The Patriots Have Become NFL's WORST Team | Pats Interference - video Dailymotion

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Andrew breaks down why the Patriots are now the NFL's worst team, separates Mac's failures from Zappe against the Giants, covers all of his other film notes from Sunday's loss and then answers your mailbag questions about Bill Belichick, Jerod Mayo, the front office and more.  You can also listen and Subscribe to Pats Interference on iTunes, Spotify, Stitcher, and at CLNSMedia.com every Tuesday!  This episode of the Pats Interference Podcast is brought to you by Fanduel Sportsbook, the exclusive wagering parter of the CLNS Media NetworkRight now, NEW customers get ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTY DOLLARS in BONUS BETS with any winning FIVE DOLLAR MONEYLINE BET! So, visit https://FanDuel.com/BOSTON and kick off the NFL season. FanDuel, Official Partner of the NFL. 21+ and present in MA. Hope is here. First online real money wager only. $5 pregame moneyline wager required. First onlinereal money wager only. $10 first deposit required. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable bonus bets that expire 7 days after receipt. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. GamblingHelpLineMa.org or call (800)-327-5050 for 24/7 support. Play it smart from the start! GameSenseMA.com or call 1-800-GAM-1234.  ODDS-R! Ever wished you could navigate the betting field with the confidence of a pro? Enter OddsR. They're not a sportsbook, but they're the sports betting advisor you've always needed. It's like having a playbook for smarter bets right in your pocket. I've been absolutely loving the experience, and I think you will too. Especially since Pats Interference listeners get a 30-day free trial! Elevate your game day and join the smart betting revolution! Go get it at https://oddsr.com/pats !  Factor Meals! Head to https://FactorMeals.com/CALLAHAN50 and use CODE CALLAHAN50 to get 50% off. That’s code CALLAHAN50 at https://FactorMeals.com/CALLAHAN5 to get 50% off!  SeatGeek! Use code DREAMERSPRO for $20 off your first SeatGeek order! Visit SeatGeek.com when you checkout! With NFL, NBA and NHL seasons in full swing, you don’t want to miss out - SeatGeek has your tickets to every game!

Transcript

00:00 Because we might have seen the last of Mac Jones as a Patriots quarterback.

00:04 And I don't say that lightly.

00:05 I don't say that as anyone who gets any kind of joy, especially from all the reporting

00:09 I've done, which I'm not even talking about, you know, reporting that he was going to start

00:13 on Saturday night.

00:15 It's about the lack of faith in the locker room.

00:17 It's about his fall, how the Patriots have failed him, how he's failed them, because

00:21 this is a broken player.

00:23 And I wrote he was broken after the Saints loss.

00:26 That's when he first started to seriously lose confidence from the locker room.

00:30 But this is someone who is making hand signals and checks to receivers to change their routes.

00:35 Those receivers win on those routes, and he doesn't throw the ball because he panics.

00:41 There is a mental block here with him, not only just against pressure, and I'll give

00:44 you those numbers right now.

00:46 Five times he was pressured.

00:47 One of four, five yards, two picks.

00:51 And strip sack.

00:52 Can't happen.

00:53 Can't win like that.

00:54 Can't even compete like that.

00:55 That's why he got fenced again.

00:56 But it's the mere fact that when he drops back and has the ball, there's something off

01:01 with him.

01:02 And you can't, as I said, compete with that.

01:05 You can't inspire a locker room like that.

01:06 You can't live like that as an offense.

01:14 I told you so.

01:16 And I don't like that I told you so on the last episode of the Pats Interference podcast

01:20 brought to you by Vandal, the exclusive wagering partner of the CLS Media Network.

01:25 Because what I told you then was if the Patriots lost the Giants, they would be the worst team

01:30 in the league.

01:31 And here we are after a 10-7 loss because their rookie kicker couldn't hit a 35-yard

01:36 field goal for the second game in a row to tie it at the end of the Patriots' fall to

01:42 the NFL's worst team by point differential.

01:45 The only team in the league with a bottom six offense, bottom six defense, bottom six

01:49 special teams by DBOA, and an undrafted rookie who you know by now.

01:54 Allie just loves his chicken cutlets, old Jersey Italian family Tommy DeVito, but lives

02:00 at home, doesn't fold his laundry or cook his meals.

02:02 Oh, and again, couldn't win the starting job at Syracuse.

02:04 So that's what they're dealing with right now.

02:08 And I don't enjoy any of this because I would love to watch some good football.

02:12 I would love to talk to you about some great football.

02:14 I would love to spend most of my Monday breaking down a good football game with all the notes

02:18 and stats and breakdowns and play designs that again, we're going to get to because

02:21 that's what this podcast is about is bringing it to you, good, bad, or what we saw on Sunday.

02:26 The quarterbacks.

02:27 Yeah.

02:28 Okay, I promise we'll start with the good.

02:32 The good.

02:33 Christian Barmore, three pressures, including a sack, a couple of run stuff, a pass breakup.

02:39 This dude is in a mid-season breakout that, hey, maybe you saw coming.

02:42 I thought he would be pretty good this year, but not like this.

02:44 He is legitimately the best player in this defense.

02:47 And I say that as the guy who's somewhere at the front of the fake Jelani-Tavai train.

02:53 It's a very sad train.

02:54 It's very steady.

02:55 It's slow.

02:56 You're going to get there on time.

02:57 Might even surprise you, but no one's paying extra to be in club with that train.

03:01 Anyway, Barmore's ahead of Peppers.

03:03 He's ahead of Tavai.

03:04 He is having an outstanding season and making a case as someone that the Patriots defense

03:08 can build around starting next season.

03:11 Right behind him on Sunday, Anfernee Jennings, who I don't remember who asked me in the mail

03:16 back a couple of weeks ago, but was asking like, "Oh, is this a breakout?

03:19 Is he a real guy?

03:20 Is he just coming along?"

03:22 And my answer was like, "Look, you get enough snaps, you're going to run into a run stuff

03:26 or two, maybe a pressure."

03:28 So he's still just kind of a guy.

03:30 Well, on Sunday, he was a dude.

03:32 Four pressures, according to PFF.

03:35 I only had him down for three.

03:37 Again, in on the action for the run stuff.

03:39 He's the player that people were hoping, in a different way, very different player, that

03:43 Josh Uche was going to be in a contract year here, former 2020 pick, mid-round draft pick.

03:48 He's been better than solid.

03:50 He's been stout.

03:51 He's been someone you can rely on.

03:53 And as a defensive front that slowly took over this game, again, granted, against Tommy

03:56 DeVito in the worst offensive line in the NFL, Anfernee Jennings was a major part of

04:00 that in a way that you couldn't really say about Dietrich Weiss or Lawrence Guy or even

04:05 Devon Godshow.

04:06 So cheers to you, Anfernee Jennings.

04:10 Let's raise a stout to the stout, Anfernee Jennings, and a very good game for him on

04:14 Sunday because my answer from a couple of weeks ago, no longer valid.

04:18 He's been better than solid.

04:19 He's been a good, legitimately good player for this Patriots defense.

04:24 Last thing of the good, overall, again, the pass rush was there.

04:26 Six sacks.

04:27 Tommy DeVito kind of waited for them, in a way.

04:31 Half of the snaps in which he was pressured resulted in sacks.

04:33 He only had two completions on those 12 dropbacks where he felt a little bit of heat.

04:38 Pass, Patriots closed in.

04:39 You hold a team to 10 points.

04:41 I don't care who it is.

04:42 That's at least a decent day at the office, but maybe not as good as you might think.

04:47 On to the bad.

04:49 I'm still going to make you wait for the quarterbacks because I just said it last episode.

04:55 I think we're allowed to be tired of the topic.

04:57 We're going to get to it.

04:58 But the first one is JC Jackson because JC Jackson allowed three catches for 75 yards

05:05 according to my charting.

05:06 The PFF had him for six and over 100.

05:08 Again, I don't agree with that because they assign blame for every single completion to

05:13 one defender, even if you just happen to be nearby and it wasn't your fault or your particular

05:17 zone.

05:18 And so with JC, though, this is a guy who's just not sticking in man coverage anymore.

05:23 Hasn't all year.

05:25 And is in a rotation right now with Jonathan Jones and Sean Wade, who played on the outside.

05:30 He obviously left LA.

05:31 Very interesting week for JC Jackson.

05:33 The only interesting thing about Patriots Chargers coming up, but I digress.

05:39 He's he's a problem right now in the secondary.

05:41 And I think a better quarterback and a better receiving core would take advantage of him.

05:46 And Jalen Hyatt, rookie out of Tennessee, his beatster, had the first 100 yard game

05:50 for the Giants the last year and a half.

05:52 It came at JC Jackson's expense for the most part.

05:55 And that's something you can't have.

05:56 And you might have more issues with guys like Keenan Allen coming in only as according to

06:02 a Sunday night broadcast, the NFL record for average catches per game.

06:05 I think it's six and a half for his career.

06:09 It's going to be a problem.

06:10 And I would not be surprised if he I don't think it's benched, but he's a lot less playing

06:15 time because he could have given up a legitimate 100 receiving yards, not just according to

06:21 that, but on Sunday alone by himself.

06:23 If Tommy DeVito was able to deliver the ball downfield, he was not good.

06:26 OK, on the quarterbacks, Matt Jones, I'll just spoiler alert, is going to be safe for

06:31 we need to talk.

06:32 Bailey's happy.

06:33 I just.

06:34 He again, I love the confidence, but the fact of the matter is confidence when it comes

06:44 to Bailey's happy doesn't matter as far as he goes.

06:47 It's what Bill O'Brien believes or doesn't in him and very clearly does not believe in

06:51 Bailey's happy because as first noted by Zack Cox, friend of the podcast from Nessun, Bailey's

06:56 happy at nine completions in the air yards on those, the total amount of distance that

07:01 they covered ahead or behind the line of scrimmage, nine completions, negative four air yards.

07:08 This dude was limited to screens in a way that you were only give your kid like certain

07:16 juices like of all the drinks that you could pick from, not soda, not obviously booze,

07:20 not obviously anything else.

07:22 You're limiting a young infant to just you're going to be on this kind of formula or water

07:26 or OJ.

07:27 Like that's what Bill O'Brien was doing here for Billy's happy.

07:30 We're not going to mess around, let you pick and choose.

07:32 You are going to hand this and you are going to like it.

07:34 And he was throwing all of these passes in a way that was, this is the target.

07:38 He's going to be behind the line of scrimmage and that's it.

07:40 And a few times he did have a chance to look downfield.

07:43 Bailey's happy, uh, had love at first read and a couple of times that wasn't an issue,

07:48 but the one time that it was resulted in his interception, which you could have seen coming

07:53 from a mile away and then results and leads to the game winning eventually a field goal

07:59 for the giants.

08:00 And you just can't have that.

08:01 And we can talk about, Oh, he's a little more decisive up there.

08:03 There was actual chatter in the press box about, Oh, Billy's happy, a little more decisive.

08:07 And granted he led their only touchdown, right?

08:10 Lead quotes.

08:11 But when you look at the play calls and how they're structured and designed and how far

08:15 he's looking downfield, this is very clearly a coaching staff that not only refuse to start

08:20 him on Sunday after Mack Jones had been benched three times in 10 games, but a coach has set

08:25 the cut him, made him a healthy scratch on week six.

08:28 And then when he plays is handcuffing him to the most basic possible passing plan as

08:32 he goes nine to 14 for 54 yards and interception in that sack, his EPA per play, by the way,

08:38 same as Mac Jones.

08:39 So wherever you fall in this debate that no one should be having anymore, um, according

08:43 to the most advanced trusted stats that we have, he was just as bad.

08:46 But the reason we saved Mac Jones for, we need to talk is because we might've seen the

08:50 last of Mac Jones as a Patriots quarterback.

08:54 And I don't say that lightly.

08:55 I don't say that as anyone who gets any kind of joy, especially from all the reporting

08:59 I've done, which I'm not even talking about, you know, reporting that he was going to start

09:03 on Saturday night.

09:05 It's about the lack of faith in the locker room.

09:07 It's about his fall, how the Patriots have failed him, how he's failed them, because

09:11 this is a broken player.

09:14 And I wrote, he was broken after the saints loss.

09:16 That's when he first started to seriously lose confidence from the locker room.

09:20 But this is someone who is making hand signals and checks to receivers to change their routes.

09:25 Those receivers win on those routes and he doesn't throw the ball because he panics.

09:31 There is a mental block here with him, not only just against pressure, and I'll give

09:34 you those numbers right now.

09:36 Five times he was pressured one of four, five yards, two picks and strip sack can't have

09:43 it.

09:44 Can't win like that.

09:45 Can't even compete like that.

09:46 Can't get off the fence again.

09:47 But it's the mere fact that when he drops back and has the ball, there's something off

09:51 with him.

09:52 And you can't, as I said, compete with that.

09:55 You can't inspire a locker room like that.

09:56 You can't live like that as an offense.

09:59 And that's why, again, he drops back 21 times, 89 yards.

10:04 And when you combine his numbers with Bailey's, Abby, the Patriots average one more yard for

10:08 run play than they did drop back in the modern NFL.

10:12 He is a broken player and it's a broken environment around him and the worst receiving core and

10:17 the worst supporting cast.

10:19 But the reason the Patriots are 2-9 more than anything else is Mack Jones throwing games

10:25 away with these decisions.

10:27 He has on the season, found this out today, corner pro football focus, four more interceptions

10:32 a season than throwaways.

10:36 He has 15 more turnover-worthy plays where he's risking a turnover than he does throwaways.

10:43 And he could have avoided both picks if you look back.

10:45 The first one goes into triple coverage.

10:47 Just soared out of bounds.

10:49 Live to see another play.

10:50 Second and eight becomes third and eight instead of a touchdown for the Giants going the other

10:54 way.

10:55 Doesn't do it.

10:57 Second pick, lobbed into double coverage.

10:59 An improvement.

11:01 But also took points off the board for the Patriots because if he had just taken a sack,

11:06 they're still in field goal range.

11:07 And instead, he throws it up.

11:09 They go back the other way.

11:11 And that was actually the one that led to points, not the first one.

11:13 But I digress.

11:14 He's a broken player.

11:15 This is a terrible system, a terrible environment, just bad everything.

11:19 But when the guy holding the ball, the guy pulling the trigger, doesn't either trust

11:23 himself to do so or is aiming in the wrong direction or picks a target and then looks

11:27 elsewhere, what are you going to do?

11:29 And as a coach, as a player, as a fan, it's over.

11:32 It's been over.

11:34 And this, mercifully, in a way, you would hope is the end for him.

11:39 And the last thing I'll say is this, because I did the breakdown of Billy Zappi as far

11:42 as all the screens, more than half of Billy Zappi's completions were screens.

11:47 Bill O'Brien tried to build him back up.

11:49 Mack Jones.

11:50 Okay.

11:51 He had play-action passes on half of their first six first-down plays.

11:55 So he knows the Giants are expecting a run.

11:57 He knows the Giants like to blitz.

11:59 But here are neutral, first-in-ten situations.

12:02 We'll fake the run, open up space downfield.

12:04 You'll have a defined read.

12:05 This is your two or three-man route combinations.

12:08 That's it.

12:10 And Mack hit a screen for 19 yards.

12:11 Devontae Parker.

12:12 Great.

12:13 Hit a check down, a reminder.

12:14 Stevenson air-mailed a ball over Mike Kaczynski's head and then melted down.

12:19 So there were defined windows.

12:21 The play calling tried to build them up and make this happen, and you just couldn't do

12:25 it.

12:26 Now, do I think Bill O'Brien should have run the game plan?

12:28 We talked about last week, the old Buffalo windstorm plan.

12:31 Yes, yes, I do.

12:32 Because there's a way to still help the rest of the offense, and they didn't do it when

12:38 Bill O'Brien was actually calling 79% of their first-down plays with Mack Jones were passes.

12:43 Now, the success rate on those was about the same as the run calls, but I just think you

12:48 had a better chance.

12:49 Again, I'll say it for a third time.

12:50 The offense averaged a full yard more per run play than drop back.

12:54 And if you had leaned a little bit more into that, I don't think you had as much danger

12:59 as they did with quarterbacks, because it's the worst quarterbacks room in the league,

13:02 it's the worst offense in the league, and it is now the worst team.

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14:34 Okay, let's move on, shall we?

14:41 What would NFL film say?

14:46 Well, first of all, Matt comes back, because that's the big question.

14:49 They go out of the bye, did the time away do you some well?

14:53 I bet they throw in that 19-yard screen to Devontae Parker.

14:57 But then here comes the interception, and then there goes the sack.

15:00 And then we're right to the second half, boom, Bailey Zappi trots out, solely marches down.

15:04 Completion, completion, get in their screens.

15:06 And then Ramondre Stevenson rumbles seven yards for a touchdown.

15:09 All right, Patriots are back in business.

15:10 Well, not so fast.

15:12 Zappi pick, missed field goal at the end.

15:15 Belichick walks off the field, podium, boom.

15:17 The whole segment in this hour-long documentary about the Patriots is maybe 15, 20 seconds.

15:23 And that's it, because God knows we don't want to watch the NFL version of the boy in

15:28 the white pajamas much longer.

15:31 One quick note before we get to mailbag here.

15:33 I would not expect DeMario Douglas, who told me after the game that he did not have a concussion,

15:40 was doing okay.

15:41 I would not expect him to be a full participant in practice on Wednesday, little nugget there

15:44 for you.

15:45 Speaking of the locker room, because I had this written down and I wanted to share this

15:48 with you, it got a little traction on Twitter, but this just captures the state of the locker

15:54 room and the state of the team.

15:55 We could talk about all the numbers I just gave you, the state of the quarterback room,

15:59 how it's dragging down the rest of the offense, but they're two and nine.

16:03 There's no one way that they win.

16:05 And if there was one way, a defining strength, just something that paves the way for the

16:09 Patriots to stumble their way to victory, you would argue it's the defense.

16:13 Well, even the defenders, no, that's not the case.

16:18 Because here's Adrian Phillips to me after the game, "We gave up 10 points and lost the

16:23 game two weeks in a row.

16:24 So now we've got to give up zero, whatever we can do to get our offense the ball back

16:28 and get a chance to win.

16:29 If 10 ain't enough, then we got to bet a thousand and give up zero."

16:34 Yeah.

16:35 All right.

16:36 On to the mailbag.

16:38 So let's see, like I said, over 10, we're going to try to breeze through a couple and

16:42 I'm going to take more with a few, one of which right off the top, Magic8Bill.

16:46 I think the first time writer, I don't want to say that, first time mailer.

16:53 His question, regardless, "With the Panthers firing Frank Reich, do you think Belichick

16:58 will be on their radar?

16:59 If not, then who?"

17:01 So I threw out Belichick to the Panthers as a possibility on TV a couple of weeks ago.

17:06 And I said it was a sleeper because you don't see first year coaches fired.

17:10 Well, lo and behold, David Tepper, who bought the Panthers 2018, I think sometime around

17:16 then, has had six head coaches, including interims, now since then.

17:20 Six years, six head coaches.

17:23 And I do believe that he would place a call to Bill Belichick because he's looking for

17:27 something that's solid that he hasn't found yet.

17:29 And I don't think he knows what he's looking for or has a proper framework or expectation

17:33 of what success looks like in the NFL or how you come about it.

17:37 Because again, he's firing guys 11 games in.

17:39 Poor Frank Reich has been fired twice in the last 385 days.

17:43 But anyway, I don't think Belichick takes that job.

17:45 I don't think he wants to do anything with an owner who's out of touch in the way that

17:49 David Tepper appears to be.

17:50 So who else is on the list that might say yes?

17:54 Jim Harbaugh, that's for sure.

17:56 And it's not only just because of all the trouble at Michigan, but in doing some reporting

18:00 around the Raiders situation a couple of years ago when Josh McDaniels left and Dave Ziegler

18:04 goes, I found out that all the noise that was going out there in Las Vegas about Jim

18:09 Harbaugh going to come to the Raiders, a whole lot of hooey, nothing.

18:13 It sounded like that was coming from Harbaugh's agent or his camp.

18:17 And there was never any real interest there in the part of Las Vegas.

18:20 So who knows what happens with the Raiders now.

18:23 But Harbaugh's stuck is up.

18:24 He has been looking to come to the NFL for years.

18:26 Michigan now has pretty good reason to part ways, find somebody else if they can.

18:31 And so I would think Tepper, who seemingly has made this about the quarterback, a quarterback

18:36 he supposedly drafted, by the way, it sounded like Frank Reich wanted C.J. Stroud.

18:39 And that's not a, oh, now they tell us, make me look good on the way out as I'm getting

18:44 kicked out of the building.

18:45 No, no, no, no.

18:46 We heard this.

18:47 C.J. Stroud was the betting favorite at our friends at FanDuel back before the draft.

18:51 But anyway, Tepper is going to want someone to develop Bryce Young, Jim Harbaugh, known

18:56 developer of quarterbacks.

18:58 And I'll give you one more name, though I think he withdrew last year from the head

19:02 coaching search, just like Gerard Mayo does.

19:05 And what does that say if Gerard Mayo pulls his name out from a head coaching search,

19:10 a head coaching search in the NFL, only 32 jobs like this in the entire world, to come

19:15 back and be an assistant for an eventual 2-9 football team?

19:18 Again, granted, none of us expected this.

19:21 And that decision was absolutely right on the money because of how insane it is in Carolina.

19:25 Anyway, I have to throw out Ben Johnson because I think I am contractually obligated as an

19:30 NFL beat writer to throw out Ben Johnson.

19:33 I think if the toilet breaks tomorrow and my wife asks for a couple of names of a repairman,

19:38 I think I have to say Ben Johnson because that's what every writer is doing right now.

19:42 For any kind of job that's available or comes up, oh, Ben Johnson, give him a call, the

19:45 Lions' offense coordinator.

19:46 So there are two names right there.

19:49 Anyway, Jordan is asking, not about my toilet or repairman.

19:54 He wants to know, at what point did it all go wrong?

19:57 Getting rid of Tom?

19:58 I am Patricia's offensive coordinator.

20:00 But wouldn't you love Matt Patricia back right now?

20:03 I wouldn't, for the record.

20:05 The failed drafts of 2017 and picking Tony Michel and Nikhil Harry.

20:10 So I hate to tell it to you, Jordan.

20:12 It's not been one point.

20:14 It's been a series of points and years and drafts and coaching changes and front office

20:20 failures and bad for agencies and lack of spending.

20:23 And yes, the inexplicable inability to have a succession plan for Tom Brady.

20:30 Also Gronk, which gets lost.

20:32 Patriots had the worst tight end room in 2019 and then 2020 because they thought throwing

20:37 two third round picks from the worst tight end class, as draft picks were telling you

20:41 at the time, would somehow solve that.

20:43 It did not.

20:44 Anyway, it's been bad process.

20:46 It's been roster rot, as I put it in my column from Sunday after that loss in mismanagement

20:51 and Belichick not updating his views about what you need to win, I believe, in the modern

20:55 NFL, because it's either overconfidence or arrogance on his part that he can make chicken

21:03 salad out of anything when it comes to NFL talent.

21:06 Or you don't need to place a premium on the receiver position, even though we've seen

21:11 you go down to countless examples.

21:14 Young quarterbacks or rookie contracts take off with veteran receivers and the difference

21:18 that a Stefan Diggs makes or an A.J. Brown makes when you bring them into that kind of

21:23 environment.

21:24 We've talked about this before.

21:25 It's not just that the player can win one on one.

21:27 It's good to have good players.

21:28 We all know this.

21:29 It's the gravity that that receiver carries.

21:31 When you know a Bill Belichick in the opposite sideline or pick your defensive coordinator

21:35 says, OK, when A.J. Brown is a weak side receiver on third and eight or any time in the red

21:39 zone, we're doubling them.

21:42 As an offense, and we saw this in Vegas, the only offense worse than the Patriots at the

21:45 time or living living in the same level guard level at the time, week six, McDaniels knew

21:50 that's how the Patriots would operate with Devante Adams.

21:52 And they targeted other receivers like Jacobi Myers and Trey.

21:56 I forgot his name.

21:58 Rookie speeds or fourth or fifth rounder out of Cincinnati.

22:01 Anyway, they leverage that against them because Devante Adams gravity created these holes

22:05 in the coverage and the team capitalized.

22:06 The Patriots say gravity doesn't exist.

22:09 Isaac Newton's bullshit.

22:11 We don't need a receiver.

22:12 It's not a big deal.

22:13 And so all of those decisions in the framework and the philosophy have been bad.

22:17 But we're going to get a little bit more to the front office with a later question.

22:21 One of my favorites of the season.

22:23 So I again, I hate to break it to you, but it's just been a very slow decline of walking

22:27 down the stairs from being at the top, holding the Lombardi down at the bottom, looking again

22:32 up at the rest of the league right now at two and nine.

22:35 And if you're missing tomorrow, Douglas, we'll talk about gravity.

22:37 It's the only guy in offense right now that is any to him when facing an opposing defense.

22:42 Moving on, Caleb quote.

22:45 Hey, Andrew, I've been wondering what we know about Gerard Mayo from a coaching standpoint.

22:49 What does he like for his philosophies, etc?

22:51 I just worry that he's going to be a mini Bill Belichick.

22:54 Hopefully he cares more about offense.

22:56 So I do want to crack one thing that I just said or address, tweak, whatever.

23:02 It's not that Belichick doesn't care about the offense.

23:04 I think his views on investment on that area are a little antiquated because it's not a

23:10 broad brush.

23:11 He doesn't care.

23:12 He spends all his draft picks on defense.

23:14 No, no, no.

23:15 The Patriots over the last 10 years, and I've said this before, if you're a long-time listener,

23:19 their average ranking and cash spending on offensive players is 14th in the league.

23:26 The last 10 years, their single season ranking, they've averaged 14th in offensive spending.

23:31 On defense, their average ranking and cash spending over the last 10 years, also 14th.

23:37 So that is a dead even split.

23:39 And we could go down to the first round picks.

23:40 We heard from some of them, Sonny Mischel, Isaiah Wynn, Nikhil Harry, Matt Jones, Cole

23:46 Strange.

23:47 They invest in the offense.

23:48 They just stink at it.

23:50 Like it is all time failures in the offensive department.

23:54 But this is not, like, it's just like such a primitive caveman tape that I do hear from

24:00 some colleagues.

24:01 We all have bad takes.

24:02 I'm not out here to police everybody else.

24:04 But if the thinking is, "Oh, Belichick is a defensive coach.

24:07 He only cares about that side.

24:08 That's how he came up."

24:09 What are we doing?

24:10 Did you miss the spending spree of 2021?

24:13 All the draft picks I just mentioned?

24:14 Hell, 2007 with that offseason, if you want to go really far back, the offensive lineman

24:19 he's drafted, Nate Solder, Logan Mankins, like all this different stuff.

24:22 There are countless examples.

24:23 But the spending numbers I just gave you say it all.

24:25 They're a balanced team.

24:26 They just stink at scouting the offensive side.

24:28 Anyway, it's not that he doesn't care.

24:30 He's just bad at it.

24:31 Jerron Mayo, which is what you really wanted to know about.

24:36 He is a personable guy.

24:39 He is a player's coach.

24:40 He is hard and demanding.

24:41 He has made himself in many ways in the mold of Belichick.

24:45 And I think that rubs off in positive ways where he's very cerebral, dedicated, hardworking,

24:51 natural leader.

24:53 And in some ways that I've heard this year, and not in any kind of serious I would report

24:57 this, but this is my podcast.

24:58 If you're listening, I'll tell you that people who are loosely connected to the building

25:02 would say, it's just you worry that he's stepping in maybe a year or two early.

25:07 And it's not just, hey, you need to, you can only apply for this job if you've had X years

25:12 of experience, like you would find this on Indeed or something and everyone else, no

25:15 need to apply.

25:17 It's just the attitude.

25:18 And then what I heard was maturity, which again, I'm not reporting using any of that,

25:23 but they do.

25:24 That comes along with being a head coach in that position and how you respond and deal

25:27 with certain responsibilities in a way that you know how Belichick's going to react.

25:30 Hell, this is the season from hell.

25:31 And I know how he's going to be at the press conference and the team meetings.

25:34 I was going to handle everything because that's just how he is.

25:37 He's old.

25:38 Maybe there's some immaturity in there, but the point stands that there's a little more

25:42 unknown there.

25:43 But as far as players go, as far as his X's and O's, as far as his command of the room

25:48 and his work ethic, yeah, it's everything that it's supposedly been made out to be.

25:53 It's just an unknown with that head coaching job because it's a big, big leap.

25:56 And I don't care that he hasn't called defense a place.

25:59 I mean, that's something that just does not translate.

26:01 I made the analogy before.

26:03 The head coaches of any football team, they're the principals of your school.

26:07 Okay.

26:08 They're the front facing highest ranking people in this organization.

26:12 But the people doing the actual coaching, the hands-on work that generally leads to

26:16 the development of students, or in this case, players, are your professors, are your assistants.

26:22 Department heads can be your coordinators, take that analogy or throw it in the trash

26:25 if you want.

26:26 Whatever you want to do with it.

26:27 But that's the point here.

26:28 So how does he go from that office as department head of the defense to the principal chair?

26:34 Because it's a lot more.

26:36 You get a lot of students acting out.

26:39 You got a lot more parent phone calls, like dealing with agents.

26:41 It's a whole different deal.

26:43 He's long believed, I will say this, and this will be the last comment, that he's ready

26:46 for this role.

26:47 He said it two years ago on the record with reporters.

26:51 And hell, got an interview from the Eagles.

26:53 Good for him.

26:54 He's got an interview with the Broncos and Raiders.

26:56 But how many coaches, if you didn't know him, and I get that he played in the league, that

27:00 carries a lot of equity in the locker room.

27:02 How many coaches, if they had three years of not just NFL, but coaching, college, high

27:07 school, whatever experience, after three years, say I'm fit to be a head coach?

27:11 Would you believe him?

27:13 Would you feel confident in that person?

27:15 Because now he's in year five and he feels the same way.

27:19 He's been emboldened by ownership and the situation here.

27:22 There's a good enough chance where I think there are some people that go, I don't know

27:25 how this is going to go.

27:26 And hey, you deserve some leeway.

27:27 First year head coach, first year anything.

27:29 You deserve time to develop and grow into that.

27:31 But that's where I think the concern is.

27:33 It's not just the inexperience.

27:36 It's kind of the mindset and approach that comes along with that.

27:38 All right.

27:39 Cheeseburger Posse, welcome back.

27:41 Haven't heard from you in a little bit.

27:42 Quote, does Bill get the ax prior to the end of the season if they keep losing in this

27:46 fashion?

27:47 No.

27:48 I would be shocked.

27:49 I would be floored.

27:51 And I've said this before that I think it comes down to a respect between Belichick

27:56 and the Crafts.

27:57 They understand what they built.

27:58 I mean, this goes beyond six Super Bowl trophies, the greatest 20 year run in NFL history.

28:04 This is about each of their legacies.

28:06 This is about a small economy around Foxboro.

28:09 This is about the Patriots becoming one of the most valuable franchises in sports anywhere

28:15 in the globe.

28:16 OK.

28:17 And everything that they've accomplished together.

28:19 And so to be fired like Frank Reich was today with a tweet from the Panthers and three or

28:25 four sentences with Robert Craft's name now at the bottom of the Patriots did this just

28:30 would be very disrespectful of if not the greatest, one of the greatest head coaches

28:35 of all time and everything he's done leading up to this point.

28:38 And it's been a lot of negativity.

28:39 And I've covered it and been as critical of him as anyone.

28:43 But I think it would be the wrong move.

28:45 I don't think it happens.

28:47 He's doing what he believes is best, even if we can point out that he's wrong at a lot

28:50 of times and is making a mess as far as the quarterback situation goes.

28:53 It was just wrong.

28:56 And honestly, that sin is not enough to erase everything that's happened or make you motivated

29:02 to can a guy with now what six games left.

29:04 And if you want to get dry mayo head start, I just don't think the experience you would

29:08 gain dealing with a losing locker room that's out of playoff contention in any way helps

29:13 him set a foundation for years to come, knowing he'll reshuffle the staff in his own image.

29:18 I mean, heck, guy who stepped in in Carolina fired Josh McCown and do Staley because they

29:23 were Frank Reich loyalists.

29:25 So I just don't think that's any kind of experience that would help drive me out when you're one

29:29 or you're two or three.

29:30 And if it does, that means you're two and nine.

29:32 And that means he's probably not long for that job anyway in the coming year.

29:35 So no, I don't think I don't think it happens.

29:38 Gary, speaking of Bill, Gary's asking, quote, Is there any difference in Bill's trade value

29:42 if he steps away from the team that's in quotes tomorrow versus finishes two and 15 or does

29:48 it not matter?

29:49 Great question.

29:51 I wish I had an answer because the only people that know that answer are those who are interested

29:58 in Bill Belichick.

29:59 And we've explored the possibilities is in Washington.

30:02 Could it be the Giants again, even though the Giants beat them?

30:06 Carolina again, I would take off the table.

30:07 The Chargers the same deal.

30:08 What about the Bears?

30:09 The only thing right now is you record on Monday night.

30:12 And it's tough to know because the David Tepper example is another great one.

30:17 And I don't say this because I cover the league and you like to think of yourself this way,

30:22 but you hear people who Dominique Foxworth, for example, works for ESPN, used to be DB

30:26 for the Broncos, Ravens or Velvins.

30:28 So when he was negotiating the CBA across the table from these owners, I think it was

30:34 2011, realized very quickly in talking to Jerry Jones that, hey, these billionaire owners

30:39 might be.

30:42 Exponentially more rich than I am, but they're not smarter than I am, only just because a

30:47 lot of them inherited their fortune and wealth.

30:50 And so the point being that you might think that bringing in Bill Belichick after two

30:54 and 15 season might not be a good idea.

30:57 And you probably are right.

30:58 I would agree with you at this point.

31:00 That's how it goes.

31:01 That owner might not agree with you because they believe overly in themselves or Bill

31:06 Belichick or what the benefits of bringing Belichick at the stage of his career would

31:10 be.

31:11 And so I wish I knew.

31:14 I do think there should be a material difference in a guy who finishes seven and ten, six and

31:19 eleven, five and twelve versus two and fifteen, because there have been no coaches in his

31:25 tier, the Landers, Chuck Knowles, Bill Walsh, Don Shula, who had it this bad at the end.

31:34 Does that say more about Belichick?

31:35 Is it bad luck?

31:36 Is it say more about the GM or coach?

31:39 I don't know.

31:40 The only people who do know it and might have interest in him and maybe none of them do.

31:43 Maybe we've all been so worked up and Dan Orlovsky is full of crap and we don't know

31:46 Belichick picked a destination.

31:49 He just missed it today.

31:50 He said that's ridiculous, which Bill is known to gaslight the media by extension fan base.

31:54 But we don't know.

31:56 I would love to know.

31:57 And it's a really great question because I do think there will be a change, but it's

32:00 just it's just a theory.

32:02 Ashley, what's up?

32:04 Hi, Andrew, who is your current MVP of the Patriots and who is your biggest disappointment?

32:08 MVP is maybe the saddest question that we've had and not that it's a bad one.

32:14 Actually, I did midseason MVP a couple of weeks ago.

32:18 Kendrick Bourne was my answer then, even after he got injured at Miami, because you just

32:22 we talk about gravity.

32:23 The hell are you throwing to?

32:24 What do you trust?

32:25 You can play in the slot and play outside.

32:28 And it's been too long now that Kendrick's been out to name him again.

32:32 So I think I would go to drill peppers.

32:34 And not only just from him having a career statistically, a fumble recovery against the

32:38 Giants, his former team, but interceptions, forced fumbles, sack actually doesn't have

32:45 an interception, but has a forced fumble sacked the leadership inside there and has been playing

32:49 steadily like Adrian Phillips, whose quote I read off earlier has been just kicked to

32:53 the side of the road, not playing anymore.

32:54 And that's a guy who's been a key cog of this defense the last three years gone.

32:59 And dribble peppers has made him expendable in a way because he's having a career and

33:03 establishing himself and really fulfilling.

33:05 I mean, I don't know what you would think of this guy played like this, you know, eight,

33:09 nine years in the league.

33:10 That's probably worth the first round pick investment that Cleveland made in him all

33:14 those years ago.

33:15 So I think it's peppers right now.

33:17 I don't think you have any good options.

33:18 Disappointing.

33:19 I think it's got to go to Juju because of contract.

33:24 His history as a player.

33:25 I wrote about it after the opener.

33:27 The Patriots knew they had damaged goods and didn't count them among their top five pass

33:31 catchers.

33:33 And it's mostly injury related, but not entirely injury related.

33:37 And the fact of the matter is the guy has fewer than 200 yards on the season and we're

33:41 heading into, what is it, week 13.

33:44 It kind of says it all.

33:47 Honorable mention though, dishonorable mention, Josh, you check two sacks, four quarterback

33:52 hits, nine games, only playing 26% of the snaps.

33:55 As I said at the top, Anthony Jennings is having the impact, carrying it in a very different

33:59 way.

34:00 We expected from Muche.

34:01 It's just not been there.

34:02 The guy going into a contract here who's some advanced numbers are still pretty damn good.

34:08 It's just not having the impact.

34:09 He's not, this is the best way to put it, driving winning in a way that he did last

34:15 year.

34:16 And that's a, it's a bummer for him.

34:18 It's a bummer for the Patriots.

34:19 All right.

34:20 Mace.

34:21 This is one of my favorites.

34:24 And I don't, I don't think he knows what he's about to trigger, but here we go.

34:28 Quote, what's up with Nick Casario leaving and seemingly with all forward thinking football

34:34 philosophy.

34:35 Let me start over.

34:37 Quote, what's up with Nick Casario leaving and seemingly all forward thinking football

34:41 philosophy leaving with him.

34:44 Well, Mace, first of all, welcome to the party.

34:49 So when I first read this question, my mind went back to 2020 where none of us want to

34:54 spend any more time.

34:56 But in that year, maybe it was early 2021, I was at home sitting in my kitchen counter

35:01 and not dressed close and watching Nick speak during the Sloan sports analytic conference

35:07 put on by MIT.

35:08 This was all virtual.

35:09 Of course, Kevin Clark, friend of the podcast, formerly of the ringer now to ESPN was running

35:14 a panel where it was Casario, Kevin Demoff, the president of the Rams and somebody else.

35:20 I'm forgetting right now.

35:21 Maybe it was just the two of them speaking about analytics.

35:23 And so I was very curious because Nick had just left New England to go to Houston and

35:28 supposedly as he put it, take all forward thinking with him.

35:31 First of all, it's not true, but Casario was so open and when you could tell that he was

35:36 no longer working for the Patriots, just based on this panel alone, because he shared things

35:42 like the Patriots had recently developed a model to help identify traits at a particular

35:46 position to see what made the most successful players in the league at this position, the

35:52 most successful players at that position.

35:54 And so they ran through players with different data points, like height, weight, arm length,

35:58 all this different stuff.

35:59 And so I wrote a story on this.

36:00 It was great how the Patriots incorporate analytics.

36:02 And I'm reading through it again here today in preparation for the podcast.

36:06 And it not only strikes me that I've since written and talking to people who have also

36:11 left the front office about their use of analytics and people currently with the team.

36:14 And they say, yeah, we really don't do anything.

36:16 Patriots don't do much.

36:17 That probably overstated how the Patriots incorporate analytics.

36:20 But this part was interesting.

36:21 "Among the team's findings," Casario said, "was that widely held beliefs about height

36:25 and arm length being vital to success at this position were unfounded.

36:29 There was no correlation between those traits and pro production."

36:32 Casario said, "Some of our best players, they didn't have the requisite quote unquote length,

36:37 but they were some of our best players."

36:39 Later, this is specific to the draft, he said, "I don't want to say the 40 is like the least

36:44 important number, but quite frankly, it might be the least important number specific to

36:49 certain positions."

36:50 And so all of this is to say that at one time, the Patriots did use and build models.

36:56 And in researching a story that I co-wrote with Doug Codd last month about Max Fall from

37:01 promising starting quarterback, alternate at the Pro Bowl to a completely lost player.

37:05 And this was six weeks ago.

37:08 Found out that at one point, the Patriots did build these models like Nick is describing

37:12 for the draft.

37:13 And they use models to identify free agents.

37:16 And one of those models identified a player who was, I'll just put it like this, their

37:21 leading player at an offensive position where they really needed help that particular offseason.

37:28 And that's a success.

37:30 You unearth someone who led you at a particular position, I'll say in the last five years.

37:35 And then they just kind of scrapped the model.

37:38 And that was it.

37:40 And so when you hear me read that quote from Nick Serio, "I don't want to say the 40 is

37:44 like the least important number, but it might be."

37:47 And then he leaves and two years later, you draft Tyquan Thornton, who had the best 40

37:51 at the draft and not much else to speak for when it came to production in college or his

37:56 three cone or anything else.

37:58 And then he plays like he does.

37:59 I think that says it all about the Patriots' lack of use of analytics.

38:03 Because in speaking with people who have left the front office and work for other teams

38:07 and people who just work for other teams, period, I had one person read off their emails

38:11 to me of the data they were collecting as they were preparing for the draft down to

38:14 just such minute detail.

38:16 And the thing is the Patriots do incorporate a little bit, but not as much as Serio is

38:20 doing right now in Houston, I'll say that.

38:22 Not as much as other teams are doing.

38:24 Like it's virtually nothing in Foxborough.

38:27 And that's part where, you know, I talk about Belichick not adapting to the times.

38:31 That is probably the most concrete example, even if it's sounding pretty nebulous.

38:35 And there's a reason you have to talk in generalities here, because you're not trying to give away

38:39 people that you talk to or the teams or whatever it might be.

38:42 But the point is, in hearing and rereading that story from 2020, Cacerio's advanced what

38:49 the Patriots did in a way that I don't think is happening right now.

38:52 And I've been told is not happening right now in Foxborough.

38:55 And so it wasn't just a Nick Cacerio thing.

38:57 It wasn't, you know, Dave Ziegler left a year after.

39:00 I don't know how much impact he had in his one single year, though.

39:02 They had they got more collaborative is what I heard.

39:04 And Matt Groh was a part of that process.

39:06 But I don't know how much they've advanced that since, because I know Belichick loved

39:09 Matt Groh. And I know Matt Groh thinks a lot like Belichick, because he was basically raised

39:12 in that building and that organization when he was a kid in the mid 90s.

39:16 And his dad, Al Groh, was on the same staff as Belichick and Parcells and the whole crew.

39:20 And so it's just a lot of circular thinking, the lack of diversity of thought.

39:25 And so it didn't all lead with Cacerio.

39:27 But there certainly is an issue there.

39:29 When they've tried the models and they've had some success, it kind of ditched them anyway.

39:34 All right, let's leave that there. Z.C.

39:38 is a quick one. "Are you ready for the pass to write it back with Belichick and Jimmy G?

39:42 This team has got my hopes up way too much for me to be convinced that sweeping change is coming."

39:47 No, I'm not. It's not going to happen.

39:50 If it does, I will print out that tweet and I will eat it here on the podcast.

39:55 That is not a new bet. People eat tweets, have eaten tweets.

39:59 I don't want to eat the tweet, but we will do it.

40:01 We will live stream it and I will. We'll find one of those.

40:05 What are they, ghost peppers? Yeah, we'll wrap it with a ghost pepper and you'll watch me eat this on YouTube live.

40:10 As all my family never talks to me again. If that happens, it's just you can't.

40:14 It won't. Mark, this is not uncle-in-law Mark.

40:18 Shout out, listener, loyal listener to the podcast. Different Mark.

40:22 So uncle-in-law Mark, feel free to ask a question anytime. Quote, other Mark.

40:28 "Do you think Kraft goes outside the family for a new GM or sticks with someone who has been or is currently in the organization?

40:34 Two, odds are Kraft does something like hire Mayo as head coach, keep O'Brien as the OC and make someone like Elliot Wolfe or another former Patriot executive as the GM."

40:43 So I think this was two weeks ago, maybe three.

40:47 We addressed this. I'll reiterate the cliff notes of what I said then.

40:51 I think Kraft stays inside. Right now, Mayo is the odds on favorite to stay as a GM.

40:57 I do believe Bill O'Brien, who just signed a contract, just got here, is going to stay.

41:01 He got here because of ownership.

41:03 Belichick approved the move. But you hear since that Belichick might have wanted to stay with Matt Patricia.

41:10 I think the both of them say stay if I had to bet.

41:13 And Elliot Wolfe is a good name because it's not only that he's in the building now.

41:18 But it's that like guys who's head coach in Tampa, Jason Light, Dave Ziegler,

41:25 Elliot Wolfe, started their careers elsewhere, or at least spent significant portions,

41:29 and in Elliot's case, most of their career in other front offices.

41:32 So they were not groomed in a way that, as we just described, you get this kind of circular thinking for the Patriots or things that default go back to Belichick.

41:40 It's not that they're all yes men. They'll have debates in the front office.

41:42 They do on the coaching staff. They do everywhere.

41:44 But you're coming from the same place.

41:46 You think in a similar way. Elliot does not.

41:49 Elliot's experience has been highly valuable to Belichick, and particularly dealing with negotiations and free agency in a way that they've tried to wean,

41:56 as I understand it, Mac Rowe onto some of those deals.

41:59 One of the first ones he did, I think, was resigning Brian Hoyer two years ago, like easy layup, two years, five million dollars, just give it to him kind of deals.

42:06 And so Elliot started in Green Bay where his dad, Ron Wolfe, Hall of Famer, I think, architect the Super Bowl teams there for the Packers,

42:15 grew up under him, didn't get the job on the Herod Bright and Guttekunst a number of years ago.

42:20 And so he left Cleveland a year or two and then has since been in New England.

42:23 So my point is, Elliot is not only someone in the family, but he's someone who could bring outside perspective and has the connections and the experience

42:31 and has proven himself to even earn a fancy new title, director of scouting, whether it was this year or last, I don't remember.

42:37 But it is a good name to know. As far as who that GM will be, I don't know.

42:41 But I do think they will have to be in lockstep with Mayo right now, considering he's, in my opinion, the favorite with Bill O'Brien staying.

42:49 And they just they try to tweak and modernize and upgrade the foundation that Belichick laid for 24 years.

42:56 And they want to keep that system in place, just update it.

43:00 Last one, I don't know why I say this for the last one, it really shouldn't have been.

43:04 No offense to Mac Jones, tank commander. Why didn't Jarrett Stidham get a chance to start 2020?

43:12 He did. He did. And Cam Newton beat him out.

43:14 And I saw it with my own two eyes in multiple training camp practices.

43:19 And you might not like that answer. It was closer than Mac Jones versus Billy Zappy.

43:24 A lot more fun as much as that season, much like this one kind of sunk.

43:28 But hey, those Patriots finished seven to nine and we all got on camp for throwing balls in the dirt and whatever.

43:33 But he had a way of powering that run game that neither of these guys are doing right now.

43:39 Jarrett Stidham couldn't. And even though Stidham, you know, had a really nice start to his rookie year,

43:45 his first training camp, which only matters so much, and had a year in the system, it just it just never came together.

43:50 And frankly, it didn't in Vegas. And now he's in Denver.

43:53 And Sean Payton really likes him, gave him a big new contract, but he didn't exactly take over for Russell Wilson.

43:58 And I don't think Russell Wilson is turning back the clock a whole lot out there in Denver.

44:01 So anyway, you got a shot. It didn't happen. Sometimes that's how life goes.

44:05 And especially for fourth round quarterbacks like I. Anyway, spending way too much time here with this question.

44:11 But thank you for asking. Thank you to everyone for asking those questions as always.

44:15 And we stalled out on this. So I'm going to ask you something more.

44:17 Please go to Apple, write a review, leave a five star rating, four star if you must.

44:23 Just give us some feedback. We want to grow. The Patriots have slowed.

44:27 Keep this going. We're advertising better reach more on YouTube, leaving comments.

44:32 Any suggestions there? I've tried to slow it down a little bit. I know I speak quickly.

44:35 I'm from New England, just like you. Maybe there's a little ADHD there.

44:41 Anyway, you've heard that probably five examples here in the podcast alone.

44:44 But please leave us a rating, review, any kind of detail, any help to keep us growing.

44:48 We really appreciate the support this season, even though the season has stunk.

44:51 And I will tell you this week, I think you're going to be absolutely jacked for what we have coming.

44:58 I'll just tell you. The Ringer's Danny Kelly is coming back and we are talking big time quarterback prospects.

45:05 Kaleb Williams, Drake May. We'll have a little mention of Jaden Daniels from LSU.

45:11 You want to know about Michael Penix or JJ McCarthy from Michigan?

45:15 You're going to find out because Danny is going to give us at least 35, 40 minutes of his time.

45:18 And then somehow I'm just going to squeeze into five minutes Patriots Chargers preview because you know what?

45:23 Someone has to. And that's what we're going to do.

45:25 Here on Pat's Interference, brought to you by FanDuel, exclusive wagering partner of the CNS Media Network.

45:29 Thank you for hanging out. Thank you for listening to 45 plus minutes on the worst game ever.

45:34 And again, always for your mailback questions.

45:37 Rate and review. Thank you.

45:40 [Outro Music]

The Patriots Have Become NFL's WORST Team | Pats Interference

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