# The Reporters | Khawar Ghumman & Chaudhry Ghulam Hussain | ARY News | 27th March 2024

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IHC Kay Judges Kay Letter Par Bar Association Ka Rad e Amal | Khawar Ghumman's Analysis

IHC judges seek SJC meeting over ‘interference’ in judicial affairs - Expert Analysis

"Jin Par Ilzam Lagraha Hai Unko Bhi Suna Jaye aur Sabooton Par Faisal Kiya Jaye" Haider Naqvi

Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY

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ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.

IHC Kay Judges Kay Letter Par Bar Association Ka Rad e Amal | Khawar Ghumman's Analysis

IHC judges seek SJC meeting over ‘interference’ in judicial affairs - Expert Analysis

"Jin Par Ilzam Lagraha Hai Unko Bhi Suna Jaye aur Sabooton Par Faisal Kiya Jaye" Haider Naqvi

Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY

Subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon for latest news updates: http://bit.ly/3e0SwKP

ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.

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News###### Transcript

00:00 Asalam o alikum, dear viewers, welcome to the program.

00:14 Since the last day, when this letter was written by the six judges of the Honourable

00:22 Judges Council, we have only one news as a headline.

00:30 You can see it on television screens, newspapers, and social media.

00:34 This is the topic under discussion.

00:36 Now, what were the circumstances due to which the six Honourable Judges had to be forced

00:42 to write a letter.

00:44 The letter has now been written to the Supreme Judicial Council.

00:47 The letter is headed by the Chief Justice of Pakistan, Justice Qazi Faiz-e-Sahab, and

00:52 two other senior judges.

00:54 In addition, there are two senior judges of the Supreme Court of Islamabad, and if I'm

01:00 not mistaken, the Chief Justice of Khaybar Pakhtunkhwa is also a member.

01:05 We will discuss the reasons for the request in detail in this letter.

01:10 But the topic under discussion is whether the letter was written by the Supreme Judicial

01:18 Council itself, or should they have taken notice of this issue themselves?

01:24 They were the judges.

01:26 If a judge was interfered with, should they not have complained on the same day?

01:36 If a person in their court has been trespassed, should they have taken action?

01:46 This is the topic under discussion.

01:48 When we are talking to you, the Supreme Court Chief Justice has called a full court bench

01:54 meeting, and all the judges of the Supreme Court of Pakistan are sitting together,

02:01 discussing how to resolve this issue.

02:05 But since this is a very serious issue, we are seeing that all the Bar Councils of Pakistan

02:12 are coming forward with different statements.

02:16 Let's put that in front of you first, because we have seen that the status of this letter

02:22 is being discussed a lot since yesterday.

02:25 We will also bring that into our program under discussion.

02:28 But the reaction that is coming, especially from the legal fraternity, from the Wakla,

02:33 it is very important to put that in front of you.

02:35 First of all, the Supreme Court Bar Association has stated that the interference in the judicial

02:42 matters of the judges and the life of the judges is mentioned as a threat.

02:48 Their complaint is not enough, but these circumstances require serious action.

02:53 Therefore, as a judiciary, the judiciary should seriously consider the protections of the

02:58 judges and take strict action.

03:00 After that, viewers, the statement of the Islamabad High Court Bar Association is in

03:04 front of you.

03:05 The Islamabad Bar Association is appealing to the Chief Justice of Pakistan to conduct

03:10 a transparent inquiry into this matter and to take legal action against those who are

03:15 involved in this matter.

03:17 The Islamabad High Court Bar Association is fully complaining about the interference

03:21 in any other institution.

03:23 The Islamabad High Court Bar Association is appealing to the judiciary to take decisions

03:28 according to the law and the law and to make the decisions without fear of danger.

03:33 The Islamabad High Court Bar Association is appealing to the esteemed judges who have

03:39 demonstrated bravery and courage.

03:42 The Islamabad High Court Bar Association reminds that in the future, to stop any illegal

03:48 action, if necessary, the court will prove to be a hindrance to freedom of the judiciary.

03:55 Every step will be taken that will be necessary for the enforcement of the law and the law.

04:00 If the Islamicabad Bar Association has to carry out a nationwide strike, hunger strike and

04:05 movement for the freedom of the judiciary, it will not hesitate.

04:10 This gentleman came from them.

04:12 Similarly, the Islamabad Bar Association has also received announcements.

04:16 They say that the freedom of the judiciary from the side of the six esteemed judges and

04:21 the freedom of the judiciary has been expressed in the Supreme Judicial Council's letter

04:27 regarding the negative actions of the judiciary.

04:30 Even before this, Judge Islamabad High Court Justice Shaukat Aziz Siddiqui had expressed

04:35 his opinion on this.

04:37 The Islamabad Bar Association is standing with the practice of the law and the law,

04:42 the freedom of the judiciary and the principles of the judiciary.

04:46 And it calls for the freedom of the judiciary and the principles of the judiciary,

04:51 while respecting the principles of freedom and self-determination.

04:56 After that, viewers, news from the Bar Council Association has come to light that the

05:02 Islamabad High Court has expressed concerns about the cases of interference in the judiciary

05:07 on the side of the six judges and the judiciary.

05:11 It has been said that the letter of the judges of the Islamabad High Court is a disturbing

05:16 act, which is a question mark on the existence of freedom and self-determination,

05:21 which the Supreme Court should immediately take notice of.

05:25 According to the letter of the six judges of the Islamabad High Court, interference in

05:30 the judicial affairs on the side of the secret courts is acceptable, which is not acceptable

05:35 in any case.

05:36 The letter of the Sindh High Court Bar Association has come to light, viewers.

05:41 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, the Supreme Judicial Council, by the excellent

05:46 judges of the Islamabad High Court, is encouraging the courageous action of writing letters.

05:52 The Sindh High Court Bar, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

05:57 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

06:02 the judiciary, whether it is a case of interference in the judiciary or a case of interference

06:07 in the judiciary.

06:08 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

06:12 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

06:17 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

06:20 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

06:25 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

06:30 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

06:33 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

06:38 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

06:43 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

06:46 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

06:51 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

06:56 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

07:00 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

07:07 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

07:12 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

07:15 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

07:20 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

07:25 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

07:28 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

07:33 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

07:38 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

07:41 The Sindh High Court Bar Association, on the side of the government or secret agencies,

07:46 strongly condemns any kind of interference in the judicial affairs of the courts and

07:51 the judiciary, which is not acceptable in any case.

07:54 I would like to go to my panelist.

07:58 He is saying that we request that the judicial convention be established on the judicial

08:03 affairs of the courts, which is a violation of the freedom of the judiciary, and the

08:07 action of threatening the judges.

08:09 Such a convention through which further information can be obtained that whether the judges of

08:14 other high courts are also not affected by such issues.

08:18 Such an institutional consultation will provide support for the Supreme Court, which will

08:23 provide better protection to the judiciary and will provide a mechanism for the accountability

08:28 of the elements that violate the freedom of the judiciary.

08:32 And it should be made clear that what actions judges can take individually in the case of

08:37 threatening on the part of the government or secret agencies.

08:40 It has been made very clear in the letter that we do not understand, the judge is saying

08:45 that if there is such a case with a judge, then where should he take his concern.

08:50 Let's open the discussion.

08:53 First of all, Hassan, since you have experience in reporting, you have been covering the Supreme

08:57 Court.

08:58 The first reaction when you saw this letter, and this is from six judges, they are not

09:03 verbal, they have put signatures on it.

09:05 There is also one in the letter.

09:07 Okay, that is written and after that they said that we have agreed to this and this is

09:13 our concern.

09:14 They have raised very serious questions.

09:20 They have asked questions on the institution that is the organ of the state.

09:26 They are interfering with us.

09:28 But they did not take the name.

09:30 Justice Shaukat Siddiqui took the name.

09:32 But they did not take the name.

09:34 But anyway, this is evidence.

09:36 If needed, they have put an annexation.

09:38 I think the name is in the letter.

09:44 Definitely.

09:45 So, this case has to be probed.

09:48 They have to give the evidence.

09:50 If it opens.

09:51 Now, we have to see if the full court meeting is going on.

09:54 So, they want to solve this case on the administrative side or on the judicial side.

10:00 If it has to be solved on the administrative side, then it will not be open.

10:04 It will be there.

10:05 Whatever decisions will be there, they will come in front of us.

10:08 And if this case has to be solved on the judicial side, then a bench will be made on the judicial

10:12 side.

10:13 Then a three-member committee will constitute a bench.

10:15 The application for 184 has already been submitted.

10:17 On this matter, some people have also asked these questions, which is an application.

10:21 In that, the applicant is also demanding that because these judges have become victims of

10:25 harassment, so they should not be judges.

10:28 This kind of thing also happens.

10:29 And really, their oath is that they say that the judge is saying that I am not a president

10:34 and that I will decide under any pressure, without any fear and danger, according to

10:38 the law and the constitution.

10:39 This is what his constitution also says.

10:42 Now, this matter, but even then, the people like the Bar Councils, the people who I have

10:46 spoken to, you know that the Bar Councils are very touchy on the freedom of the judiciary

10:51 because they have a struggle.

10:53 That is, when Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhary was deposed, after that, in their restoration,

10:58 where there was also a part of the political parties, but the initiator was the Wakla

11:02 community of Pakistan.

11:04 So the Wakla community is very touchy on this, but that is, it could not be done on one

11:09 side.

11:10 Now people are waiting for the institutional reaction that comes, that is, the Supreme

11:14 Court will come to Pakistan.

11:16 After that, the Supreme Court Bar, Pakistan Bar Council or other bars will also bring clarity

11:20 in their views.

11:21 Mr. Chaudhary Ghulam, in my opinion, the current political and historical and judicial history

11:28 that we have seen, is a very big earth-shaking development.

11:33 In the past, we have heard a few incidents, but the gathering of six judges and explaining

11:40 their concerns on one issue with their signatures, I would definitely tell the viewers.

11:47 Viewers, Hassan was highlighting an issue, in this letter, he did not say at all that

11:53 we have made some wrong decisions because of this fear, he is saying that the code of

11:58 conduct that we have, being a judge of Islamabad High Court, we do not have any such way that

12:05 as a judge, if this is done by the executive side, then where should I apply it?

12:14 Mr. Chaudhary Ghulam, you can read it again.

12:39 He has agitated on every level that we went to the Chief Justice, we went to this and

12:46 that, we talked about this, there were discussions in the judges' tea room, everything is written

12:53 and these are not six judges, except for Amar Farooq, seven judges are endorsing this because

13:01 of this fear, and Ghulam Ahmed, Ghulam Ahmed, and Gul Aurangzeb, they have also signed in

13:08 one letter, the annexure, so this is a kind of Islamabad High Court, it has created a

13:17 ruckus, raised their hands, and they have screamed, for God's sake, save these institutions,

13:25 and the business of blackmailing us, and you know that this matter of judges is getting

13:35 more and more serious day by day, when a good judge resigns and goes home, who was going

13:44 to become the Chief Justice after a few months, then you should have taken action at that

13:50 time, and even now, this request has been made again, that this judge should go, this

13:57 has happened, he is not worthy, this is not so and so, what is the joke?

14:02 Ordinary people cannot put pressure on judges, if you are accusing the state institutions

14:08 and accusing the judge, then it is a very serious matter, there should be an inquiry

14:14 that is more acceptable, that is, judges should be such that they cannot be pointed at, and

14:21 they should tell why this happened, and those who have done it, they should face the music,

14:27 then when the matter will be resolved, it will go very far, there are many experts here,

14:33 so don't worry.

14:34 Let's go, there is one thing, which Hassan was saying, that if someone is hurt, then

14:40 the way he is talking, Mr. Shaukat Siddiqui, the same time the matter happened with him,

14:45 he brought it to the media, but it was not brought individually here, it was brought together,

14:50 the audience will definitely tell you, it was brought after a year, see all these incidents,

14:55 it is almost a year, listen, listen, this matter was raised on May 10, 2023, in front of

15:00 the Chief Justice of Islamabad High Court, the judge is present with the same letter,

15:05 all the details are there, then the Chief Justice went to Pakistan, okay, listen, after that

15:10 he went to the Chief Justice, the former Chief Justice, at that time it is also said that

15:15 he met the current Chief Justice, so this issue has been highlighted for several months.

15:22 Mr. Haider Naqvi, what solution do you suggest, you have a very deep view in terms of suggesting

15:28 a solution, so how do you solve this matter, one good thing is that the full court has

15:33 already sat down, and all the senior judges of Pakistan, of the Supreme Court, are looking

15:38 at this matter, and we hope that a strong solution will be found from there, in your view, if

15:43 you look at it from a different angle, obviously some people are looking at it from a political

15:48 point of view.

15:49 Look, the first thing is that if the judges' allegations are correct, then I condemn it,

15:54 the second thing is that who will know better than a judge that when there is an allegation

16:00 or when there is a case, then both parties are heard, evidence is taken and a decision

16:06 is made on the basis of it, so in this matter, one party is the judge himself, the other

16:12 party, the institutions on which he is accusing, are those, they should also be heard, and

16:18 then with evidence, both parties should give their evidence and then a decision will be

16:23 made.

16:24 This is the solution of one thing, which I understand, there is no need to make a third

16:30 case, just two parties, the one on which you are accusing, give evidence against it, and

16:35 if you cannot give evidence against it, then it means that you are just accusing, and if

16:39 you have evidence, then what could be better than this, the Pakistani people should see

16:43 all this, this is one thing.

16:45 The second thing, a big thing happened in the last two days, it suddenly disappeared somewhere,

16:49 after that it was not mentioned, that was the agreement of agreement, there is no discussion

16:53 about it now.

16:54 The agreement of agreement is the biggest need of Pakistan at the moment, whether it is judges,

16:58 institutions, government, parliament, people on the streets, whatever it is, the common

17:03 people, the biggest shortcoming of all this is the communication gap, there is a lack of

17:09 dialogue between them, there is a lack of conversation between them, this agreement of agreement

17:14 is very important, this agreement of agreement, you can call it a dialogue reconciliation,

17:19 it is very important that all parties are heard, and after hearing all the parties, all the

17:24 decisions should be taken in front of the Pakistani people, on the basis of daily, we will get

17:30 such series, that someone said something, someone did something, someone wrote a letter,

17:36 someone put a blame, how long will this series go on, this is the answer of the Pakistani

17:42 people, I am the Pakistani people, I ask for an answer, how long will this series go on,

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