:00and you're trying to process them,
03:02and they're fouled asylum seekers,
03:03then you've got the ECHR telling us, well,
03:08you can't move them again.
03:10So really, we need to leave the ECHR,
03:15and then we'll have more control of our borders.
03:18Stephen Morgan, you're the incumbent MP.
03:20What do you think should be done?
03:22Can I first of all just say, I really
03:23hate this language of othering others,
03:26and the divisive language that we
03:28see in our politics of today.
03:31I'm hugely proud that Portsmouth is a city of sanctuary that
03:35helps some of the most vulnerable people in the world
03:38come to this country and settle here.
03:41And I've got a record of supporting
03:43a number of asylum seekers and refugees in the UK
03:46settle in the UK.
03:47The challenge and the frustration
03:49I've had in the seven years that I've been the MP
03:52is the Home Office have not processed the claims quickly.
03:55Absolutely.
03:56And what is divisive is suggesting
03:59that anyone can be illegal.
04:02That's ridiculous.
04:04What we need to be focusing on is ensuring these people have
04:09safe routes to get to the UK.
04:11If they have safe routes to get into the UK,
04:14we wouldn't have the problem of boats.
04:17Tell me, how are people supposed to be getting from Sudan,
04:21Albania, Eritrea, Vietnam, where people
04:25are fleeing for their lives?
04:29I have direct experience of this.
04:30I've been supporting victims of modern slavery,
04:33human trafficking for over a year.
04:36And these are the people that are coming in the boats.
04:40And they're so vulnerable.
04:42So why is it such a high priority,
04:44I guess is the question, when there's other things that money
04:46We're talking about illegal immigration.
04:48It's high priority because, as Charlie rightly points out,
04:51the humanitarian aspect of it is absolutely horrendous.
04:54I mean, yeah, people, children are dying and being
04:59very badly treated by these horrendous people.
05:01Is that a big enough deterrent for you?
05:03Is that a big enough deterrent for you, children
05:05being trampled in small boats?
05:07Sorry?
05:08Sorry, what?
05:10You claim it's a deterrent.
05:11No, I don't think children being trampled is a deterrent.
05:13I think the Rwanda policy is a deterrent.
05:16I mean, that should be a deterrent.
05:17It's terrible.
05:18These people smugglers are exploiting
05:20these vulnerable people dreadfully.
05:22But your deterrent's clearly not working, then,
05:23is that still happening?
05:24It still happens.
05:25You see people dying.
05:26And they're still trying.
05:27Well, the Rwanda policy has been held up again and again
05:29and again.
05:30Labour voted against it again and again.
05:31Every policy we've tried to put in place
05:34to deter, to stop illegal immigration,
05:36the Labour Party has voted against.
05:38OK, let's hear from the Labour Party.
05:39Stephen Wong, why are Labour voting against it?
05:41Because the plans just won't work.
05:42And as I said earlier, they're unethical,
05:44they're unworkable, and they just
05:47won't deliver what we need to see happen.
05:50And we've set out our plans, as I mentioned earlier,
05:52in my answer to the previous question, I believe.
05:55Right, let's move on.
05:56Let's take another question, this time from Irfan Hidari.
05:59Irfan?
06:00What would your solutions be on the conflict in Gaza?
06:03What is the solution to the conflict in Gaza?
06:08Let's start with the Greens.
06:10Immediate ceasefire, release of all hostages,
06:18end to the arms trades, particularly
06:21our links to the arms trade enforcement,
06:25and a two-state solution for both.
06:29It's one of those things that is, unfortunately,
06:36unless the world unites, the UK is a tiny island that
06:40Israel probably won't listen to, let's be real.
06:43But the way that I see the Gaza and Israel conflict
06:46is both sides are losing, because it's really
06:50Hamas v. the Israel government.
06:53The civilians on both ends are suffering.
06:55And like Elliot said regarding arms trades and things
06:59like that, that is something we have control of.
07:01I think in the immediate term, we
07:03have to suspend arms sales to Israel.
07:05We've seen this humanitarian catastrophe unfolding in Gaza.
07:08I think wherever we can suspect that humanitarian law is being
07:12breached, they should not be British weapons there.
07:15The Lib Dems have called for a ceasefire
07:18and for there to be a two-state solution.
07:21I think that's the only way we get lasting peace in Gaza.
07:24And we'd recognize a Palestinian state immediately.
07:29Is there not a risk that the, Mark, Zimmer,
07:33what should be done about Gaza?
07:34What's the solution?
07:36Well, unfortunately, I just feel like I'm parroting
07:39what everybody else has said.
07:42It's horrendous.
07:47There isn't a straightforward answer to it, really.
07:50The way we view things is different to the way
07:54things have been in the past.
07:56It's different to the way things are viewed,
07:59say, in the Midwest, with different religions.
08:03So me saying, do this, do that, accept Palestine as a state,
08:10Israel as a state, it's just, well, basically,
08:17it needs an adult in the room.
08:18That's what it needs, out of all of us, really.
08:23There's nobody that can actually tell us the answer here.
08:25I think it's a really, really difficult issue
08:29that people much, much more experienced in diplomacy
08:32and so on have been working on ever
08:35since the end of the Second World War
08:38and the British Mandate, when the British Mandate ended
08:41in Palestine and the State of Israel was formed.
08:45I think it becomes incredibly emotional.
08:48As a peace-seeking person, we have
08:49to be incredibly careful to separate
08:52a terrible terrorist organization that Hamas is
08:55and must be seen as from the Palestinian people who
09:00are living in Gaza, West Bank, the occupied territories.
09:05Clearly, the way forward is a two-state solution.
09:09It's very easy to say that comes glibly off the tongue,
09:12doesn't it?
09:12But it's a very, very difficult issue to solve.
09:17And everybody needs to be on board with it.
09:20Unfortunately, Netanyahu is not on board
09:23with a two-state solution.
09:24So that, in itself, is very difficult,
09:26while defending Israel's right to defend itself.
09:34Would you prosecute war criminals on both sides?
09:37If war crimes have been committed,
09:39but you have to be very careful how you define them.
09:42Let her answer the question first.
09:44You have to be very careful, and there's
09:46a lot of emotional language being used,
09:48calling what Israel is doing in Gaza genocide.
09:51It is not genocide.
09:53It's terrible.
09:54Their reaction has gone too far.
09:56But it's not the same as genocide.
09:58Do you agree with the ICCJ?
10:00No.
10:01So how many people are going to have to die
10:02before you call it a genocide?
10:04It's 14,000 people.
10:05It's terrible.
10:05It's terrible.
10:06It's terrible.
10:06It's terrible.
10:07It's terrible.
10:07It's terrible.
10:08It's terrible.
10:08It's terrible.
10:09It's terrible.
10:09It's terrible.
10:09It's terrible.
10:10I've already said it's terrible,
10:12but it's not the same as genocide.
10:13They're not deliberately going in there.
10:14They're doing what they need to do to get rid
10:16of Hamas terrorists.
10:17It's a war, not a genocide.
10:19It's a war, not a genocide.
10:20And I'm really sorry that these people.
10:22I've answered your question, but it's a war, not a genocide.
10:26To make sure that we brought an end to the fighting,
10:29we saw the release of hostages, and we
10:32did everything we possibly could to alleviate
10:34the humanitarian crisis.
10:37Labour's manifesto sets out that we will recognise
10:40Palestine as a separate state.
10:42And we absolutely need to work with our international partners
10:45to deliver the peace and stability that that region so
10:48desperately needs.
10:49Is it genocide?
10:51It's for the international courts
10:53to make a decision on whether or not it's genocide.
10:55Do you agree with the arrest warrants?
10:58I'm not a lawyer.
10:59I'm a parliamentarian.
11:00I think it's absolutely right that courts make decisions
11:03on these issues.
11:04Your leader's a human rights lawyer.
11:06Does he agree with the warrants?
11:08He's a political leader representing
11:10a political party.
11:12Irfan, you asked the question.
11:13The SNP called the motion to call for a ceasefire.
11:1725,000 Palestinians died.
11:19Why did you abstain?
11:21Because we put forward our own amendment, which
11:23would have released the hostages and also set out
11:26the course for a permanent and immediate ceasefire.
11:28And that's the case that I've been
11:30making for a considerable amount of months now.